David Bloomberg and Jessica Lewis are excited to welcome Survivor 43’s James Jones to talk about the complexities of the mergeatory vote! Despite the fact that Moriah was on the outs of the Siga vote just before, her tribe tried to keep an appearance of unity rather than immediately throwing her under the bus. How did it backfire and cause the exact opposite result as she was targeted as a threat? What role did Moriah being an Aubry fan play? It’s time for David, Jessica, and James to figure out Why Moriah Lost.[00:00:00] Step into the world of power, loyalty and luck.
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[00:01:36] Hey, it's Rob.
[00:01:36] Happy Mergitory Week to all those who observe.
[00:01:40] Of course, we got the week started on RHAP with my post game interview with Dr.
[00:01:46] Abby Jigoda and of course the Know It Alls and exit interview.
[00:01:50] But if you want even more survivor, make sure to check out James Jones, who always has interesting stuff to say.
[00:01:56] He's on Why Blank Lost this week with David and Jessica and Drag Race fans.
[00:02:02] Make sure you're checking in with Leana, Beth and Amon on our Drag Race for Hap-Hop after every episode of Drag Race Season 16.
[00:02:11] That's all right here on RHAP.
[00:02:13] We know, reality TV.
[00:02:26] You're playing yourself and got voted out.
[00:02:30] This is why blank lost.
[00:02:34] And this is why blank lost.
[00:02:37] Baby, this is why blank lost.
[00:02:48] Welcome back to Why Blank Lost.
[00:02:50] I'm David Bloomberg and this week's survivor episode was all about two things.
[00:02:55] Rock draws and determining who the biggest threat was.
[00:02:58] So it's perfect that my co-host Jessica Lewis is an expert on one and our special guest, James Jones, is an expert on the other.
[00:03:08] Yay for us.
[00:03:16] Oh God, I don't know if I really want to be the expert on rock draws but son of a gun.
[00:03:21] I guess I kind of am.
[00:03:23] I mean you're one of very few, you know.
[00:03:29] Can we just get rid of the rock draws already?
[00:03:31] Come on. Just stop it.
[00:03:33] Oh well, we'll get to that.
[00:03:35] Yeah, we will get to that but I do want to explain a little bit for those who may not know why I singled out James in terms of being an expert on threats.
[00:03:44] This is a topic that he has discussed on Twitter and elsewhere and he and I have talked repeatedly about this ever since his season.
[00:03:53] So everyone, you should definitely be looking forward to the sixth rule because...
[00:03:58] Listen, I was actually, yes, I was in my head when prepping for this thinking of myself.
[00:04:04] I can't wait till we get to rule six because James is going to be like here we go.
[00:04:08] I got this.
[00:04:10] Yeah.
[00:04:11] But of course we can't jump to that because we have a process to go through first.
[00:04:16] We will compare Mariah's game to my rules for winning that I originally wrote way back after season one.
[00:04:22] It had been updating ever since using all the non-spoiler information available to us from what we saw on TV, interviews, social media and secret scenes.
[00:04:32] The newest version of the rules can, of course, be found on our dedicated page at RobHesonWebsite.com.
[00:04:38] YRX lost feed and clicking on the link bubble for the survivor rules.
[00:04:42] But before we get to all of that, James, how are you?
[00:04:47] I am doing great.
[00:04:48] I feel like this is a long time coming.
[00:04:50] It is.
[00:04:51] Uh huh.
[00:04:52] I feel like I listened to the podcast for a while, especially since before I went on the show.
[00:04:58] So I've been a long time listener and I'm excited to communicate, probably agree a little bit, debate a little bit and see where everything stands.
[00:05:11] But so I'm definitely excited.
[00:05:14] So when I first heard about the rules and I wrote my rules, they're very extensive and I did listen to any of them.
[00:05:22] But I think like seven is a good amount of, but I feel like having a set of rules is a very, a set of tenets.
[00:05:31] I call them tenets.
[00:05:32] Yes.
[00:05:33] It's a good way to think about the game before you go in and just going through those tenets each day is probably something that's very helpful to keep you told if you do play it on playing.
[00:05:41] Yeah.
[00:05:42] Yeah.
[00:05:43] Yeah.
[00:05:44] Yeah.
[00:05:45] And just so everyone understands why it was a long time coming, we were just trying to get schedules matched up and then we'd be like, oh, we can have you this week up.
[00:05:53] Nope.
[00:05:54] He's doing this other podcast this week.
[00:05:56] You know, it just, you know, and so, but we, we finally pushed through and we got it.
[00:06:01] So yeah, yay for calendars.
[00:06:04] We're trying to break the podcast record to Mary Ann style.
[00:06:07] No, we're not.
[00:06:08] Just no, no, no.
[00:06:10] Just kidding.
[00:06:11] Just kidding.
[00:06:13] So before we get to the rules themselves, we always have some other things to discuss from this episode.
[00:06:22] And the first thing that I wanted to bring up is an interesting twist I noticed in the most recent two challenges, putting everybody on the puzzle this time and putting everybody on the slingshot the previous time.
[00:06:39] And I know Rob mentioned this too on one of his podcasts, but I wanted to bring it up just because I like it.
[00:06:46] It is, you know, we always talk about the puzzle as an equalizer and I know Jessica just loves a challenge that ends in a puzzle.
[00:06:53] My favorite.
[00:06:55] To me, this is a further equalizer because you know, it, you can't just pick your one or two puzzle people or you can't just say Hunter go shoot that slingshot three times, you know, or, or whatever.
[00:07:09] And in this particular episode, it could have helped out the smaller team as it turned out.
[00:07:17] Well, the expected team still won.
[00:07:19] But at least made it a challenge. You know, as the smaller group got within supposedly a couple of puzzle pieces at one point.
[00:07:28] I think one of the main problems is Hunter isn't just a physical threat but a puzzle threat to so you know he was able to just jam right through that last part.
[00:07:39] Yeah. And when you build them and practice ahead of time, you have a little bit of an edge on other people.
