Why ___ Lost: Survivor 47 Ep 11

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_01]: If you lost Survivor and you're feeling down, David and Jessica will turn it around.

[00:00:07] [SPEAKER_01]: They'll break down the rules and they'll show you how. You played yourself and got voted out.

[00:00:15] [SPEAKER_01]: This is why blank lost. This is why blank lost. Baby, this is why blank lost.

[00:00:32] [SPEAKER_04]: Welcome back to Why Blank Lost. I'm David Bloomberg and I hope those of you who are celebrating

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_04]: Thanksgiving the past few days had a great one. From the sound of things, Kyle has a great many

[00:00:42] [SPEAKER_04]: things to be thankful for in his life. But the outcome of this week's vote was not one of them.

[00:00:48] [SPEAKER_04]: I, however, am thankful to be joined as always by my co-host Jessica Lewis.

[00:00:54] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I am here. I am back. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to celebrate Thanksgiving

[00:00:58] [SPEAKER_02]: the way that I had intended due to the weather. So unfortunately for myself and my family, we were

[00:01:05] [SPEAKER_02]: not together on the holiday. However, we did FaceTime and that was lovely, but I don't know

[00:01:10] [SPEAKER_02]: why I still live in New York. I question it. I really do like this. The weather is just awful here.

[00:01:16] [SPEAKER_02]: It's just terrible. But anyway, I hope everyone did enjoy despite bad weather in certain places

[00:01:21] [SPEAKER_02]: because I know it was truly, truly problematic for people and traveling issues. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:01:28] [SPEAKER_04]: All right. Well, jumping into this right now, because, you know, we're already a little delayed,

[00:01:35] [SPEAKER_04]: thanks to thanks to the holiday. But some people may be listening right now and saying, well, it's

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_04]: obvious why Kyle lost. Do we really need a whole podcast on this? Now, that won't be most people,

[00:01:49] [SPEAKER_04]: because if you're actually listening to this, you already know that those are mostly the people who

[00:01:54] [SPEAKER_04]: just post comments without listening. So yeah. But to those who might ask, I say, yes, we do need a

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_04]: whole podcast on this because what's supposedly obvious almost never tells the whole story.

[00:02:08] [SPEAKER_04]: Even Rachel said in tribal council this week, I definitely had discussions today about people who

[00:02:14] [SPEAKER_04]: were not Kyle, who were seriously considered. So I don't think it was just Kyle doesn't win immunity

[00:02:20] [SPEAKER_04]: and we're voting out Kyle. It was more nuanced than that. So yeah, our discussion will look into some of

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_04]: those nuances. If it was so obvious, why was anyone else's name considered? Why did two of the five

[00:02:37] [SPEAKER_04]: members of the underdog alliance advocate for someone else? And was there anything Kyle could have done

[00:02:42] [SPEAKER_04]: differently to change the outcome? To answer all those questions and more, we will compare Kyle's game to

[00:02:49] [SPEAKER_04]: my rules for winning that I originally wrote way back after season one and have been updating ever

[00:02:53] [SPEAKER_04]: since using all the non-spoiler information available to us from what we saw on TV, interviews,

[00:02:58] [SPEAKER_04]: social media and secret scenes. And the newest version can of course be found at robhaswebsite.com

[00:03:03] [SPEAKER_04]: slash yxlossbeed and clicking on the link bubble for the survivor rules. Now I mentioned interviews in

[00:03:10] [SPEAKER_04]: there. We should mention that this is the rare situation where we are recording this podcast

[00:03:15] [SPEAKER_04]: before Kyle's interviews come out, obviously because of Thanksgiving. So it's slightly possible

[00:03:23] [SPEAKER_04]: that he could say something that would add to one rule or another. However, out of all the possible

[00:03:31] [SPEAKER_04]: scenarios for someone voted out this particular week and us not having access to interviews yet,

[00:03:38] [SPEAKER_04]: I think Kyle is the best one just for these purposes, because I don't expect him to suddenly reveal

[00:03:45] [SPEAKER_04]: like he had a whole bunch of secret alliances or hidden moves or something that will alter our overall

[00:03:52] [SPEAKER_04]: analysis here. Agreed, completely agreed. So, all right. But before we address how Kyle did in terms of

[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_04]: the rules, we always have some other things to discuss from the episode. And I want to start with

[00:04:06] [SPEAKER_04]: Andy again, because he has become such a central character. And it's kind of hard to say what we're

[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_04]: supposed to make of him. Like some people are saying he's obviously going to win. Some people are saying

[00:04:19] [SPEAKER_04]: he's obviously a zero vote finalist. Some people are saying things in between. And over the course of

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_04]: the past two episodes or few episodes, it seemed like he was rising in power. But then we heard Genevieve

[00:04:35] [SPEAKER_04]: talking about how people think he's good to bring to the end as essentially a goat. She didn't say that

[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_04]: word, but this obviously undercuts what we've been shown about Andy having a good story arc to overcome

[00:04:50] [SPEAKER_04]: his earlier situation. And once he found out about what she said, he got upset. And he said,

[00:04:59] [SPEAKER_04]: I've been playing a game that nobody is seeing and I'm sick of it. I'm sick of being underestimated in

[00:05:04] [SPEAKER_04]: this game. The thing is, he may think it's ridiculous, but he has to convince everybody else to abandon their

[00:05:13] [SPEAKER_04]: perceptions because he said it. He was playing a game that nobody else is seeing. Well, that's great to keep

[00:05:19] [SPEAKER_04]: your threat level low. But if nobody else is seeing it, well, then you're going to have situations like

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_04]: Genevieve and maybe worse when you get to the end. It is a very difficult tightrope to walk.

[00:05:33] [SPEAKER_02]: And I do think that Andy is very reminiscent of Xander, who we saw a very similar type of edit occurring

[00:05:42] [SPEAKER_02]: where we were watching the show thinking, wow, Xander might actually have a chance.

[00:05:48] [SPEAKER_02]: If he makes it to the final three. And then we find out after the fact that everyone wanted to bring Xander because

[00:05:53] [SPEAKER_02]: nobody thought Xander was going to win. And we didn't get any little hints like we did this episode with that

[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_02]: one. I mean, that was a big, big hint that Genevieve dropped that what we are seeing might not necessarily be

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_02]: what everyone on the island is seeing, because a lot of what we see from Andy is happening in confessionals.

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_02]: And there are discussions that he's having one on one with with individuals.

[00:06:19] [SPEAKER_02]: But he seems to be building himself up a lot in his confessionals.

[00:06:24] [SPEAKER_02]: And that's where I think a lot of that belief is necessarily coming from, is that Andy is doing this and

[00:06:30] [SPEAKER_02]: Andy is doing that. And I have the best relationship with Sue and Caroline right now.

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And but does he? I don't know. That's what he's saying. And so I do think that Genevieve saying that

[00:06:41] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think that was just coming from Genevieve wanting to point the finger in a different direction.

[00:06:49] [SPEAKER_02]: She's very aware that she's one of the targets. Right. So for her to be saying, listen, let's go after the

[00:06:54] [SPEAKER_02]: people who are taking those those third spots away from us. Let's focus on them, I think, is is a very,

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_02]: very honest depiction and explanation of what we're just not seeing. Right. Yeah. I mean, this

[00:07:06] [SPEAKER_04]: whole Andy thing makes me think back to the Annika vote where he had this elaborate but totally

[00:07:12] [SPEAKER_04]: unnecessary scheme to fool her and Rachel. And he thought he had really done something there.

[00:07:18] [SPEAKER_04]: And we said at the time, like, what was that? That was a big nothing. Now we're seeing these

[00:07:25] [SPEAKER_04]: conflicting views of Andy from others compared to what he thinks of himself. Yeah. I wonder if looking

[00:07:30] [SPEAKER_04]: back, that was a sign of things to come. Like he'll be in the final three and say, I fooled Annika

[00:07:37] [SPEAKER_04]: and Sierra and Sam will be on the jury like, no, you know. Right. On the other hand, the confusing

[00:07:45] [SPEAKER_04]: thing to me is when he did it, it wasn't portrayed in like a clowny way, but as if it was serious.

[00:07:54] [SPEAKER_04]: And that's why we were so confused, because we're like, why is the show making it out like

[00:07:58] [SPEAKER_04]: he has really pulled this off when we know he didn't? Well, and I'm curious. I'm not trying to

[00:08:04] [SPEAKER_02]: cut you off, but I am curious if we're coming back to the edit portion of it, because perhaps

[00:08:10] [SPEAKER_02]: CBS doesn't want the winner to be so incredibly obvious. And so maybe they're trying to balance

[00:08:16] [SPEAKER_02]: the edit out a little bit more and make it appear as if someone else could be winning. My sister said to

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_02]: me, she's like, oh, Andy's totally winning. And she's someone who is a casual watcher of Survivor.

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_02]: She loves the show, but she doesn't delve into anything beyond watching the program itself. She'll

[00:08:32] [SPEAKER_02]: talk to me about it occasionally, but she's just watching the edit. And so I think that perhaps

[00:08:39] [SPEAKER_02]: that is something else that could be happening is that they're just trying to make it a little more

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_02]: like, oh, who could win depending on who the three that are sitting there?

[00:08:48] [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, that could be that could be the other thing is maybe maybe your sister's right and he

[00:08:53] [SPEAKER_04]: does win and they're showing it to bolster the idea that he has been doing things.

[00:08:58] [SPEAKER_04]: Sure. We're sitting here like, but but has he really?

[00:09:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Right. But if he's doing things and they don't know, he is going to have a really hard tribal

[00:09:05] [SPEAKER_02]: council, which you've you've already spoke on. So if he's he's maybe incredible in his final tribal

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_02]: and convinces everyone I've done all of these things and they finally see it. I don't know.

[00:09:15] [SPEAKER_04]: Well, and that's the thing. We are also hearing some very intelligent things from him.

[00:09:20] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. For example, he told us this week, I'm a numbers guy, but I can't just sit here and

[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_04]: algorithmically determine the correct path because there's so much variance and all this variance

[00:09:30] [SPEAKER_04]: comes from the people themselves. People are tricky because they have all these different

[00:09:35] [SPEAKER_04]: priorities and not everyone out here is an A.I. agent playing to optimize their win condition.

[00:09:41] [SPEAKER_04]: And yeah, it's important that people recognize this. It's it's like I'm sure I've used this example

[00:09:47] [SPEAKER_04]: before. It's like trying to play poker against someone who doesn't really know how to play.

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. You can assume they will play what's called game theory optimal, but you'll be wrong a lot.

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_04]: Like you can look at their cards and say, well, with those cards and that board, they're going to do

[00:10:02] [SPEAKER_04]: this and then they don't know any better. And you end up like, oh, OK, I did not expect that.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_04]: Right. And the same is true survivor. You know, if that people don't always play optimally.

[00:10:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. Yeah. And I think it's going to be an interesting last few episodes to see where he

[00:10:23] [SPEAKER_02]: ends up and how things shake out, because I am very curious about this group of of people who are left

[00:10:32] [SPEAKER_02]: because there is this idea that if two of them are the two people that everyone else wants to go to

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_02]: the end with, it's going to it's going to become very, very interesting when they have to start cutting

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_02]: people that they necessarily want to play with and have been playing with. But now they're like, but I

[00:10:51] [SPEAKER_02]: don't want to sit next to them. I need to sit next to these two.

[00:10:55] [SPEAKER_04]: So I'm I'm very intrigued, to say the least. Yes. I do want to also add with Andy, you know,

[00:11:01] [SPEAKER_04]: during tribal council, he said another very smart thing. You have to be not at the top,

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_04]: not on the bottom and figure out a way to get through and not have a shot to win it or and have

[00:11:12] [SPEAKER_04]: a shot to win at the end. Not a direct quote, a summary there. But this is a good kind of,

[00:11:18] [SPEAKER_04]: you know, paraphrasing of several of my rules. You can't be seen as too much of a threat.

[00:11:23] [SPEAKER_04]: You can't be outside the core group. You need to ensure you're in a good position to win. And again,

[00:11:29] [SPEAKER_04]: he's saying smart things. And I don't understand why the show would portray him that way if he's going

[00:11:36] [SPEAKER_04]: to end up as a supposed goat at the end. I'm telling you, he's reminding me so much of Xander.

[00:11:42] [SPEAKER_02]: I was so convinced that Xander was going to do so much better. And then Xander didn't get any votes.

[00:11:48] [SPEAKER_04]: So it's certainly possible. See, I don't remember my feelings on Xander at the time. I feel like at

[00:11:54] [SPEAKER_04]: the time I knew Xander was not getting anything, but that could my memory could be tainted by what

[00:12:02] [SPEAKER_02]: we learned afterwards. So we can also look at Owen. Owen was another one too, right? Where

[00:12:07] [SPEAKER_04]: he was getting good content. Owen was a Charlie Brown. And I think he would acknowledge that like

[00:12:13] [SPEAKER_04]: Owen and Jake, they were portrayed as I think everyone knew they were going to be zero vote

[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_02]: finalists for a while. Right. But I will say though, that there, there is a very heavy edit

[00:12:26] [SPEAKER_02]: regarding Andy, just as there was a very heavy edit regarding those three individuals. Yeah. And

[00:12:31] [SPEAKER_02]: they can certainly pick and choose what they want to show, but in his confessionals again,

[00:12:38] [SPEAKER_02]: Andy's selling himself. And so that's what we are seeing so much of. I don't know. I mean,

[00:12:44] [SPEAKER_02]: we know Jake wasn't selling himself, right? He was very self-deprecating when he would talk about

[00:12:49] [SPEAKER_02]: himself. And, and so I do think that those confessionals ended up becoming much more

[00:12:54] [SPEAKER_02]: significant in how you necessarily view what they're doing because you're, you're hearing it from

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_02]: this person and going, Oh, well, is that like, again, Caroline and Sue, like, is that really what's

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_02]: going on? Is that really what's happening? And so if we are being told the story more from Andy's

[00:13:08] [SPEAKER_02]: perspective, well, that's the way he sees it. Right. Not necessarily the way everyone else sees it. And

[00:13:13] [SPEAKER_02]: right now, if you know that Sierra is, well, we know Sierra is on the jury. And then if Sam ends up

[00:13:18] [SPEAKER_02]: over there, they're going to be able to say a lot of things about Andy that other people might not

[00:13:23] [SPEAKER_02]: necessarily know. And Rachel too, depending on where she ends up. So I, I do think that

[00:13:28] [SPEAKER_02]: there is some, there's some issue there that could be related to the edit. Maybe he's just,

[00:13:33] [SPEAKER_02]: maybe he's a Kaiser Sose and he's going to get in there and just knock it out of the park and,

[00:13:38] [SPEAKER_02]: and end up winning. But it is very, very interesting the way that they have portrayed him.

[00:13:44] [SPEAKER_02]: And we've said it all along when people like Andy play this game, you need to get rid of them

[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_02]: right away. Because it's like, when you have that individual at the very beginning who you think you

[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_02]: can, I can utilize this person. I can save this person. I can tuck them under my wing and they

[00:14:01] [SPEAKER_02]: will be my second vote. No, no, no, no, no, no. You're not helping anyone. You're not helping

[00:14:05] [SPEAKER_02]: yourself. Just cut your, cut your losses because guess what? That person's going to come back later

[00:14:10] [SPEAKER_02]: and make it very difficult for you, which we've seen Andy do. Yeah. Now you mentioned Sierra on the

[00:14:16] [SPEAKER_04]: jury. And I know that when Andy said one thing at tribal council, a bunch of people online like

[00:14:22] [SPEAKER_04]: jumped on him because they said he should not have admitted to lying to the jurors. Ah, yes. I,

[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_04]: I think what he did was perfectly fine. As a matter of fact, I was happy with it because

[00:14:34] [SPEAKER_04]: the jurors already knew he lied to them. Right. Right. And a surprise. So if I were on the jury,

[00:14:42] [SPEAKER_04]: I would rather he admit it and chalk it up to gameplay than try to claim something like, Oh,

[00:14:48] [SPEAKER_04]: I've never lied to anyone, you know, or avoid it. So I know we saw Sierra's reaction to it,

[00:14:55] [SPEAKER_04]: which was negative. I think Sierra is always going to have a negative reaction to Andy,

[00:14:59] [SPEAKER_04]: no matter what happens, but the others, okay. You know, yes, you lied to me. Good job,

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_04]: you know? Right. Right. But maybe we were, maybe we were supposed to see Sierra's reaction as the

[00:15:13] [SPEAKER_04]: jury overall as like, Hmm, that wasn't a good thing to say. Right. Yeah. No, I, I agree with that

[00:15:20] [SPEAKER_04]: very much. So moving on from Andy, um, a primary focus of this episode was of course, Rachel.

[00:15:29] [SPEAKER_04]: First of all, she had a much better rock draw result this time. Uh, it was good to get the one

[00:15:34] [SPEAKER_04]: different rock this time. Uh, and she ended up with the block of vote advantage, which is really

[00:15:41] [SPEAKER_04]: going to be useful. Who knows? Uh, but she also blocked one of the other people from getting the

[00:15:47] [SPEAKER_04]: block of vote. So much more important than that. I think she is in prime position to keep moving forward

[00:15:55] [SPEAKER_04]: in the game. She's in a trio with Andy and teeny. She's also in a trio with Caroline and Sue.

[00:16:02] [SPEAKER_04]: And she's of course with all four of them together in the underdog. So she's basically the intersection

[00:16:09] [SPEAKER_04]: of the two trios there, which means she's about as set as she can be. And if things continue this way,

[00:16:16] [SPEAKER_04]: she will have the option of deciding which way to go as they get near the end. Um, you know,

[00:16:23] [SPEAKER_04]: there's a reason a lot of people, uh, have their eyes on her as a potential winner right now.

[00:16:29] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. And she also does have a relationship with Genevieve and Sam, because I think Genevieve

[00:16:35] [SPEAKER_02]: and Sam are trying to, well, they have to, at this point, they have to look at the, the underdogs

[00:16:41] [SPEAKER_02]: and decide how do we switch things up and what can we do? And Genevieve is trying to sell that.

[00:16:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Why are we letting other people steal that third spot narrative, which I'm sure she's probably

[00:16:52] [SPEAKER_02]: talking to Sam about as well. And Rachel, certainly, I don't think fits one of those

[00:16:57] [SPEAKER_02]: third spot places. And so maybe they're going to try to butter her up a little bit and talk to her

[00:17:04] [SPEAKER_02]: about that possibility. And I think that she would listen. I'm not saying she would do it,

[00:17:09] [SPEAKER_02]: but I think we might actually approach her.

[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think she'll buy it. I think she is in a great position right now.

[00:17:15] [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, somehow 100%, you know, a few episodes, we were scratching our head and saying,

[00:17:20] [SPEAKER_04]: why is everyone calling Rachel a threat? She hasn't really done anything to be called a threat.

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_04]: And now I'm scratching my head going, why is Rachel one of the underdogs? She's one of the biggest

[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_02]: threats out there. But that's what I'm saying. That's why Genevieve and Sam, I think we'll be

[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_02]: comfortable approaching her and trying to convince her like, listen, we should go to the end together

[00:17:40] [SPEAKER_02]: because we were all on the same playing field and we're all even. So she's in an even better spot

[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_02]: because of that, because they aren't going to be targeting her. They're going to be trying to convince

[00:17:51] [SPEAKER_04]: her to target somebody else. Yeah. And she's going to be like, no, I don't want an even playing field.

[00:17:56] [SPEAKER_04]: I have my playing field. Thank you. Right. Right. Exactly. Yeah. Mm hmm. So, um, all right.

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_04]: Do you have anything or anyone else you want to discuss before we get to the rules?

[00:18:06] [SPEAKER_02]: I just really liked how this entire episode felt. It felt very kind of deep and I felt like the play and

[00:18:15] [SPEAKER_02]: I, and I, maybe that sounds silly, but I feel like we're, we were hearing from so many of the players

[00:18:22] [SPEAKER_02]: about how draining this game is because of the mental component, the emotional component. There's,

[00:18:31] [SPEAKER_02]: there's a whole lot of discussion about trying to keep emotion out of it and they can't and how hard

[00:18:36] [SPEAKER_02]: it is. And I just felt like we were really seeing like this realization that, gosh, this is a hard

[00:18:42] [SPEAKER_02]: game. Like this, this will really break you down. And I just appreciated that we were seeing that.

[00:18:47] [SPEAKER_02]: And that probably stems from the 90 minute episodes, but it just felt, it just felt better because it

[00:18:54] [SPEAKER_02]: felt like there was more to it than just a challenge and, and some free hot dogs or, you know, this is

[00:19:00] [SPEAKER_02]: what the winner's going to get or whatever. And, um, I, I liked it a lot. I just thought it was very,

[00:19:05] [SPEAKER_02]: I thought it just felt different and it felt more meaningful for all of the players when they were

[00:19:10] [SPEAKER_02]: talking about their end game.

[00:19:14] [SPEAKER_04]: It's not often you get to see someone's literal villain origin story. And we saw that with Genevieve.

[00:19:20] [SPEAKER_04]: She was like, I chose to stop having a heart and become a villain, you know? And it's like,

[00:19:27] [SPEAKER_04]: yeah, it's like, dang, she's going to be fighting Batman next.