[00:07:47] And Hunter's defense and in Carson's defense as well.
[00:07:52] You should practice these puzzles, like you should buy these puzzles should practice these puzzles. Like you should like even like before I went on the season like I went through every single new era puzzle, except the picture.
[00:08:04] Just though I had, you know, before they do the puzzle, they show a fast way of putting the pieces together.
[00:08:11] So I literally had a video of all the pieces and how fast they put them together.
[00:08:17] So when we got that turtle puzzle, I knew the outside room was the outside room.
[00:08:22] I was able to say put the shelves in the middle and these were the these spots.
[00:08:26] You are like you have to do that if you're going to shut once you get that phone call, you need to study the puzzles like this is kind of now studying the logos. I don't know like that.
[00:08:39] I listen we might have a little bit of a debate here on the puzzle thing because the thing that I don't like is that
[00:08:47] to me, the one thing that was so great about survivor was the unknown that you didn't know what was going to be thrust upon you. You didn't know what was going to be happening and you had to prepare for everything and anything right.
[00:09:00] And so we've kind of lost that by this repetitiveness with Fiji because they are repeating things so often.
[00:09:07] And it really I think it's turning it into more of just like a game show because everyone knows what the showcase showdown looks like right you know everyone knows what, like these particular types of game shows that we see how they're structured and what this means and how do you play
[00:09:22] and how do you go and all of the you know I mean, and all these things and so that's the part that I always loved about survivor is that it was the unknown you didn't know what was going to happen and so that you could prepare physically, you could prepare mentally as much as
[00:09:35] you could, but you shouldn't be able to memorize puzzles and then when you see go. That's the puzzle I memorized right there and so I know how to do it. And I'm not saying that you're wrong because this is what they're doing.
[00:09:46] I'm not saying that you're going on to survivor knowing that they have been repetitive and they've been doing things over and over again, you have to you 100% have to at this point because that's what they're going to keep doing.
[00:09:57] But as a viewer and as someone who has watched the show since the beginning. I just don't like it I want it to be new I wanted to be fresh I don't want it to be repeat. That's just me.
[00:10:07] I mean it's the difference between what a player should do and what production should do a player should practice memorize as much as they can these puzzle production should not reuse the puzzles over and over again.
[00:10:20] And I mean the thing is you can still even if it's not the exact same, you can still figure certain things out like you said James if you've studied them.
[00:10:29] I think you should I mean you can practice walking on a balance beam, you can practice landing sandbags on a little you know something above you, you can practice knocking down, you know things with sandbags or throwing balls or shooting a big slingshot probably a little more than most people can do.
[00:10:48] But all those things can be practiced so right. Yeah memorize the puzzles to.
[00:10:55] I think that the tough part is for me.
[00:11:00] And I agree with the fact that I benefited from actually seeing the puzzles and understanding and that stuff to within also I feel like sometimes you don't have to be so grandiose.
[00:11:12] I think that survivor has gotten less physical because they don't get injuries.
[00:11:18] Oh my God yes, but this is actually part of the game like some of my favorite challenges where somebody holds a pole and you're pulling someone off the pole.
[00:11:27] I mean, has like, I feel like it's trying to take away the injury risk and I get all that and understand all that. But at the same time some of those physical you put someone off the like from a game show standpoint is when you're taking away the physical aspects of the show
[00:11:45] and you're like, oh, if fire is less important. I think fires are important. Other people don't but I think fires are for you. We are taking away the physical stuff but then you're also taking the making the mental stuff easier you're skewing the game, like away from like physical
[00:12:01] people which is fine. But then if you're going to do that, you know long term, then that's a different show than where you have people on a pole and people at different strips and different weaknesses and
[00:12:12] Yes. And a lot of that to James is like if there's a mental component there like how bad do you want it when you're doing those physical challenges where you just it's stamina and you just have to stand there as long as you can.
[00:12:25] It doesn't matter who's necessarily stronger than the next person, it can really come down to your mental strength and where you are and how bad do you want this. Those are my favorite challenges the ones that really push people physically and mentally.
[00:12:39] And that's why I'm going to just I love Australian survivor because they seem to be more geared towards those types of challenges still where it is that mental strength in addition to the physical strength as well.
[00:12:52] To me, those are the best challenges possible so I think I think yeah 100% I'm with you on that physical challenges need to come back, please.
[00:13:01] I'm going to do a challenge, maybe eat a dirty eyes. Yeah, like certain things from a like mental standpoint where it's like, you know, they have to be this big grandiose thing is like no there's an eyeball here.
[00:13:14] Who wants $1 million. Here's a movie larvae eat that.
[00:13:19] Like that stuff to me is is just the television as you know, putting people up, you know, a big set piece like maybe there's just one poll and you're playing cornhole.
[00:13:30] Like you were playing yeah, hold musical chairs like it doesn't actually matter. But it's kind of like, you know, that's just my thought process, my feelings, and I feel it love survivor like I need to get a VPN to watch I'm showing a survivor.
[00:13:44] And it's like, get there. And but I just, I just, I like sometimes that being maybe being a physical person being and I'm not a big person I'm like five eight like I'm not that big but people are looking at me like I'm this big athletic thread.
[00:14:01] I'm 36 I'm old like the oldest guy here that's the gamer.
[00:14:06] You're old. Come on.
[00:14:09] Correct. I apologize.
[00:14:15] You can go with it.
[00:14:17] I do think it was nice that they made everybody be involved. Yes, I do think that that was, I was definitely good to see. Yeah, get everyone involved so it's not one person doing everything right right and if someone tells you to play them.
[00:14:30] I feel like that's also great for it.
[00:14:33] Like, yeah, make everybody do something so you can't blame everybody right.
[00:14:38] Right.
[00:14:39] Yeah, James speaking of, you know, Australian survivor and some of the challenges they have there. They had a charades challenge. Okay. Now it was a few years back, but it was hysterical. It's still talked about today. So,
[00:14:53] I'm not sure what it is.
[00:14:55] But all right, well on a completely different topic. I want to discuss how Venus tweeted out a lot of things after the episode.
[00:15:07] So much that I was surprised it was allowed but hey, I'm in favor of it. Keep it coming. I love it.
[00:15:14] Me too. I love this. I love the tea.
[00:15:17] Now, we will discuss some of these things later in Appendix A and probably some of them in a why Venus lost podcast at some point.
[00:15:27] But what I want to address now kind of sets the tone and that's why I'm talking about it now because Venus tweeted, can I tell you all that the reason Charlie voted me was because I gave him advice that Mariah was likely going to use her shot in the dark.
[00:15:45] And we should think of that potential threat. So, and then all caps he took my advice to him and voted me. But here's the thing. Charlie clearly saw this and tweeted reason I voted Venus.
[00:16:00] One, everyone told me she was saying my name. Two, I knew Moe was playing her shot in the dark way before Venus who told me Moe did.
[00:16:10] So to protect myself and Maria from a ricochet vote, I voted for the person saying my name up and down the beach. That's it.
[00:16:18] Now, the reason I wanted to bring this up is like I said, it sets the tone because Venus is seeing things only from her perspective and isn't considering that there could be others.
[00:16:33] In this particular case, Charlie had a direct response to this by pointing out that she was not in fact the one who told him from her point of view she was because she didn't know about the other conversations that he had.
[00:16:46] So, and then he knew she was spreading his name. So of course he would want her out.
[00:16:54] And again, I mentioned this now because while this specific instance didn't impact on the vote.
[00:17:03] I want the stage already set when we start talking about some of the other things she said later in appendix a in terms of her perspective versus the perspective of everyone else in the game, because not everything is this clear this cut and drive.
[00:17:18] And this one is so I think it's a good thing to put out there and say, we've got perspective issues here.
[00:17:25] Yeah, I mean I think the unfortunate thing that happens with the game is that perception becomes reality right we've talked about that a lot so if that's what people are seeing that's what people are believing, but that doesn't mean it's always true.
[00:17:39] And, yeah, and rumors abound and people aren't honest when they play survivors so it's not like you're going to have all of the pieces of the information you need to make a decision.
[00:17:51] You have to take as much as you believe to be true and kind of say well this is where I'm going with that and this is what I'm doing.
[00:17:58] Yes, then you find out things like this after the fact when you're allowed to apparently talk on Twitter about what happened in the game even though think you were allowed to do that.
[00:18:07] Right James.
[00:18:09] I had a lot of tweets I wanted to let off but for me, I like it. I feel like I play this is how you what survivor is right where everybody has different perspectives and you're getting an insight into the game where, you know you only have your perspective
[00:18:26] so from your perspective you're playing the game, but you know how playing the game have an experience understand where someone doesn't understand that a person that gave them information already gave you that information so they're coming to you and you know that they're
[00:18:40] right. I got like this is actually how survivor works from a right information and communication standpoint where from my outside of the end, this can be also a view to producers when a producer may not show Charlie talk with them right and they didn't show
[00:18:53] you.
[00:18:54] Sorry, so you get these conversations happening and you're like Oh, I'm like this is the perfect kind of understanding of the back end where Oh how come this person into this or why the person do this.
[00:19:05] There's so many things happening on the back end from relationship that yeah may not see as a player where why someone's name you get resistance like Oh, I want to vote this person out it's like, no one's got to vote out Carla.
[00:19:19] You're like, why is no one trying to put out Carla. Like what's happening. You know she's a clear thread like Carla is very insulated, but you don't understand who she's insulated with so when you're communicating.
[00:19:31] Oh, I was on this person ever since I'm really coming back to like, yeah. So now we had that conversation. You're coming from it like I'm having this conversation. They're coming from it. I know what you said.
[00:19:44] Now I'm sussing out information to further my game or to bury you or to take mental notes. I think that's kind of what that this that those exchanges demonstrating of how things happen on the island versus how they're shown from a production standpoint, which is fine either way.
[00:20:03] I think it's just a good if you're objective listener and of information is a good way to think about the game where you can take an information understand. Oh, why does person do this is just think a little more into it instead of jumping to the first conclusion about
[00:20:17] Right. Yeah. Yeah, I information is really power when you're out there. It really is but you do have to work through it and sort through it as best you can.
[00:20:26] Yeah, I think that you know one of the biggest recent seasons where this came up and people couldn't or barely could say anything was 44 when on TV. It looked like if you were just watching the TV show it looked like Jamie and Lauren were completely clueless and just doing whatever anyone said.
[00:20:46] And finally one of them I don't remember which of them.
[00:20:49] One of them.
[00:20:51] It was Lord tweeted something like no this is not the way it happened you're not you know, you could tell it was pent up and even she didn't go into any of this detail. And that's when Jessica and I are like on the podcast like something is going on here.
[00:21:07] We're not exactly sure what right something is going on here that you know is more and we gradually built the picture up until finally interviews but even before then we were like, you know, they are not just a couple of idiots here they're being let along or
[00:21:25] something else. Yeah, is happening here. And so yeah I can only imagine you know sitting there being like I'm being made to look like I'm a fool and they're completely cutting out the part where yes was I conned yes I was conned.
[00:21:44] And I would have appreciated when they showed that I was being conned at one point they didn't and then you look like a fool right you're like, that's not what happened but they also have to make a TV show out of it so it's hard.
[00:21:57] And that's the good survivor like when it gets to five players that you don't see on television where if someone feels a certain way is because a player is making them feel a certain way this like if someone feels on the outs because players are making the full
[00:22:12] out but like one feels like they're on the end but they're really on the outs that's a survivor play but it's hard to say like if someone's on the tribe is like I'm running the show, but they're on the bottom.
[00:22:24] That's really good survivor play by everybody else on that side. Right. And then when that person watch this show they're like God darn it.