[00:19:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. And, and they also, I think it's very interesting. And I'm curious if this again,

[00:19:36] [SPEAKER_02]: goes to the edit, right? If perhaps this is becoming more of, um, a significant component

[00:19:43] [SPEAKER_02]: because they all gave up their shots in the dark for the rice. Right. And so all of the people that are

[00:19:49] [SPEAKER_02]: now going, gosh, darn it. I probably needed that. So I'm sure Jeff is just loving that component,

[00:19:57] [SPEAKER_02]: but they're kicking themselves for giving up something that we've complained about

[00:20:02] [SPEAKER_02]: about it even being introduced into the game that now players are like, ah, I shouldn't have,

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_02]: I shouldn't have traded rice for that. So. All right. Well, there were of course,

[00:20:14] [SPEAKER_04]: some other things going on and, uh, I will be putting, uh, some of it in my YouTube shorts

[00:20:19] [SPEAKER_04]: at David Bloomberg TV. Some of it's already there, uh, like, uh, just, you know, this morning before,

[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_04]: uh, uh, traveling and recording this, I posted about, uh, the Andy situation and, you know,

[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_04]: him complaining about being seen as a goat. So, uh, you know, you can, you can go to, uh,

[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_04]: my YouTube shorts to see that. Before we get to how Kyle did, we do want to mention that the rules

[00:20:47] [SPEAKER_04]: we're about to discuss come in a shorter and much more colorful version in poster form.

[00:20:53] [SPEAKER_04]: They do. And as we've hinted over the past couple of weeks, these posters are now on sale for the

[00:21:00] [SPEAKER_04]: holiday. That's right. Um, we started as a black Friday sale. Now it's a cyber Monday sale. And then

[00:21:06] [SPEAKER_04]: it'll be, uh, every day wise to the holiday thing. Um, yes. And we've made a couple of sales. So

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_02]: people are definitely taking advantage of the sale price. So please jump on that, order it,

[00:21:20] [SPEAKER_02]: buy it for your loved ones. It's a great holiday gift. Just buy it for yourself as a holiday gift.

[00:21:25] [SPEAKER_04]: It's lovely. So yes, please. It is 20% off. So that's only $16 plus shipping. Um, go to

[00:21:32] [SPEAKER_04]: robhizzerwebsite.com slash YX lost feed, scroll down to the poster, click on it and order it.

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_04]: And you know, our shipping department, you know, order it soon. So our shipping department there

[00:21:43] [SPEAKER_04]: isn't running to the post office, uh, you know, right up against the Christmas deadline and which

[00:21:49] [SPEAKER_04]: is also the same as the Hanukkah deadline this year. So, um, no, I know I was looking at these dates and

[00:21:55] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm thinking, my gosh, I need to really get going on this stuff. Um, in addition, you can,

[00:22:02] [SPEAKER_04]: uh, scroll down on that page and find, uh, the poster on a t-shirt and the checklist on a t-shirt.

[00:22:09] [SPEAKER_04]: And I was right that RJP is running a, uh, patron only, uh, black Friday, cyber Monday deal. Now

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_04]: I think it may only go until cyber Monday, which means hopefully you are listening to this right now,

[00:22:24] [SPEAKER_04]: or you already know about it because you're a patron. Um, and so, you know, there's a percent off

[00:22:29] [SPEAKER_04]: on those shirts. They are separate from the poster. Um, but also if you're not a patron,

[00:22:36] [SPEAKER_04]: there is a big special, you know, a holiday special of 47% off for your first month for

[00:22:42] [SPEAKER_04]: becoming a patron. Again, I don't remember the deadline on that. So look into it, do it quickly.

[00:22:49] [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, you know, just to make sure that you, you get all these deals.

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_02]: Listen, I have to tell you a funny story before we get to Kyle, because this is about you, David

[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Bloomberg and deals and sales. I was going to say, you have to tell a funny story about me. Wait a

[00:23:02] [SPEAKER_02]: minute. Yes. So I happened to be in Sam's club with my husband maybe a week ago. And there were these

[00:23:09] [SPEAKER_02]: two massive bags of your favorite candy. Uh-oh, which one? I have lots of them. Candy corn,

[00:23:17] [SPEAKER_02]: candy corn, those nasty little things. And I, and I was like, look at these. They were like

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_02]: on crazy sale and I was going to buy them. And my husband's like, are you insane? Do you see how

[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_02]: heavy those are? They're like four pounds of like each. You're going to mail those to Bloomberg.

[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_02]: You might as well just go on Amazon and buy them one. Cause you're not going to save any money.

[00:23:38] [SPEAKER_02]: Right. I was like, damn it.

[00:23:40] [SPEAKER_04]: Yes. My, uh, a couple of, uh, holidays ago. So my wife always makes a particular dessert,

[00:23:46] [SPEAKER_04]: um, that it's a type of cookie that, uh, the, and she brings it for, uh, various family members

[00:23:52] [SPEAKER_04]: and for whatever holiday it was, uh, we either, we couldn't go or she forgot. I don't remember,

[00:23:58] [SPEAKER_04]: but she wanted to get those out. So she baked them all and, you know, put them into Tupperware

[00:24:04] [SPEAKER_04]: containers and I went to the post office and went, how much, how much is it? Oh yes. Uh, yes. So

[00:24:13] [SPEAKER_02]: I send cookies every Christmas and I, at this point I've just, I know I could send you cookies.

[00:24:23] [SPEAKER_02]: I send cookies. I will say to my relatives that, uh, that live far away from me. I do send them

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_02]: cookies, but it is a very expensive, um, for sure. But yes, yes. Maybe that, maybe that'll be the

[00:24:37] [SPEAKER_04]: next one. Why blank lost cookies by Jessica. Um, we'll work on that for next year. In the meantime,

[00:24:43] [SPEAKER_04]: uh, if you want the poster or anything else, again, go to Rob has a website.com slash YX lost.

[00:24:48] [SPEAKER_02]: And maybe I'll just order you your bad candy on Amazon. No, that's okay. I have some still. So

[00:24:55] [SPEAKER_02]: you and circus peanuts and can't. Yeah. Yeah. I just got, I just got fun things like Kyle. I got

[00:25:01] [SPEAKER_04]: some mint mini marshmallows at a Trader Joe's. So, well, that's not terrible. No, it's true.

[00:25:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Those in like a hot chocolate. That's I can get behind that or in my mouth. I, I don't think I

[00:25:12] [SPEAKER_02]: would want to just eat mint marshmallows. I don't. Oh, I do. Um, just saying to each their own.

[00:25:21] [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly. All right. Well, moving on from food, uh, you know, we feel like we're on survivor where

[00:25:29] [SPEAKER_04]: they're just always discussing food because they don't have, I can just go up to my pantry and get

[00:25:33] [SPEAKER_04]: some, um, especially after that Trader Joe's run. Um, uh, all right. So in the beginning of this

[00:25:42] [SPEAKER_04]: episode, Kyle said, I feel like I need to win every single immunity. And you know, by the time he said

[00:25:50] [SPEAKER_04]: it, yes, he did. But the real question is how he got to that point. How did he end up in a situation

[00:25:55] [SPEAKER_04]: where the only option he had was outside the scope of gameplay and rested solely on his competitive

[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_04]: abilities? It went beyond just his ability to win challenges and even more than being in his words,

[00:26:13] [SPEAKER_04]: a family man with a good story. What did he do and not do to put himself in that position at RHAP?

[00:26:23] [SPEAKER_04]: We know survivor and we know why Kyle lost. So we might as well go out of order for the second week

[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_04]: in a row and start our discussion with rule six, which of course warns against being too much of a

[00:26:35] [SPEAKER_04]: threat. Kyle obviously violated this rule, uh, but it wasn't just winning challenges though. That was

[00:26:41] [SPEAKER_04]: certainly the most obvious part of it. Um, other players and Kyle himself knew there was more to it.

[00:26:49] [SPEAKER_04]: Teeny did a good job of summarizing most of the reasons after Kyle didn't win immunity this time,

[00:26:55] [SPEAKER_04]: uh, by saying it is beyond overdue for us to take Kyle out. Getting Kyle out will be a way to help

[00:27:01] [SPEAKER_04]: all of our odds in this game, because I don't think there's any beating Kyle in this game. He's too good

[00:27:06] [SPEAKER_04]: of a competitor. He's got too good of a story and people just like Kyle. I almost felt like that,

[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_04]: um, uh, that Saturday night live skit, you know, you're like Kyle looking in a mirror,

[00:27:18] [SPEAKER_04]: you're too good of a competitor and gosh, darn it. People like me, you know, right. They do.

[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_04]: Except Sue. Yes, yes, exactly. Um, so let's break down this rule in, in terms, uh,

[00:27:34] [SPEAKER_04]: of the way Teeny spoke about it. Uh, we'll start with competitions. He was lauded as the big threat

[00:27:41] [SPEAKER_04]: challenge, having won immunity four times. Of course he didn't actually win against everyone

[00:27:47] [SPEAKER_04]: all four times, such as split tribe where he actually would come in next to one of those.

[00:27:52] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. He would have come in third place if he had been against the whole group. Um, nevertheless,

[00:27:56] [SPEAKER_04]: he was tagged with the perception of winning a lot. And I think it's true that he had overall the best

[00:28:04] [SPEAKER_04]: chance of winning a random challenge compared to everyone else. As Teeny told the other players

[00:28:09] [SPEAKER_04]: with him gone, everyone will have a better chance of immunity.

[00:28:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm. And that is very fair because I do think that one thing to always be mindful of is you want

[00:28:20] [SPEAKER_02]: immunity, the closer you get to the end, right? And if there's someone who is potentially getting

[00:28:24] [SPEAKER_02]: in your way of that, that's one factor that you can usually point to, but I think Kyle was very

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_02]: accurate in his descriptions when he was, I believe, talking to the group at camp about how

[00:28:38] [SPEAKER_02]: there are survivors from past seasons who have won almost every single immunity at the end,

[00:28:44] [SPEAKER_02]: and then they don't end up winning. So it doesn't necessarily mean you're going to win the game

[00:28:49] [SPEAKER_02]: if you're winning immunities. However, that means you're sitting in the final three. So you're taking

[00:28:54] [SPEAKER_02]: that spot. And so it's that weird, like, yeah, maybe you don't win, but you've taken that spot away

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_02]: from someone else. So it's certainly something to consider for people who might not win immunity,

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_02]: but want to. And if he's in their way, well, then having him gone is certainly helpful.

[00:29:10] [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, exactly. And, you know, it brings up the question, what is really the chance that Kyle

[00:29:16] [SPEAKER_04]: would win out? Andy tried to explain it to the other underdogs, saying it was highly unlikely that

[00:29:22] [SPEAKER_04]: he would win all the way to the end. Caroline misunderstood him, and so did many viewers.

[00:29:26] [SPEAKER_04]: It even took me a rewatch before I got what he was saying. He basically assigned Kyle a 50-50

[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_04]: chance of winning any given immunity challenge. I think someone mentioned on the post-show podcast

[00:29:37] [SPEAKER_04]: that this was based off of him winning two out of the four times when it was just him

[00:29:41] [SPEAKER_04]: against other individuals, all the other individuals. But either way, Andy then multiplied

[00:29:49] [SPEAKER_04]: that out 50% times 50% times 50% times 50%. That's how he got to the 6.25%. And I agree with him that as

[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_04]: a, from a general standpoint, the odds of Kyle winning every single immunity challenge to the end

[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_04]: are pretty small. But the thing is, he doesn't have to win them all to cause a problem.

[00:30:10] [SPEAKER_04]: Brian B mentioned to me on Blue Sky, you know, well, if you don't vote him out now,

[00:30:16] [SPEAKER_04]: and he wins two straight immunity challenges, well, now your underdog Alliance 5 have to turn

[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_04]: on each other at final six instead of final five. Yep. And it, you know, as Brian B said,

[00:30:29] [SPEAKER_04]: it completely flips the dynamic within your group. It upsets your path to the end as far

[00:30:33] [SPEAKER_04]: as interpersonal dynamics. Suddenly you're talking about a very different situation.

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_04]: And you know what? If I were out there playing and Andy convinced me, and then Kyle actually did that,

[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_04]: I'd be like, screw you, Andy. I'm voting you out because I told you this was going to happen.

[00:30:51] [SPEAKER_02]: Right. And that's a very, very fair point. Yeah.

[00:30:55] [SPEAKER_04]: Um, now also without even considering any other aspect of the game, anyone winning that many challenges

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_04]: gains a sort of an aura around them as the numbers whittle down, as you said, you, everybody wants immunity

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_04]: and that winner has more and more power. Plus it just gets to be impressive. Even if you go in and

[00:31:23] [SPEAKER_04]: say, well, I'm going to vote completely on strategy. If you see someone who wins out to get to the end,

[00:31:29] [SPEAKER_04]: who Mike Holloway's themselves there, you're going to be like, well, damn, that was impressive.

[00:31:35] [SPEAKER_02]: Right. And also if we get down to the point where he has to make, let's say he wins immunity and he

[00:31:43] [SPEAKER_02]: gets to decide who's going to make fire. Right. We all love that so much. And his, his idea is that

[00:31:51] [SPEAKER_02]: he brings the best to the end. He said that from the beginning, his pregame interviews that he wasn't,

[00:31:57] [SPEAKER_02]: he didn't want to be involved in, in just bringing people to the end that he knew he could be, he wanted,

[00:32:02] [SPEAKER_02]: he's of the mindset, you should be sitting next to the best. And so that in and of itself is scary

[00:32:08] [SPEAKER_02]: for anyone who's like not a Genevieve and not a Sam and not a Rachel, you know, we're there.

[00:32:14] [SPEAKER_02]: So it's, it's that mindset as well. You put him in that position of power. He is going to be making

[00:32:21] [SPEAKER_02]: a decision that is not necessarily beneficial for the people who are in that underdog group necessarily.

[00:32:28] [SPEAKER_04]: Right. Now, uh, going back to teeny's quote about why they couldn't let Kyle get to the end. The second

[00:32:34] [SPEAKER_04]: factor mentioned, uh, was in terms of Kyle being a threat is that he's got too good of a story and

[00:32:41] [SPEAKER_04]: people just like him. And as Kyle himself said on the show, I've been so vulnerable with my story.

[00:32:47] [SPEAKER_04]: And the reason why I'm here, they know it's an excellent story and that a family man is a dangerous

[00:32:51] [SPEAKER_04]: person to have in the end game. And he's right. Uh, while I don't subscribe to the idea that some

[00:32:58] [SPEAKER_04]: people have that the jury is just giving the wind to the person that they liked the most,

[00:33:03] [SPEAKER_04]: it would be very difficult not to take that into account as at least one of the factors

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER_04]: with his family and life story, you know, when considering how to award the prize at the end,

[00:33:16] [SPEAKER_04]: um, you know, by being so open and sharing that story with everyone, Kyle ensured that they all knew

[00:33:23] [SPEAKER_04]: what they'd be up against if they went to the end with him.

[00:33:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. And then he made it even more highlighted after his vote because you just listened to him

[00:33:31] [SPEAKER_02]: speak from the heart, the way that he was. And how would that just not melt people who are sitting on

[00:33:37] [SPEAKER_02]: the jury? It would be, uh, it would be a very, very tough situation to combat and try to be like,

[00:33:45] [SPEAKER_02]: but, but wait, look at me. What about me? And, you know, over here. Yeah. I think that that was

[00:33:50] [SPEAKER_02]: definitely a very real concern for anyone sitting next to him in the end.

[00:33:54] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. I mean, I know that the, they did not see the end of 46, but we did. And one of our

[00:34:00] [SPEAKER_04]: criticisms of that jury was that some of them voted based on, uh, the answer to what are you going to

[00:34:06] [SPEAKER_04]: do with the money? Uh, it's not something I like, uh, but they get to vote however they want, you know?

[00:34:14] [SPEAKER_04]: And I can understand doing it if it's like, well, I think you both played an equal game. So therefore I

[00:34:19] [SPEAKER_04]: need something to, you know, but okay, you know, and, and so, so yeah, anyone know, you know, who knows

[00:34:28] [SPEAKER_04]: the history of survivor knows it does come up. Um, so now there is one type of threat that we haven't

[00:34:38] [SPEAKER_04]: mentioned, and that is being a strategic threat. Uh, we will obviously discuss that, uh, in a few

[00:34:44] [SPEAKER_04]: minutes, uh, in rule one, uh, but Kyle himself made the case in tribal council that he was not one.

[00:34:52] [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, the ironic thing was that as Kyle argued the point and also argued the point that you just

[00:34:59] [SPEAKER_04]: made a couple of minutes ago, he showed that he understands at least some of the strategy of the

[00:35:06] [SPEAKER_04]: game. And by doing so, he kind of made himself more of a strategic threat or I guess I would say

[00:35:15] [SPEAKER_04]: he had the potential to become one. If he had somehow made it past this vote, then I think there

[00:35:23] [SPEAKER_04]: would have been a reason to worry about his strategic game, or at least the perception that

[00:35:27] [SPEAKER_04]: he had used strategy to get past a situation where he should have been the obvious person voted out.

[00:35:33] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. And I do think that there's a lot to be said just about the honest nature in which he played

[00:35:38] [SPEAKER_02]: this game, which he's not someone who's like an Andy or scratching her head going, well, how does

[00:35:44] [SPEAKER_02]: everyone else perceive him? He's very vocal about what his thoughts are and what he thinks the game

[00:35:49] [SPEAKER_02]: should be and how people should play the game. He's not trying to hide any of that. And so I do think

[00:35:55] [SPEAKER_02]: that that would definitely have could have crept into that people would have thought it was more

[00:36:00] [SPEAKER_02]: strategic than he necessarily even thought it was himself. Yes. Yes. Now, this leads us back to the

[00:36:06] [SPEAKER_04]: overall aspect of what Teenie said in that quote about Kyle, that there's no beating him in the end.

[00:36:11] [SPEAKER_04]: And again, if he'd made it past this tribal council and somehow made it to final three,

[00:36:17] [SPEAKER_04]: obviously it would depend somewhat on who he was up against and how he got there.

[00:36:21] [SPEAKER_04]: But if he actually convinced people to keep him and then at the end said he used his social or

[00:36:27] [SPEAKER_04]: strategic skills to do it. I think that's a win right there that on top of everything else

[00:36:33] [SPEAKER_04]: or really, even if he didn't say it, if there was the perception that he did, you know, we heard

[00:36:40] [SPEAKER_04]: last week, Gabe saying, if Kyle is at the end, he wins and Genevieve adding, if he's there, I'm voting

[00:36:45] [SPEAKER_04]: for. Yeah. So just letting him get past this point adds to his threat level. Yes. 100%.

[00:36:55] [SPEAKER_04]: All right. Well, we can now move back to the top of the rules and talk about the first and most

[00:37:00] [SPEAKER_04]: important one, which is of course, the scheme and plot. A few minutes ago in rule six, I quoted Kyle

[00:37:07] [SPEAKER_04]: talking about being open and a family man being dangerous at the end. He finished that statement,

[00:37:14] [SPEAKER_04]: which I didn't quote yet by saying, so now it's time to step away from my physical abilities and

[00:37:20] [SPEAKER_04]: just try to get into the social game of this. Now, first, I don't think he meant the social game as we

[00:37:25] [SPEAKER_04]: talk about it, but rather the strategic game, the way he was talking about it. It only makes sense

[00:37:30] [SPEAKER_04]: if he truly meant strategic game, which is kind of an indication that he didn't really separate the two

[00:37:34] [SPEAKER_04]: and right part of the problem. But the thing is, you can't just wait until you're vulnerable

[00:37:43] [SPEAKER_04]: to suddenly decide, oh, now I'm going to play this very important aspect of Survivor.

[00:37:50] [SPEAKER_04]: Right. That's something you need to be doing the whole time. Last week, we talked about how this

[00:37:56] [SPEAKER_04]: rule says you need to play the game from your very first few minutes there, like Gabe, when he made the

[00:38:02] [SPEAKER_04]: alliance with Sue right away. Yeah. Kyle didn't do that. He was kind of the opposite. He said in episode

[00:38:10] [SPEAKER_04]: two, the strategizing is the hardest part. I can live in the jungle. But the thing is, living in the

[00:38:17] [SPEAKER_04]: jungle is not the point of Survivor. Strategizing is. Right. And you need to have a good combination

[00:38:23] [SPEAKER_02]: of both because you are a great asset to your tribe if you are able to live in the jungle for sure.

[00:38:30] [SPEAKER_02]: But you also need to remember you're playing a game for a million dollars and that's going to come

[00:38:37] [SPEAKER_02]: with some strategy components as well. It's not just about how well you can collect and chop

[00:38:42] [SPEAKER_02]: coconuts and keep people fed and warm. It is about all of the other delicious components of Survivor,

[00:38:48] [SPEAKER_04]: which make it Survivor. And that's the strategy. Yeah. I mean, right from the start, Kyle was left out

[00:38:53] [SPEAKER_04]: of the vote against TK. This put him in a bad position within his tribe. But then Gabe offered him

[00:38:59] [SPEAKER_04]: a lifeline and asked him to turn on Tiana. Instead of going along with it, Kyle rejected it and tried to

[00:39:05] [SPEAKER_04]: get everyone else to turn on Gabe, completely missing the actual tribal dynamics of Gabe having a locked

[00:39:11] [SPEAKER_04]: in majority on that tribe. Right. Yeah. You know, now it ended up not mattering at that point because

[00:39:16] [SPEAKER_04]: they didn't go back to tribal council before the merge. And, you know, by that time he did manage

[00:39:22] [SPEAKER_04]: to ingratiate himself more with Gabe and and the other three, Tuku aside from Tiana. But it illustrates

[00:39:31] [SPEAKER_04]: the point that he did not understand how to play strategically.