[00:22:35] But if you don't show that it's like that person has to provide a we don't show the conversation the person. Oh yeah we're good. We're tight. Yeah, you don't show that those two conversations that make why that person feels that way is like, you know that's what happens and you have to kind of read that and assume.
[00:22:51] And that's kind of thing once you found that if you're a big fan of the show and you've seen on outcome just understand what's in it like your things happening below the scene.
[00:22:59] And they're not casting horrible players like the baseline for a bad player now is so much higher than it was back in the day.
[00:23:07] I know maybe one or two maybe one or two per season, you know, but yeah.
[00:23:16] Let's have more evidence.
[00:23:18] Let's let's less than several will just say, um,
[00:23:24] Well, you know, I think it's it's a good thing to make, you know, to note now because they are casting people who are super fans or more fans of the show whereas at the beginning when survivors.
[00:23:36] The first time I saw the show was when the survivor was old school. Some people were like literally sitting on a bench and had never seen survivor before but someone from casting saw them and what you'll be perfect for survivor and put them on the show.
[00:23:48] They don't do that anymore. And so I think that it's, it's, it's noted now much more than it was before so the fact that like this actually came up this episode when Q was like so how long have you been watching.
[00:24:00] Yeah. Who did you like as a player? You know, I mean, like those are conversations that just didn't happen in old school survivor where it did, you know, some people had never even seen the show before but they're like, oh, survivor,
[00:24:11] I'll go live on an island. This will be great. And I had no idea what the show was about. So it's a much different, it's a much different playing field now.
[00:24:18] Yeah. Like, all green big threat that scares me.
[00:24:21] Right. We'll get there.
[00:24:23] Yeah, we'll get to that. So now there were of course other things going on. I'll you know put some of them on my tiktoks at David Bloomberg TV. Is there anything else that either of you wanted to discuss before we move on to our next segment?
[00:24:40] Our next segment. Our next segment. So let me so because I want to complain about you know the whole mergetory again but I don't know if now is the time to do that.
[00:24:51] Oh, man.
[00:24:53] Oh, my sorry. Oh, my sorry.
[00:24:56] Well, what do you want to complain about it?
[00:25:01] I just would prefer that they don't do this split where you have seven that are safe and six that are not. I'm like let's not do that. Let's not do that.
[00:25:13] Let's increase the tension. Let's have teams. Let's have it where you had to not. You get a correct answer. You knocked someone's thing down. Like, let's make people draw.
[00:25:25] Oh, you were. Yes, those those challenges were used to like have to shoot people's targets out and you got to pick like who's you got each person at three targets. Oh, those were the best because it really upset people that was.
[00:25:37] That's what you want to do at Merge because you want to break up this whole like, you know, like if you want people to break up, you say, are cool. You're going to break up and actually have to make some choices when people get high behind not having to vote and then not voting.
[00:25:52] And, you know, it could be two votes where they don't have to show their cards and do people that do, you know, just, you know, breaks of the game. But for me, I feel like, you know, picking teams, oh, you're picking on your team.
[00:26:05] Oh, oh, you're going to hit my my thing down first.
[00:26:09] Like those seven things, those little agitations and little things like I think that as the way the game especially when people don't know each other like you need to for a day.
[00:26:20] Oh, we have his competition teams of two. Oh, you got knocked another team of twos thing off right. You know, like the first two teams wouldn't be even other six people or eight people are there's ways to do it where it's not just like a rock draw with no type of it is the first time it
[00:26:38] happened. And I remember watching it. I was just like, you know, like, and this also shows also showed that communication is was way better than Bruce shrimp because the other team was really communicating really well and that's the first
[00:26:51] of challenges a lot of times more than we should. Right. However, it's just kind of like, I just think that agency aspect and like cranking up the tension, like let's crank up the tension, let's crank up the adversity, because you're still allowed to stay in these tribal
[00:27:07] shells to merge it so we need to act where as two people you're shooting out targets. And, you know, like, I feel like that's as tension. I like this episode. I'm a that's just me. So me too.
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[00:28:49] It is Ryan here and I have a question for you. What do you do when you win? Like, are you a fist pumper? A hand clap or a high fiver? I kind of like the high five.
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[00:29:30] Well, yeah, as it happens, the next segment is Jeff Probst is run about blank.
[00:29:37] We're going to have to come back again this week. And it is a topic that you guys have already touched on. It's near and dear to your heart, Jessica. Rock draws.
[00:29:49] In fact, he really rubbed it in because this episode of Jeff's podcast is named drawing rocks.
[00:29:58] And he says he enjoys them because they're dangerous fun.
[00:30:04] Dangerous fun.
[00:30:07] Yeah, listen. Okay, I will say this. There is a difference between the rock draw that I did and the rock draws that are creating the division in a team like this for mergers Tory.
[00:30:21] I will say and James, I'm sure can speak to this. Whenever you are going out to a challenge and you have to they'll they will literally have you draw rock prior to so they know what position to put you in like if it's something that's an individualized spot.
[00:30:37] That's how they kind of designate spaces. So there is that component to the drawing as well.
[00:30:42] I do think that in situations like this, unless it unless it's coming down to it's a Tyvo and people can agree, you are forcing them to have to do something incredibly terrible and drastic and that's drawing rocks that's different.
[00:30:57] Did I do it yes was it awful Yes, did I have to yes. So we've already addressed all of those things. But in this type of situation, when you have a group of 13 people do the do the picking teams thing force them to have to.
[00:31:11] Put it on blast who they are working with who they want to work with who they don't care to work with have them fight over hunter who's you know I mean I can remember when we did the pick teams for one of our challenges.
[00:31:24] I wanted to hide behind the people I was standing next to when I saw who were the captains and how the teams were being divided, because I was like, please don't pick me please don't pick me and then she picked me and I was like God darn it now I'm on that and we got our asses handed to us.