[00:39:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, and I think, though, we could give him a little bit of. I don't know, a pat on the back

[00:39:43] [SPEAKER_02]: here for trying like he came up with what he thought was strategically better for him, but he was missing

[00:39:49] [SPEAKER_04]: what was going on, like the big picture. Was it strategically better or was he just annoyed that Gabe

[00:39:55] [SPEAKER_02]: was suddenly turning on Tiana? Oh, well, that it might have just been Sharon Lawrence. Yeah. In his mind,

[00:40:00] [SPEAKER_04]: maybe he thought he was right. Yeah. Yeah. It certainly could have been. Yeah. Now, the full ramifications

[00:40:08] [SPEAKER_04]: of Kyle not understanding the strategic game didn't really hit home until this week. Until now, he's either

[00:40:14] [SPEAKER_04]: one immunity or was saved by others who wanted to make their own move, not by himself, you know, by others.

[00:40:20] [SPEAKER_04]: But when he really had to fight for his game life this time, there was nothing he could do. He kept pushing

[00:40:28] [SPEAKER_04]: the idea that you said earlier. Oh, let's let's do it this way. Let's do it that way. Let's flip the script.

[00:40:34] [SPEAKER_04]: Let's make a different play. Yeah. But you know what? He could say that however many times he wanted

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_04]: to. And he said it a lot. It just wasn't going to work. He didn't have the strategic connections to

[00:40:45] [SPEAKER_02]: make it. Right. And at that point, the strategy is so far ahead of him with what everybody else is

[00:40:52] [SPEAKER_02]: doing that it's like you're it's like you're running after a train and you're trying to jump on.

[00:40:57] [SPEAKER_02]: It's not going to work for you because they're already going and they're like, why do we need to change

[00:41:01] [SPEAKER_02]: things now? Like we're good. Like we know what we're doing. And this is why the conversation we

[00:41:06] [SPEAKER_02]: had earlier about Rachel. Like, yeah, I don't think that Rachel will necessarily change the the trajectory

[00:41:11] [SPEAKER_02]: that she's moving on. But I that's not going to stop other people from trying to do that.

[00:41:16] [SPEAKER_02]: And so I think he's he's just it's like he got there a little too late because he wasn't doing

[00:41:22] [SPEAKER_02]: it at the beginning because he didn't have to. And when he had to, it was just everyone was already

[00:41:26] [SPEAKER_04]: on their way. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, this week, Kyle talked about how he used to be a different

[00:41:33] [SPEAKER_04]: person when he was being tossed around in foster care. But once he stabilized his life, he put that

[00:41:37] [SPEAKER_04]: part of himself away. However, he said he remembered, quote, I do have the ability to lie.

[00:41:42] [SPEAKER_04]: I do have the ability to manipulate and I do have the ability to deceive. He talked to Andy about how

[00:41:48] [SPEAKER_04]: the game brought out a side of him he didn't want his family to see and doesn't want to exist in the

[00:41:52] [SPEAKER_04]: real world. And Andy wisely told him, you know, they know it's two different things.

[00:41:58] [SPEAKER_04]: But again, the problem for Kyle was it was too little too late. By the time he decided to bring

[00:42:04] [SPEAKER_04]: out that side of himself. To use your metaphor, the train had already passed. Yeah. You know,

[00:42:11] [SPEAKER_04]: all he had left was talking to other people the train left behind, you know, Sam and Genevieve about,

[00:42:17] [SPEAKER_04]: oh, let's keep the biggest threats around, which, of course, was an obvious thing for him to

[00:42:22] [SPEAKER_04]: say. But it just wasn't much of a strategy at that point. Right. Yeah. All right. Well,

[00:42:30] [SPEAKER_04]: we can move to the second rule, which says not to scheme and plot too much and to keep your

[00:42:33] [SPEAKER_04]: scheming secret. While we just talked about how Kyle didn't scheme and plot enough.

[00:42:38] [SPEAKER_04]: There were one or maybe two aspects where he actually did it too much and both particularly

[00:42:43] [SPEAKER_04]: relate to the same person. Back at the very beginning of the merge, we, of course, remember

[00:42:50] [SPEAKER_04]: how Rome was trying to get dirt on people and spread it around. He spoke to Kyle and at his urging,

[00:42:57] [SPEAKER_04]: Kyle told Rome that Sam was the most threatening and Tiana, excuse me, as well. Plus, he said that

[00:43:04] [SPEAKER_04]: Sue and Caroline were close and some other things. Basically, Rome set a trap and Kyle walked right

[00:43:11] [SPEAKER_04]: into it. We talked a bit about it at the time, but you can't just give away information like that

[00:43:17] [SPEAKER_04]: when someone new walks up to you and starts asking you questions. You're I mean, this is like,

[00:43:24] [SPEAKER_04]: you know, it's like the police officer walking up to the guy and saying, so did did you see anything

[00:43:30] [SPEAKER_04]: there? And they're just like, yes, I saw it all because I was the lookout. And, you know,

[00:43:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, where is he going with? Oh, the look? Yeah, that I see. Yeah. Yeah. If you're the

[00:43:42] [SPEAKER_02]: look at, you might want to not just immediately pony up all the information, you know, and he just

[00:43:46] [SPEAKER_04]: he gave it all away. Your mind needs to be in the game and you have to think about what might be

[00:43:53] [SPEAKER_04]: happening. You know, once Rome started spreading those things and it got back to Kyle, Kyle said,

[00:43:59] [SPEAKER_04]: I'm one of the biggest dumbasses here and I'm sorry, but he was not far off the mark since he

[00:44:04] [SPEAKER_02]: never should have told Rome all those things. Well, and what I think Kyle suffers from is just nice guy

[00:44:10] [SPEAKER_02]: syndrome, right? Like he just is a nice guy. He's very, he reminded me of JT during his pregame

[00:44:17] [SPEAKER_02]: interviews. Like he's just someone who is just nice. And I know we're not at that rule yet, but I

[00:44:23] [SPEAKER_02]: think that because he is so nice and trusting and wants to believe other people are the same way,

[00:44:29] [SPEAKER_02]: he didn't think Rome was setting the trap for him. He was like, oh, Rome's just talking to me and I'll

[00:44:34] [SPEAKER_02]: talk to Rome about the things that I know because this is what we do. We tell them things that we know.

[00:44:38] [SPEAKER_02]: And then afterwards he realized, oh no, wait, this is survivor. You don't do that when you're

[00:44:43] [SPEAKER_02]: playing survivor because people will use that against you. And, and I do think that that is a

[00:44:48] [SPEAKER_02]: very hard lesson for people when they are playing this game that you have to be thinking five steps

[00:44:54] [SPEAKER_02]: ahead when someone is having a conversation with you and think, what are they going to do with this

[00:45:00] [SPEAKER_02]: information? If anything, and perhaps you want them to do something with that information, but you have

[00:45:05] [SPEAKER_02]: to express it in a way that they don't know that. And so I just don't feel like Kyle was approaching

[00:45:11] [SPEAKER_02]: this game necessarily in that way. He's just being a nice guy and he's having a conversation.

[00:45:16] [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, I agree with you. However, there was one allegation of a time when he was not being a nice

[00:45:23] [SPEAKER_04]: guy. And that is another aspect to this discussion that may or may not be true. We don't know.

[00:45:29] [SPEAKER_04]: In Rome's exit interviews, he claimed Kyle said some additional things that weren't shown

[00:45:34] [SPEAKER_04]: about Sue and others. And then he wouldn't even talk about them, which just leaves it hanging there.

[00:45:39] [SPEAKER_04]: We don't know what they might or might not be. I am not going to speculate. But what we do know

[00:45:44] [SPEAKER_04]: is Sue was already mad at Kyle for voting against him in that first tribal council.

[00:45:49] [SPEAKER_04]: He probably did not expect something like that would cause like a lifelong vendetta against him,

[00:45:55] [SPEAKER_04]: but she sure thought so. Another possibility is that the vote was just the start and whatever Rome

[00:46:03] [SPEAKER_04]: might have spread around that Kyle supposedly said may have compounded those feelings.

[00:46:09] [SPEAKER_04]: Now, again, we don't know. We may never know. But I just wanted to put it in there so people

[00:46:17] [SPEAKER_04]: didn't say, oh, well, you're ignoring this part. It's possible. Either way, whether it was just

[00:46:22] [SPEAKER_04]: because of the vote or because of something else, we never saw Kyle make a particular effort to make

[00:46:28] [SPEAKER_04]: amends with Sue. Though, of course, he could tell us differently in his exit interviews.

[00:46:33] [SPEAKER_04]: Sure. She might have just been like, sure, whatever, and then rolled her eyes.

[00:46:39] [SPEAKER_04]: Still, we saw how much she held on to her feelings about him.

[00:46:43] [SPEAKER_04]: You might not think it would matter if Sue was mad at him, but we have to remember she was in the newly

[00:46:49] [SPEAKER_04]: formed underdogs alliance and everybody in her alliance and in the game and outside of the game

[00:46:57] [SPEAKER_04]: and throughout Fiji and through the world knew how pissed she would be if they didn't go along with

[00:47:05] [SPEAKER_04]: voting out Kyle at this point. So even with Rachel and Andy talking about how they considered Genevieve

[00:47:11] [SPEAKER_04]: to be a bigger threat overall, trying to change things on Sue would have blown up that alliance

[00:47:17] [SPEAKER_02]: before it even got started. Yes. And so they are thinking those five steps ahead, right?

[00:47:23] [SPEAKER_02]: So we can if we can placate this person now, that's fine because it's not going to affect what we're

[00:47:29] [SPEAKER_02]: doing next because we can always do that other person next because we still have the majority.

[00:47:33] [SPEAKER_04]: Yes. All right. Well, we have next third rule, which tells players to be flexible. So how do you

[00:47:41] [SPEAKER_02]: think Kyle did in terms of this? I don't think he did very well. I mean, you've already you already

[00:47:47] [SPEAKER_02]: mentioned the opportunity that was handed to him from Gabe and he just was like, yeah, no, not doing

[00:47:53] [SPEAKER_02]: that because he had a relationship with TK and didn't. So it's I do feel like he had a very big

[00:48:02] [SPEAKER_02]: difficulty realizing when he needed to be flexible in this game and not necessarily just play with his

[00:48:09] [SPEAKER_02]: heart or with with his. I mean, he's a nice guy and we've already said that. And so I think that he

[00:48:15] [SPEAKER_02]: did not separate things out well and didn't necessarily follow the rules relative to flexibility

[00:48:22] [SPEAKER_02]: at the beginning, which then really became his demise towards the end because he lost that

[00:48:28] [SPEAKER_02]: connection that he needed to move forward with someone like Gabe. I know that they still were a

[00:48:32] [SPEAKER_02]: little bit close, but not what they could have been. They could have been much closer. And I also think

[00:48:38] [SPEAKER_02]: that some of his interactions like Sue, when he approached Sue at one point was basically like

[00:48:45] [SPEAKER_02]: trying to tell her what to do. I just feel like he's he was struggling with this rule quite a bit

[00:48:51] [SPEAKER_02]: and didn't necessarily understand the significance of it when it mattered the most. Yeah. Yeah, I agree.

[00:48:57] [SPEAKER_04]: Flexibility was not really Kyle thing. You know, Andy said this week that Kyle was a one dimensional

[00:49:05] [SPEAKER_04]: player. I wouldn't quite go that far. I think he had two dimensions winning challenges and being really

[00:49:11] [SPEAKER_04]: likable. You know, the problem was two dimensions are not enough. Players need to be able to move in all

[00:49:19] [SPEAKER_04]: different directions. We discussed in the first rule how he just did not have that ability when it came to

[00:49:25] [SPEAKER_04]: strategy. No. All right. Well, the fourth rule tells players not to let their emotions control them.

[00:49:33] [SPEAKER_04]: Kyle talked in this week's episode about how he had a hard time separating his emotions from the game

[00:49:37] [SPEAKER_04]: earlier in the season. And he added, I'm realizing now that you have to separate your emotions and who

[00:49:44] [SPEAKER_04]: you were and you need to be able to adapt and be somebody that you need to be out here. If you want

[00:49:52] [SPEAKER_04]: to go the distance, there was a lot of different and need needs in their needs. And there was a lot of

[00:49:58] [SPEAKER_04]: needs. And but buried in there, there was a good epiphany for him to have that you need to put aside

[00:50:06] [SPEAKER_04]: your emotions or, you know, separate them. The problem was to add another need. He needed to understand

[00:50:13] [SPEAKER_04]: it before going into the game. Yeah. Just before he was about to get voted out, trying to put his emotions

[00:50:20] [SPEAKER_04]: aside now to play the game doesn't help if he doesn't have any moves left to make. Right. I feel like a lot of

[00:50:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Kyle's game was almost like a knee jerk reaction to what was happening around him. And so I think that this is

[00:50:33] [SPEAKER_02]: another one of those moments where we see him going, Oh, wait, no, I'm not supposed to do that.

[00:50:39] [SPEAKER_02]: I'll stop doing that now. And it's like, well, too late because it's already this far into the game

[00:50:44] [SPEAKER_02]: and you can't change that. And so I do think that he realized much too late into the game that you

[00:50:50] [SPEAKER_02]: can't do that. And I think he also, and I don't know really the best way to make this make sense

[00:50:59] [SPEAKER_02]: because he's playing emotionally, but I don't think he recognized that other people were necessarily

[00:51:03] [SPEAKER_02]: going to as well. Right. And so it was this kind of, if I'm just honest and I just say things,

[00:51:09] [SPEAKER_02]: then people will just understand. But then he didn't realize that that can affect people as well.

[00:51:14] [SPEAKER_02]: And look at Sue and how problematic their relationship became for whatever reason,

[00:51:21] [SPEAKER_02]: whether it be the vote or something else. And so I think that he forgot that other people might have

[00:51:25] [SPEAKER_02]: that same response when they're playing the game. Yeah. Yeah. And that kind of leads us nicely to the

[00:51:31] [SPEAKER_04]: fifth rule, which reminds players, they need to pretend to be nice and play the social game. Now,

[00:51:35] [SPEAKER_04]: we already, already talked in the sixth rule about how much everybody likes him, except Sue.

[00:51:43] [SPEAKER_04]: Do you think that translated to the game in terms of this rule?

[00:51:48] [SPEAKER_02]: I think there is, there is a world in which it did because people were considering the concern they

[00:51:56] [SPEAKER_02]: had for him in the final three. Right. And so if he's sitting in the end, then people must be

[00:52:01] [SPEAKER_02]: recognizing he's got, he's got a great story, but that means he's got, it's got to be likable too.

[00:52:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Right. There's got to be something about him that would make people want to hear that story and go,

[00:52:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, this guy like really deserves this money. And so there is this weird combination there that

[00:52:18] [SPEAKER_02]: even though it might not have necessarily been the way he was playing the game,

[00:52:22] [SPEAKER_02]: he couldn't put that part of him aside because he just was, that's who he was out there.

[00:52:27] [SPEAKER_02]: But then the idea of him sitting in the final three. And I think he highlighted again,

[00:52:32] [SPEAKER_02]: even though it was after the fact when he was voted out, what that final three could have looked like

[00:52:37] [SPEAKER_02]: because you would hear him say these things and you couldn't help but like the guy.

[00:52:41] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. Yeah. Now, you know, Kyle said back in episode two, that he wanted to show nice people can win

[00:52:48] [SPEAKER_04]: the game. I said at the time that nice people can and have won the game. The thing is being nice in

[00:52:56] [SPEAKER_04]: and of itself, isn't going to cut it. You still have to play. Yeah. And that includes the social aspects.

[00:53:02] [SPEAKER_04]: You have to weaponize your niceness, turn it into something you can use in the game.

[00:53:08] [SPEAKER_04]: Kyle didn't do that. Sure. Everybody except Sue loved him. Uh, you know, they all lined up,

[00:53:15] [SPEAKER_04]: even Sue to give him a hug on the way out. But the key is that it didn't stop them from sending him

[00:53:23] [SPEAKER_04]: on the way out. If anything, it made it easier to do because of the threat aspect that you just

[00:53:29] [SPEAKER_04]: mentioned. He needed to turn his friendships into game relationships and he simply didn't do that.

[00:53:38] [SPEAKER_04]: Right. Yeah.

[00:53:40] [SPEAKER_04]: All right. Well, the seventh rule, uh, covers idols and advantages and game mechanics and Kyle

[00:53:45] [SPEAKER_04]: really didn't have much to do in terms of this rule. Uh, we didn't see him specifically looking

[00:53:50] [SPEAKER_04]: for any, but we also know Gabe found the Tuku tribe idol right away. And then Sue found the red paint

[00:53:56] [SPEAKER_04]: idol. So there really wasn't much point in showing anyone else on the tribe searching. I don't really

[00:54:03] [SPEAKER_02]: have much to say about rule seven. Do you know? And I'm curious at this point in time, there would be no

[00:54:10] [SPEAKER_02]: reason for another idol to be back out in circulation. Right. Well, you can't keep it. I can't keep it all

[00:54:21] [SPEAKER_04]: straight anymore. I mean, there shouldn't be because like, you know, someone brought this up to me on,

[00:54:31] [SPEAKER_04]: on, uh, I think it was blue sky, you know, that why are people not suspicious, uh, that someone has

[00:54:38] [SPEAKER_02]: that red paint title? Right. But what's unfair about the red paint idol and you have to forgive me,

[00:54:44] [SPEAKER_02]: but that red paint idol was, and, and I, and I could be completely misremembering all of these things,

[00:54:51] [SPEAKER_02]: but that red paint idol was the Tuku idol. Yes. And they, they went to the Tuku camp. So they don't,

[00:54:56] [SPEAKER_02]: they don't then put another idol in play where now it's the merge. Okay. Right. Um, but because of

[00:55:04] [SPEAKER_04]: the timing, which I did not go back and check, I don't know the timing of when they found the red

[00:55:09] [SPEAKER_04]: paint, they may think it was a merge idol. They may not realize it was a Tuku idol. Oh, I see. Okay.

[00:55:16] [SPEAKER_04]: Um, and so they may not have it narrowed down to, Oh, it must be Sue or Caroline who have this idol.

[00:55:22] [SPEAKER_04]: Um, you know, we don't know. We haven't seen conversation about it.

[00:55:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Right. But they don't put another idol out when it's a merge. Okay. Yeah.

[00:55:30] [SPEAKER_04]: That was all I had to say about that then. Okay. All right. Well, we can move to appendix A then.

[00:55:35] [SPEAKER_04]: And it's about the players keeping their end goals in mind when voting. And we talk about voting out

[00:55:39] [SPEAKER_04]: the weak than the strong and the weak than the strong. And at this point of the game,

[00:55:42] [SPEAKER_04]: they should be voting out the strong threats. Like, you know, the guy we described when we talked

[00:55:48] [SPEAKER_04]: about rule six, uh, about a half hour ago. Um, but we also know there were two people within the

[00:55:55] [SPEAKER_04]: underdogs Alliance who seemed to want Genevieve to go instead. And they had some decent arguments,

[00:56:01] [SPEAKER_04]: although we, we somewhat shot down Andy's math, uh, argument earlier. The problem, uh, for Andy and

[00:56:09] [SPEAKER_04]: Rachel was that as we discussed earlier, everybody in the group knew that if they didn't vote out Kyle,

[00:56:15] [SPEAKER_04]: Sue would be super pissed and possibly break up the Alliance. And it was also clear from the way

[00:56:22] [SPEAKER_04]: Caroline talked about Andy's math when it came to Kyle winning immunity challenges that she was not

[00:56:28] [SPEAKER_04]: particularly interested in having that discussion either. Right. So good reasons or not, uh, they

[00:56:35] [SPEAKER_04]: were in the minority opinion. I, I tend to agree with the majority here that the risk of keeping

[00:56:42] [SPEAKER_04]: Kyle around was just too high. And I, I'm, I'm disagreeing with Rob on this one, uh, because he said

[00:56:48] [SPEAKER_04]: either on know-it-alls or on the patron call-in show or both that in, if he were there, he thinks

[00:56:56] [SPEAKER_04]: Genevieve poses the higher risk because Kyle is a known quantity. I would flip that around.

[00:57:03] [SPEAKER_04]: Everyone there knows that Genevieve is the super sneaky one. They know how she's been acting.

[00:57:13] [SPEAKER_04]: It's hard to be sneaky and turn people against each other when everyone already knows that your game is

[00:57:20] [SPEAKER_04]: being sneaky and turning people against each other. Yeah. So as long as they stay firm in that,

[00:57:27] [SPEAKER_04]: they really don't have anything to worry about with Genevieve.