[00:31:43] I mean it was terrible. I was awful, but it was a choice and I just feel like the picking of the teams. It just adds so much because then of course there had to be some justification as to why you chose the team you chose, because now you look like you have no idea what
[00:32:01] you're doing because you picked everybody who's like this tall and like not brute strength and this is like a brute strength challenge and it makes people have to like justify what they did so please let's not have a rock draw decide people's potential to win a million
[00:32:18] I just because as a you know you are a warrior about where you just that argument you articulated was beautiful in the sense it's just it's not much I can add it's more just like this agency like I think agency as tension and
[00:32:37] I'm inside rock draw I feel like I got the bad end of rock draw I got the worst rock draw of my season. Call it being scarred. I mean you're more scarred than me just so you should be.
[00:32:49] I think any other rock draw I've been fine my season but people can debate that I think I'm living good but you know that it's just kind of like you want people want to have control people have agency and I feel like those things allow them to do so.
[00:33:05] And from a game mechanic standpoint it just makes more sense where I look at the challenge of an ally that people view me as a good challenge person right now I have an ally that may not be views a good challenge person if that's my number one right now I have to make a choice.
[00:33:23] My community or my ally right or can't jump or even even more than that let's say they were doing a.
[00:33:35] Pick a school yard pick for splitting the group for this challenge knowing one group would be vulnerable and one would not. Now first of all we still hate that seven people are are safe but if you're going to continue doing that well then you have to look at it
[00:33:50] and go OK do I want someone I mean you know if you're if you're one of the NAMI you probably want to pick Venus because you know that Venus is most on the outs among your tribe and.
[00:34:07] There's different. Yeah so there's different reasons for picking different people right and so it is just a lot more actual strategy instead of this nonsense that Jeff wants and you can literally put your own game on blast because people will see what you are doing
[00:34:24] right and people will talk about the choice that was made and why why did so and so pick me you know Venus would have been asking like why'd you pick me first. Yeah.
[00:34:37] That was crazy because I immediately thought TV is things that I wanted to do but couldn't do imagine this picking it you know you're good right so you pick a losing team with everybody and all the options yeah OK.
[00:34:47] I'm going to I'm going to help all my friends out put them on the team. I'm not there. I'm going to everybody that I think is going to help me lose the challenge knowing that I'm going to be good like it is all the strategic stuff in this pop up like yes like you get a naturally Charlie could have won it actually chose this type of team.
[00:35:08] Yeah.
[00:35:09] It wouldn't be good knowing that I've covered on this other side. Yeah.
[00:35:12] But then a natural outcome which would have been felt more like a choice in the decision as a right.
[00:35:18] Right.
[00:35:19] Right.
[00:35:20] This rock will happen and we're like well yeah if the other team moves it's kind of just like you know they should win.
[00:35:26] Even Jeff was like oh we know who's going to win this one. Yeah.
[00:35:30] Come on Jeff.
[00:35:33] It's terrible. It's terrible. Yes.
[00:35:36] All right. Well before we move on to how Mariah did we do want to mention that the rules were about to discuss are available in a shorter and much more colorful version in poster form.
[00:35:49] So go to Rob his website dot com slash YX lost feed scroll down to the poster click on it order it buy it have it sent to you.
[00:35:58] I just ordered a fresh new batch.
[00:36:00] Oh wow.
[00:36:01] Yes I had to get and I and I I mailed out to send a little printing. Look at that. Yes third printing I sent a little letter to each of the individuals who purchased because the posters that I had to send them.
[00:36:14] I was like I always look at them to make sure everything is perfect and these ones had there was a little bit of a wrinkle in each of them but I didn't have any other options so I sent them a signed photograph of myself and I apologize and said if you want a different one let me know I'm getting a fresh batch.
[00:36:26] So I don't have any if you if you send me some that we could do that. Nobody wants that nobody needs.
[00:36:35] Oh they I'm sure they do David listen nobody wants my grubby dirty pictures. You remember what I looked like on the show was terrible.
[00:36:44] Oh my God I'm embarrassed for myself still.
[00:36:47] No they want you to sign the poster. Yeah you are a survivor.
[00:36:55] Inspirations will out of people so they want that.
[00:36:58] That was so sweet.
[00:37:00] You made it better than me. Yeah.
[00:37:02] You made it better than me.
[00:37:03] You're my inspiration.
[00:37:05] Oh you're talking about me.
[00:37:06] Oh my God well thank you.
[00:37:08] I thought you were talking about David.
[00:37:09] Well I appreciate that.
[00:37:10] Thank you.
[00:37:11] Thank you very much.
[00:37:12] I'm glad I'm an inspiration.
[00:37:14] It was an incredible opportunity so that's good if I can.
[00:37:18] Give yourself some flowers.
[00:37:19] I think that's the reflection point in the game where like where the game was at a point where people were expecting world to see a lot where you couldn't just at some point you couldn't flip and win the game where expecting to get troubles.
[00:37:32] You know.
[00:37:33] I think that's the best way to get your game.
[00:37:36] You know, you can't just go to a new game where you're like, oh that's a good game play.
[00:37:41] Like well it could be a game play but also just know someone doesn't have to go for you.
[00:37:45] Like yeah it's all right it's all like you can backstab somebody and they're supposed to be your friend and will be made ours is a new concept.
[00:37:52] This is very new.
[00:37:54] I feel like that those these are things that get lost when you kind of think about the bigger things where it's like if I'm your number one and I feel like these things are talked about in a new era especially where I'm your number one you backstab me or run out of line you backstab me.
[00:38:07] You see people get to the end that are part of these big alliances aren't winning.
[00:38:11] So let's just parking like that.
[00:38:14] Yeah.
[00:38:15] Okay.
[00:38:16] And we can keep going.
[00:38:17] All right.
[00:38:18] All right.
[00:38:19] Just what I mentioned before we keep going you can scroll down and get the poster on a t-shirt and also the checklist on a t-shirt.
[00:38:26] So again that is at robhazwebsite.com slash yxlostfeed.
[00:38:31] And I promise where the ponderosa everyone in the shop and they won't vote you out.
[00:38:36] Oh my God.
[00:38:38] You mean pregame ponderosa?
[00:38:43] Yes.