[00:57:30] [SPEAKER_02]: Right. And I think the, we, then we returned back to the probability or possibility that he would win

[00:57:37] [SPEAKER_02]: immunity. And then what effect that would have on their numbers, as far as voting is concerned,

[00:57:41] [SPEAKER_02]: so I do think that that's another part of that consideration that makes sense when you have

[00:57:47] [SPEAKER_02]: the opportunity to do that. So you're not affecting the five that you have sooner than you necessarily

[00:57:52] [SPEAKER_04]: want to, to turn against each other. Yeah. Yeah. Now right now the season, uh, and I'm not the first

[00:57:58] [SPEAKER_04]: person at all to say this seems to be broken up into threats versus underdogs. Yes. And we are once

[00:58:04] [SPEAKER_04]: again, seeing the situation where when one threat falls, the domino, the threat dominoes continue afterwards.

[00:58:10] [SPEAKER_04]: Mm-hmm. So Sam and Genevieve really had no say in the matter this time. Right. And they may not for

[00:58:18] [SPEAKER_04]: the next two weeks. However, I mentioned this earlier. It is interesting that Rachel has managed

[00:58:24] [SPEAKER_04]: to switch from being seen as a threat to being one of the threat hunters. Mm-hmm. And like I said earlier,

[00:58:30] [SPEAKER_04]: I think it's funny that what she's doing now is a lot more threatening than what she was doing when

[00:58:34] [SPEAKER_04]: she was labeled a threat. Right. But like we always say, it's about perception. Mm-hmm. Yes. So,

[00:58:43] [SPEAKER_04]: so yeah, I mean, you know, I think the underdogs all believe that they are keeping their end goals in

[00:58:49] [SPEAKER_04]: mind in these votes, but some of them are missing that Rachel may be the biggest threat there. Mm-hmm.

[00:58:59] [SPEAKER_04]: All about perception. Yes. All right. Well, we can move to Appendix B, which discusses the jury phase,

[00:59:06] [SPEAKER_04]: including preparing yourself for being in final three and also preparing the jury to want to vote

[00:59:11] [SPEAKER_04]: for you. I think Kyle more or less unintentionally prepared the jury to want to vote for him by

[00:59:17] [SPEAKER_04]: just being himself, as we discussed in rule six. But one area where he of course needed to do more was

[00:59:25] [SPEAKER_04]: the aspect of strategizing that we've also talked about. He, he did not do anything in particular to

[00:59:32] [SPEAKER_04]: set himself up better as a specific plan. Yeah. Yeah. No, I do think that, I think that Kyle certainly

[00:59:41] [SPEAKER_02]: struggled with the, the long-term game here as far as survivor was concerned and really like

[00:59:48] [SPEAKER_02]: setting himself up in a, in a way that was going to get him to the end with the people that were going

[00:59:54] [SPEAKER_02]: to like support him wanting to be there, unfortunately. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well,

[01:00:01] [SPEAKER_04]: it is about time to wrap things up. Uh, what are your final thoughts on Kyle?

[01:00:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, Kyle is certainly someone who I think knew himself well coming into this game. He talked about

[01:00:13] [SPEAKER_02]: his biggest kryptonite being that he always wants to see people happy. I don't like causing pain. I

[01:00:18] [SPEAKER_02]: don't like causing distress, having to jump through all the hoops and the different challenges I've

[01:00:23] [SPEAKER_02]: had growing up and all of the sadness along the way. The last thing I want to do is hurt people

[01:00:27] [SPEAKER_02]: or make people feel like they're not going to achieve their dreams. Then why are you playing survivor,

[01:00:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Kyle? My gosh, all of those things that you just said is everything you have to do to play survivor.

[01:00:40] [SPEAKER_02]: And I appreciate the fact that he doesn't want to hurt people. And I appreciate the fact that he

[01:00:44] [SPEAKER_02]: doesn't want to cause people distress. And I appreciate that he doesn't want to destroy people's

[01:00:48] [SPEAKER_02]: dreams, but that's what you do when you play this game. Everyone's dream gets destroyed except one

[01:00:53] [SPEAKER_02]: person. Right? So it's unfortunate that Kyle walked into playing survivor with that mindset and not

[01:01:00] [SPEAKER_02]: realizing that he was going to have to do all of those things. And he needed to find the balance.

[01:01:06] [SPEAKER_02]: We have had nice people win survivor. You've already mentioned it. He reminds me so much of JT and JT one

[01:01:13] [SPEAKER_04]: JT was a nice guy, but he got there. And so it was a nice guy till he totally threw his best pal in

[01:01:19] [SPEAKER_02]: the game under the bus, but he figured it out. Right. And so it, it's one of those situations where you

[01:01:26] [SPEAKER_02]: have to find that balance. You can be the nice guy, but you can still be the nice guy that wins.

[01:01:30] [SPEAKER_02]: And unfortunately, Kyle didn't put himself in a position to be the nice guy that would win because

[01:01:35] [SPEAKER_02]: he didn't formulate the strategy to get there. And then he was relying so heavily on his need to win

[01:01:42] [SPEAKER_02]: challenges that he forgot that there's a whole other level to this game that he should have been

[01:01:47] [SPEAKER_02]: doing way at the beginning. And he didn't. So unfortunately, Kyle walked into this game without

[01:01:53] [SPEAKER_02]: having a plan. And I know I've said before, you can't necessarily come in with a plan because you

[01:01:58] [SPEAKER_02]: don't know who you're going to be playing with. And so you might not get what you want as far as your

[01:02:02] [SPEAKER_02]: plan is concerned, but you have to have some type of a plan and coming in knowing you don't want to

[01:02:07] [SPEAKER_02]: hurt people. That's not enough of a plan. You have to figure out how you can hurt them. And then they

[01:02:11] [SPEAKER_02]: still want to vote you as the winner in the end. And unfortunately, Kyle did not do that.

[01:02:16] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. Hey, you know, we need more people like Kyle in the real world who don't want to hurt people

[01:02:22] [SPEAKER_04]: at our so-called turn. Just not in survival. Yeah. Yeah. I said last week that while Kyle worried

[01:02:30] [SPEAKER_04]: Gabe would come after him, that really wasn't something to be concerned about because everybody

[01:02:35] [SPEAKER_04]: was coming after him if he lost. While perhaps saying everybody was a very slight overstatement,

[01:02:42] [SPEAKER_04]: it was certainly enough people that it didn't matter what he did last time.

[01:02:46] [SPEAKER_04]: I also said last week that we knew Gabe was a big threat. His tribe mates knew it and he knew it.

[01:02:52] [SPEAKER_04]: Now take that and multiply it a few times over and apply it to Kyle. He said at the beginning of

[01:02:58] [SPEAKER_04]: the episode that he felt like he had to win every challenge or he was in trouble. He was right.

[01:03:04] [SPEAKER_04]: Heck, many viewers were surprised he wasn't voted out a couple of weeks ago when he didn't win,

[01:03:08] [SPEAKER_04]: thanks to Genevieve putting the focus on Saul. This time in a similar situation, the others chose

[01:03:16] [SPEAKER_04]: not to go after Genevieve and took out the main target instead. We always say that just because

[01:03:23] [SPEAKER_04]: the reason for a person being voted out seems obvious doesn't mean that's the whole story.

[01:03:28] [SPEAKER_04]: Like I said at the beginning of the podcast, and that is the case even for Kyle. Yes, he was,

[01:03:34] [SPEAKER_04]: of course, a huge threat in challenges and in terms of being well-liked. If he had managed to make it to

[01:03:41] [SPEAKER_04]: the end by using some strategy or convincing people he wasn't actually as big a threat as he seemed,

[01:03:47] [SPEAKER_04]: that would have made him even more of a threat to win. But that's the thing. He would have needed

[01:03:53] [SPEAKER_04]: to use strategy or convince people to do things that went against their own best interest.

[01:03:58] [SPEAKER_04]: And as Kyle himself said at Tribal Council, ultimately, he didn't execute the social game

[01:04:04] [SPEAKER_04]: and the strategy game so well. I would go further and say when it came to the strategic element,

[01:04:10] [SPEAKER_04]: it was almost non-existent for him. It's easy to see why Andy would say Kyle was a one-dimensional

[01:04:15] [SPEAKER_04]: player. Kyle wanted to show nice people can win the game, and they can win the game. Many of them

[01:04:22] [SPEAKER_04]: have won the game. I could go through a list, but I'm not going to. And Kyle is indeed a nice guy.

[01:04:31] [SPEAKER_04]: Being nice isn't enough. You can't just be nice the whole way to get to that point,

[01:04:37] [SPEAKER_04]: to get to the point of being at the end. Kyle finally started to recognize that

[01:04:43] [SPEAKER_04]: just as he was about to be voted out. But as I said earlier, that was far too little,

[01:04:49] [SPEAKER_04]: far too late. You can't make yourself into a huge threat. Keep piling it on and then expect to

[01:04:55] [SPEAKER_04]: escape by just saying, please, please don't vote me out. Kyle had to do something different along the

[01:05:02] [SPEAKER_04]: way. The primary way to have avoided that situation was to play more strategically so he would have had

[01:05:09] [SPEAKER_04]: allies to rely upon rather than just a bunch of friends and sue. Another way would have been to

[01:05:16] [SPEAKER_04]: maybe not win immunity challenges over and over again once he realized he was being looked at as a

[01:05:22] [SPEAKER_04]: threat. Genevieve was right that once you get the stamp of being a threat, it doesn't wash off.

[01:05:29] [SPEAKER_04]: Usually, but there are ways around it. Look at Rachel. She is now in an alliance with one of the

[01:05:35] [SPEAKER_04]: people who was previously trying to target her as a huge threat. More than that, look at people in

[01:05:40] [SPEAKER_04]: the past like Tyson, who played up his shoulder injury to reduce his own threat level. There are ways

[01:05:47] [SPEAKER_04]: around it, but it involves more than winning challenges and being a really nice guy. He needed

[01:05:53] [SPEAKER_04]: to play other aspects of the game, like the really, the most important aspects.

[01:06:01] [SPEAKER_04]: Tini said not taking out Kyle when he didn't win immunity would be the dumbest look ever for them.

[01:06:07] [SPEAKER_04]: And the way things shook out, that was 100% true. But it only ended up that way because of the path

[01:06:14] [SPEAKER_04]: Kyle chose, or more specifically, what he chose not to do. And that is why Kyle lost.

[01:06:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, there we are. Yes. See, so an hour and seven minutes, we've explained to you why

[01:06:29] [SPEAKER_02]: Kyle lost. And it wasn't just because he didn't win immunity. I mean, a chunk of that was Andy,

[01:06:34] [SPEAKER_04]: but you know. That's fair. That's fair. And Rachel. All right. Well, I do want to remind everyone,

[01:06:40] [SPEAKER_04]: before we get to our predictions, you know, hang around. We still got more, uh, that, uh, the,

[01:06:46] [SPEAKER_04]: the rules we just discussed are available in t-shirt form on holiday sale. That's right. Also,

[01:06:52] [SPEAKER_04]: did I say t-shirt form in poster form and in poster on a t-shirt form and in checklist on a t-shirt

[01:06:59] [SPEAKER_04]: form? Uh, the poster, we know the sale is ongoing. Well, cause we control that, uh, till the holidays

[01:07:05] [SPEAKER_04]: actually hit, uh, the t-shirts may be a shorter timeframe. So, you know, be sure to, uh, jump on

[01:07:12] [SPEAKER_04]: that as soon as you can. Uh, again, that is at, uh, Rob has a website.com slash Y X lost feed.