[00:38:44] Pregame.
[00:38:45] You'll make all sorts of new friends.
[00:38:47] That's right.
[00:38:48] You definitely will.
[00:38:49] Everyone will be writing that down going that person has to go first.
[00:38:52] Yeah.
[00:38:53] Like yes.
[00:38:54] All those little notes you write about people.
[00:38:56] Yeah.
[00:38:57] Also you know write a lot and then another shirt you should wear is Aubrey is my favorite.
[00:39:02] You know that's definitely.
[00:39:04] So.
[00:39:06] Aubrey should definitely start selling those.
[00:39:09] That would be great for her.
[00:39:10] She needs merch.
[00:39:12] She needs to be on the market.
[00:39:14] She needs to be on the market.
[00:39:16] Aubrey is my favorite.
[00:39:18] All right.
[00:39:20] Well, despite the fact that Mariah was on the outs of her Sega vote just
[00:39:24] before the Mergetory,
[00:39:26] her tribe tried to keep an appearance of unity rather than
[00:39:29] immediately throwing her under the bus like Nami did to Venus.
[00:39:32] Yet somehow it backfired and caused the exact opposite result as Mariah
[00:39:37] was targeted while Venus overplayed even more but stayed safe.
[00:39:41] It's time to figure out why Mariah lost.
[00:39:45] All right.
[00:39:46] Well, the first and most important rule is to scheme and plot.
[00:39:49] And before we even discuss what happened in this episode,
[00:39:52] we need to look back especially to last week because Mariah's
[00:39:57] position going into Mergetory can be traced back to her position
[00:40:00] within Sega.
[00:40:01] So when I say last week, it's actually all the last weeks.
[00:40:05] She was a part of the Charlie's Angels Alliance,
[00:40:08] but as far as we know, didn't have any real side alliances
[00:40:12] besides that much like we discussed regarding Gem last week.
[00:40:16] And also much like Gem, that meant there wasn't anyone willing
[00:40:19] to stick their neck out for her when the time came.
[00:40:22] I know some have said she was very close with Gem,
[00:40:26] but Gem previously said that wasn't the case.
[00:40:29] And Mariah told Mike Bloom,
[00:40:31] I thought that Maria and Gem were very close.
[00:40:33] Maria thought Gem and I were very close.
[00:40:35] And Gem thought Maria and me were close.
[00:40:38] So it's this weird circle of no one knows where we stand.
[00:40:41] Of course they found out where everybody stood at that vote
[00:40:45] and Mariah stood on the outside.
[00:40:48] She had voted for Ben because she thought that was the plan.
[00:40:52] And she noted in interviews that although she really liked Ben,
[00:40:55] he wouldn't talk strategy with her.
[00:40:57] She also noted that she and Tim weren't on great terms
[00:41:00] from that standpoint either.
[00:41:01] So she was clearly in trouble coming into Mergetore.
[00:41:05] Yeah.
[00:41:06] And one of the things that she talked about too,
[00:41:08] that I thought was interesting was the,
[00:41:10] almost the inability for her to even play because they were winning
[00:41:14] or they were coming in second.
[00:41:16] And so they weren't forced to have to really draw that line
[00:41:20] in the sand yet or make those, those hard decisions and really
[00:41:23] see where you fall.
[00:41:24] And then when it did happen,
[00:41:26] she found out where she fell and it was on the other side
[00:41:29] of the line.
[00:41:30] I think that that's another issue with the three tribe dynamic
[00:41:35] where you have such an inability to play the game early on,
[00:41:40] like right away.
[00:41:41] Like you're not forced to have to when you only are going,
[00:41:44] never going to tribal or going to travel once right before the
[00:41:47] merge.
[00:41:48] Yeah.
[00:41:49] So slight disagreement.
[00:41:51] I feel like it's just harder to play the game when you're
[00:41:56] not going to travel and you have like,
[00:41:59] but I feel like they don't show that,
[00:42:01] but you have to play the game.
[00:42:02] Like you have to,
[00:42:03] you have to set up those relationships.
[00:42:05] Like if you're in a group of four and you don't have a two or
[00:42:08] you don't have a three, you're not playing the game.
[00:42:10] Like you have to think.
[00:42:11] Oh for sure.
[00:42:12] Yeah.
[00:42:13] So you're playing like my thought process is we're not
[00:42:16] going to, I have experienced it not going to travel.
[00:42:18] You're not going to travel.
[00:42:19] But what you're trying to do is make sure those seeds are
[00:42:22] so that you know who the targets are.
[00:42:24] Everybody knows who the targets are.
[00:42:26] So when you do lose, right?
[00:42:28] You get back to the beat.
[00:42:30] You know what's happening.
[00:42:32] And I feel like that is part of the game,
[00:42:34] but also a harder game to demonstrate and a harder game to
[00:42:38] play where you're actually is a relationship during game where
[00:42:41] you're actually like saying, okay,
[00:42:43] in my head, does this person really want to play with these
[00:42:47] two people?
[00:42:48] If they don't really want to play with those two people,
[00:42:51] then that puts me in a good position here.
[00:42:53] I'm a movie there.
[00:42:54] So yes, you're not voting people out,
[00:42:57] but that is the part I think that people are missing from just
[00:43:01] looking at the game that just watching from Benjy.
[00:43:03] It's like the social aspect of the game,
[00:43:05] but building those relationships where trust clusters are
[00:43:08] formed where Ben and Tim are cool.
[00:43:10] So they know if then whatever for they got it to Charlie
[00:43:14] and Maria, they have their two,
[00:43:16] even if you're two or in the house,
[00:43:18] you have someone that you're voting trust with as opposed to
[00:43:21] you don't have anybody who never for your web.
[00:43:24] What's happening is you're not seeing the game as being played,
[00:43:28] right?
[00:43:29] Right.
[00:43:30] Because I'm separate Boston Rock rules.
[00:43:32] You're four or six.
[00:43:33] You get your four, you get your three, you get your two.
[00:43:36] Like that's that's that's what your mind has to always be.
[00:43:39] And if it's not,
[00:43:40] right, yeah.
[00:43:41] And I feel like she, for whatever reason,
[00:43:44] never got there.
[00:43:45] And I do think the fact that she didn't know who that two was.
[00:43:49] She didn't know who that three was.
[00:43:50] She's part of the Charlie's angels,
[00:43:52] but doesn't feel like she can trust Charlie. Like what?
[00:43:55] I mean, like,
[00:43:56] so how are you like part of that core group?
[00:43:59] If you don't feel like you can actually strategize with him,
[00:44:01] like then you're not part of that four.
[00:44:03] So I think that she was,
[00:44:05] she seemed to be putting a lot of emphasis on the fact that
[00:44:08] they never had to really play.
[00:44:10] That's what she was saying was we never really had to play the
[00:44:12] game. Well, no, you're absolutely correct, James.
[00:44:14] You have to play regardless of what's going on.
[00:44:16] If you're going to tribal council or not,
[00:44:18] you need to be creating those relationships and those bonds.
[00:44:21] So when you do have to go to tribal, it's not a question.
[00:44:24] You know who you're voting for. And she was maybe just became
[00:44:28] complacent because they didn't have to, I guess.
[00:44:31] Well, I mean, you have to play, but the problem is,
[00:44:34] you don't know if what you're playing is actually successful
[00:44:38] until you go vote. She thought she had a solid four alliance.
[00:44:41] Maria, I mean, even look at Maria, Maria.
[00:44:45] Maria thought she and Charlie could go either way.
[00:44:49] You know, we discussed this last week, but then when it
[00:44:52] actually came time and Maria was like, okay, the Charlie's
[00:44:55] Angels Alliance wants to go after Ben and Charlie was like,
[00:45:00] yep, but I don't know. Yeah.
[00:45:02] And so everything was hunky dory until it came time for
[00:45:06] the rubber to meet the road.
[00:45:08] And so it's kind of like you think you,
[00:45:12] you could think you have these alliances, but you know,
[00:45:16] it comes back to that whole issue we were talking about.
[00:45:18] Different perspectives of who really is doing what.
[00:45:23] Right.
[00:45:25] Now moving forward to this week's episode,
[00:45:30] we did see Ben and Tim deflect some attempts to get the
[00:45:35] rest of the safe people to name a Siga name.
[00:45:39] Eventually, of course they caved and gave up Mariah because
[00:45:44] well, like I said, she didn't have anyone.
[00:45:48] What do y'all think about this?
[00:45:50] Okay.
[00:45:51] Like, what did like, I was like, Jessica, you better think,
[00:45:55] but like, you don't have to say anything.
[00:45:57] What's so like you have to give up a name thing?
[00:45:59] Listen, I was fascinated.
[00:46:02] Yes.
[00:46:03] I was absolutely fascinated about it was like, it's like,
[00:46:06] you show me, show me yours.
[00:46:07] I'll show you mine kind of thing.
[00:46:09] And it was like, what nobody know, like you can,
[00:46:12] you can certainly just have conversations in general.
[00:46:15] But then this idea that like now we're going to hold it against
[00:46:18] you because you don't want to throw a name out there.
[00:46:20] I mean, if there's one thing we've learned,
[00:46:22] especially with the new era and I know that this existed.
[00:46:26] Dropping that name first, that's a risky thing to do.
[00:46:29] You know,
[00:46:30] if you're willing to like offer someone up on a silver platter,
[00:46:32] I mean,
[00:46:33] if I would have been Sega, I would have been like,
[00:46:35] Oh, you want Venus to go done, done.
[00:46:37] Except they turned it on Sega and they were like,
[00:46:40] now you named someone.
[00:46:41] And I think a lot of this goes back to the journey six alliance
[00:46:45] within the other things because I don't think Tim wanted to
[00:46:52] risk pissing off Q and Hunter, you know,
[00:46:57] his supposed secret allies by refusing to work
[00:47:03] with them or appear to work with them.
[00:47:06] Oh, I just want to double down on Venus though.
[00:47:08] I've been like, well, listen, let's talk about Venus and just
[00:47:10] keep the Venus except it's like, I think they did.
[00:47:14] I think they kept trying to and I think they were expecting
[00:47:17] it to go more like when when Gabler made his pronouncement.
[00:47:21] You know,
[00:47:22] I shouldn't go.
[00:47:23] Yeah.
[00:47:24] He was like,
[00:47:25] Yeah, done.
[00:47:26] Yeah.
[00:47:27] Thank you.
[00:47:28] Yeah.
[00:47:29] That's why I thought Venus,
[00:47:30] I thought that's why Venus was going to go.
[00:47:32] But I think the part, well, we'll get to more of this,
[00:47:35] but I think a lot of it was it was the Yanu bidding war.
[00:47:39] Like who can get Yanu to our side?
[00:47:41] Who could convince Yanu?
[00:47:43] And you know, so they were insisting that they were
[00:47:48] a tight tribe, even though they named Mariah,
[00:47:50] they insisted and pretended.
[00:47:53] And as I was watching the episode,
[00:47:56] I initially felt Mariah also took that position went along
[00:48:00] with it to defend herself because if it came out that she
[00:48:04] was alone, she could become a target like Venus.
[00:48:08] And as Rob said on the postgame podcast,
[00:48:11] she did a lot of what we've seen succeed in the previous
[00:48:14] new era of regulatory situations.
[00:48:17] And you know, she even told Dalton Ross,
[00:48:20] when you're on the bottom,
[00:48:21] you can kind of go either way, right?
[00:48:23] When you say to quote a friend, take me or leave me,
[00:48:26] it will either go great.
[00:48:28] We have a number or it'll go great.
[00:48:30] Now we know who to kick off and not piss off for people.
[00:48:33] Right.
[00:48:34] And that's a really delicate line to play.
[00:48:36] I wanted to go in with a,
[00:48:39] you don't want to kick me off.