[01:07:21] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. What are we doing now? Where can people reach us? Okay. Um, I was afraid we were doing

[01:07:28] [SPEAKER_02]: predictions and I don't like those. So if you would like to reach us, I am at Jessica Lewis 89,

[01:07:32] [SPEAKER_02]: both on Twitter and on blue sky. I do not get out there as much as this guy though. He is all over

[01:07:40] [SPEAKER_02]: social media. I should mention I'm, uh, at Jessica Lewis six, seven, eight, nine on Instagram,

[01:07:44] [SPEAKER_02]: but you can certainly find me in all of those places. David Bloomberg is a social media guru

[01:07:49] [SPEAKER_02]: and he has so many places all over that he has one link tree that allows you to see all of the ways

[01:07:55] [SPEAKER_02]: in which you can find David Bloomberg with all of his content. So there it is, David, take it away.

[01:07:59] [SPEAKER_04]: Yes. Uh, you can find that at link tree slash David Bloomberg with a dot before the E E in the URL.

[01:08:06] [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, you can find me, uh, more directly on blue sky is at David Bloomberg on threads is at David

[01:08:13] [SPEAKER_04]: Bloomberg TV. I am still on Twitter is at David Bloomberg, but I'm not encouraging that anymore.

[01:08:18] [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, I am definitely pulling away from that. I am posting things there. I am not,

[01:08:23] [SPEAKER_04]: I am not live tweeting the episode there anymore. Uh, but, uh, so, you know, blue sky is where it's at.

[01:08:30] [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, and you know, for all of our HAP, a lot of people have jumped there and a lot of survivor

[01:08:36] [SPEAKER_04]: discussion. So, um, I am of course also on the video platforms, YouTube, TikTok, and Instagram is

[01:08:43] [SPEAKER_04]: at David Bloomberg TV. Uh, I've been posting two or three or occasionally more videos per day.

[01:08:49] [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, I'm now over 42,000 subscribers on YouTube. Uh, just past that. Uh, so I encourage people to

[01:08:56] [SPEAKER_04]: join the fun there. Uh, of course, right now I'm posting clips like, uh, you know, mostly from

[01:09:02] [SPEAKER_04]: survivor, uh, uh, the summit house of villains, and of course the traders Canada. Uh, speaking of

[01:09:08] [SPEAKER_04]: the traders Canada, I am still co-hosting the trade our podcast. That's T R A I D A R, uh,

[01:09:15] [SPEAKER_04]: for the traders Canada season two, we have the finale coming in just one day as we're recording

[01:09:22] [SPEAKER_04]: this. Um, and, uh, you know, we will be having the winner of season one as our guest for the finale

[01:09:30] [SPEAKER_04]: season two podcast. So you can look, you know, you can look for that, uh, in a, in a couple of days.

[01:09:37] [SPEAKER_04]: Excellent. All right. Well, now it's time for predictions.

[01:09:44] [SPEAKER_04]: Hmm. I'll go first. Um, so I'm probably going to agree with you. Okay. Uh, it's just, you know,

[01:09:50] [SPEAKER_04]: that's generally just a good thing to do is just agree with it is. Um, so the preview showed us

[01:09:56] [SPEAKER_04]: Genevieve making a fake idol or maybe doing something with Sam's expired idol. Andy appeared to be working

[01:10:03] [SPEAKER_04]: with her and Sam while Sam said, Andy is the straw that stirs the drink. And this is what he's been

[01:10:08] [SPEAKER_04]: waiting for. And Andy saying, this is the biggest heist on survivor. So the preview at least wants us

[01:10:14] [SPEAKER_04]: to think Andy is flipping to work with Sam and Genevieve. The thing is, I don't believe it for a

[01:10:21] [SPEAKER_04]: second. Um, I know on, I think it was know-it-alls again, I listened to know-it-alls in the patron

[01:10:27] [SPEAKER_04]: podcast back to back while I was driving. So, uh, get a little confused between them, but,

[01:10:33] [SPEAKER_04]: uh, there was some consideration that maybe what will happen is Genevieve or Sam will show the idol.

[01:10:40] [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, the, the underdogs will say we have to split the vote three and two. And then, uh, maybe Andy

[01:10:47] [SPEAKER_04]: will use this to jump with Sam and Genevieve to vote out one of the underdogs, uh, because it'll be

[01:10:54] [SPEAKER_04]: three to two to two. Um, I, I, sorry, I don't buy it. Um, you know, first because it's a preview and

[01:11:02] [SPEAKER_04]: they notoriously mislead us in the previews more importantly, because Andy is a numbers guy and it

[01:11:08] [SPEAKER_04]: would be silly to jump from a five to a three at this point. Yep. So he would jump over with Sam and

[01:11:15] [SPEAKER_04]: Genevieve, get rid of one of the other four and it would become a three, three with,

[01:11:24] [SPEAKER_04]: everybody pissed at him. Yeah. Um, so I think he is just misleading Sam and Genevieve much like he

[01:11:33] [SPEAKER_04]: was misleading, uh, Annika and Rachel earlier this season. And, and I say that with both meanings

[01:11:39] [SPEAKER_04]: that in his mind, he's making a big move by doing it. And also that in reality, it's not going to

[01:11:43] [SPEAKER_04]: matter because the target was going to be the target anyway. So when Andy says, this is the biggest

[01:11:48] [SPEAKER_04]: heist, I think we're going to see it's actually not, I think it's going to, uh, you know,

[01:11:54] [SPEAKER_04]: unfortunately for people who like big swings and big surprises, I think it's going to be the obvious

[01:11:59] [SPEAKER_04]: Genevieve will be going and, you know, she would have been going anyway.

[01:12:03] [SPEAKER_02]: And I agree that it's going to be Genevieve, but I do feel like maybe what Andy is talking about

[01:12:09] [SPEAKER_02]: is the big heist being, he's going to pull the wall over Genevieve's eyes, right? That he's

[01:12:14] [SPEAKER_02]: going to convince Genevieve that this is what we're doing. And that one, and I know we, you know,

[01:12:19] [SPEAKER_02]: the previews sometimes, but that she's like, Oh my gosh, if the, if, if this works. Right. So I

[01:12:25] [SPEAKER_02]: think that perhaps he's trying to lure her in because he was so dead set at wanting her to be

[01:12:31] [SPEAKER_02]: gone that I would anticipate, yes, he is a numbers guy and he's going to try to smooth things over with

[01:12:38] [SPEAKER_02]: her. So then he has convinced her in some way that things will be fine. Maybe she doesn't,

[01:12:44] [SPEAKER_02]: you know, fear doesn't maybe she doesn't try so hard. I don't know. He tries to keep her in line.

[01:12:49] [SPEAKER_04]: And I think Genevieve is going to go home. Yeah. And that would be another similar situation to

[01:12:53] [SPEAKER_04]: what happened with Annika, you know, Genevieve is going anyway. He runs this plan in the background.

[01:12:59] [SPEAKER_04]: Ha ha. I've convinced her. And then they vote her out and it really has no impact.

[01:13:05] [SPEAKER_04]: Right. But he thinks it does. Yes. All right. Well, as we wrap up, I want to once again,

[01:13:10] [SPEAKER_04]: encourage people to check out the RHAP patron program at Rob has a website.com slash patron.

[01:13:15] [SPEAKER_04]: Um, as I mentioned, currently there is a big 47% off your first month sale. Uh, and I don't know

[01:13:23] [SPEAKER_04]: exactly how long that goes. So hurry up. Um, you know, and of course, uh, you get access to all the

[01:13:30] [SPEAKER_04]: special podcasts like the patron call-in show. I was just referencing, um, and the Facebook groups and

[01:13:36] [SPEAKER_04]: discord and you get to support our show and everything on the network by becoming a patron

[01:13:42] [SPEAKER_04]: at Rob has a website.com slash patron. Uh, also make sure you're subscribed to all of the RHAP

[01:13:48] [SPEAKER_04]: survivor podcasts by going to, we know survivor.com. You can see all of those podcasts there. You can

[01:13:55] [SPEAKER_04]: select your podcast service of choice. Uh, there's a ton of great content there, uh, from the know-it-alls,

[01:14:01] [SPEAKER_04]: the B and B survivor international purple pants podcast. It's all there in one place in one feed.

[01:14:07] [SPEAKER_02]: So go and do that. You definitely should do that. There is so much incredible content. We would like

[01:14:12] [SPEAKER_02]: to thank everyone who is in charge of making this all happen for you all. Thank you, Scott St. Pierre

[01:14:17] [SPEAKER_02]: and Jessica Sterling for the producing, the editing, and just the incredible work that you do, not just

[01:14:23] [SPEAKER_02]: for our podcast, but all of the content that you just heard David Bloomberg speak about mostly ours.

[01:14:29] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. And then we also would like to thank the RHAP, RHAP staff and team for all of the work that you do.

[01:14:35] [SPEAKER_02]: There is so much that goes on behind the scenes. You have no idea. So you should definitely support

[01:14:40] [SPEAKER_02]: RHAP in every way that you can. If you love this content as we do, please support. And then thank

[01:14:46] [SPEAKER_02]: you, Doug, for the art cover that you've created for the survivor podcast. We really appreciate that

[01:14:51] [SPEAKER_02]: very much. It's beautiful. And Will from America for the theme song that you hear. If you are just

[01:14:56] [SPEAKER_02]: listening, not looking at our beautiful faces, you can hear the beautiful tunes of Will from America.

[01:15:02] [SPEAKER_02]: So thank you for that. We appreciate it. And David Bloomberg, this has been lovely. Thank you so much

[01:15:07] [SPEAKER_02]: for the after holiday moment that I've been able to spend with you. Oh, well, thank you. Yes. Yes.

[01:15:13] [SPEAKER_04]: Thank you for joining me once again for another great week. Thank you for your flexibility

[01:15:19] [SPEAKER_04]: and scheduling as we've had to do all this. It was following the rules, being flexible. That's right.

[01:15:24] [SPEAKER_04]: That's right. Especially this time. So everybody else, we will see you really, you know, it'll be

[01:15:31] [SPEAKER_04]: less than a week. It'll seem like just a few days by the time we see you again, or at least you see us.

[01:15:39] [SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, looking forward to the next episode. And till then, see you next time. Bye.

[01:15:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Bye.