[00:48:40] You don't want to piss off these people that you
[00:48:42] actually want to work with because you don't know me.
[00:48:45] And then she further explained to Mike Bloom,
[00:48:47] and this is what I was getting at the Yanu wasn't looking
[00:48:50] to pick up someone like her,
[00:48:52] but rather to choose a side.
[00:48:54] She said, so at least for the first vote,
[00:48:57] it was more about convincing Yanu which way to pull.
[00:49:00] And then she added to Gordon Holmes that Siga wasn't going
[00:49:02] to be able to out hot mess Nami.
[00:49:05] So they wanted to convince Yanu decide with them based
[00:49:08] on the idea of going to final aid as a group.
[00:49:11] So all of that explains why she went along with this
[00:49:14] idea of Siga being a tight group.
[00:49:17] Like I said, it was a bidding war to get Yanu onto their side.
[00:49:21] And they just misread the Yanu mindset.
[00:49:25] But once she had become aware that her name was the one that
[00:49:29] was dropped because she was very adamant in all of her exit
[00:49:32] press that like, oh, they came back with my name.
[00:49:34] And so I knew I was in trouble.
[00:49:36] Yeah.
[00:49:37] I think at that point you need to change your strategy
[00:49:39] because now you're like,
[00:49:40] you have been tossed out to the wolves and now you are one
[00:49:44] of the options.
[00:49:45] I don't think you wait.
[00:49:47] That's when you say, okay, time for me to cut bait.
[00:49:50] And now I need to, I need to change the narrative.
[00:49:53] I need to stop them from speaking my name.
[00:49:55] Yeah.
[00:49:56] Yeah.
[00:49:57] I may have a little experience about having your name thrown
[00:50:00] out the mergers.
[00:50:01] Little bit of experience.
[00:50:02] Little bit of experience, you know.
[00:50:05] So like you get back, you know, hopefully you have a
[00:50:08] trusty ally that says, well,
[00:50:10] you may not be presiding on grotto the other side.
[00:50:13] You're taking your information back and you're like, okay,
[00:50:17] I'm not presiding on grotto.
[00:50:19] And I feel like I actually think the winning move is what
[00:50:22] Mariah did and we had to build those relationships.
[00:50:26] That's the thing.
[00:50:27] If you have the relationships, like you have to try to
[00:50:29] build the relationships, you know,
[00:50:31] I think when you go in the offensive,
[00:50:33] it is something people have a plan and once you've
[00:50:36] got the opportunity to start their plan, they're like,
[00:50:39] whoa, they see you have power.
[00:50:41] Like when you're the target and you like switch it.
[00:50:44] Right?
[00:50:45] You kind of have other people to switch it as opposed to,
[00:50:48] oh, we actively see you moving and shaking.
[00:50:53] But she still tried to switch it,
[00:50:55] but she tried to switch it way too late.
[00:50:57] Well, and that's exactly it.
[00:50:59] I think that she should have tried to switch it by doing
[00:51:01] what you said, James, showing she doesn't have power.
[00:51:04] I think that's a good question while watching the episode,
[00:51:07] especially when we get to tribal council was okay.
[00:51:10] She knows she's a likely target.
[00:51:12] Why didn't she bring that up that she was on the out sooner
[00:51:16] than tribal council to push back on that?
[00:51:18] And she did give answers.
[00:51:19] You know, the interviewers were good at asking that.
[00:51:22] And you know, so she said that seven people made the
[00:51:25] initial decision sitting at the merge feast.
[00:51:28] And she specifically added in talking to Gordon Holm,
[00:51:31] something that I think is important point.
[00:51:33] And I hadn't really thought about it,
[00:51:35] which is those seven people left the meal with a decision.
[00:51:39] Yeah, they're not getting back together again.
[00:51:42] It's hard to get seven people back.
[00:51:44] So while Q was trying to get them to, you know,
[00:51:47] switch it to Venus shortly before tribal council.
[00:51:51] And in the moment when I was watching,
[00:51:53] I was thinking he would succeed due to his sheer persistence
[00:51:56] because he has before.
[00:51:58] The problem was getting all of them on board when a decision
[00:52:01] had already been reached.
[00:52:03] And I think that was where her,
[00:52:06] her problem was, was in, like you said, James,
[00:52:12] if she shows that she can get people together on board,
[00:52:15] well, she becomes more of a threat.
[00:52:17] But if she shows everyone that she was really on the outs,
[00:52:20] start dropping that information,
[00:52:22] then maybe it makes its way through the path
[00:52:26] and people talk about it.
[00:52:28] And she told Gordon that, you know,
[00:52:33] that was the reason that she didn't put it out
[00:52:35] was because she didn't think she could get the seven on board.
[00:52:38] But she told Dalton Ross that she was dropping some clues
[00:52:41] to Venus while talking to her.
[00:52:43] But why are you not going to Venus?
[00:52:45] Yeah, that's the last person you should be dropping clues.
[00:52:48] Right.
[00:52:49] Yeah.
[00:52:50] And I think that's the thing about when you hit murder story,
[00:52:52] it's like really sowing those relationships
[00:52:54] outside of your tribe that first day,
[00:52:57] because you know it's going to be hectic, you know?
[00:52:59] Yeah.
[00:53:00] And how much time can you get talking to people
[00:53:02] away from other people?
[00:53:04] And that night before where you're like,
[00:53:06] you're building a relationship with Q,
[00:53:08] you're figuring out between Q, Tiffany and Kenzie.
[00:53:11] If I need them, who cannot go to it with information?
[00:53:13] And that's why you have to try to like,
[00:53:15] you know, build those bonds.
[00:53:17] Like, hate to take it back to my season,
[00:53:19] but I'm like, I'm in murder story.
[00:53:20] I'm like, Cody, let's go talk.
[00:53:22] Why?
[00:53:23] Because me and Cody talked all night the night before.
[00:53:25] So we're already, I'm like, all right, back.
[00:53:27] Cody's on this side.
[00:53:28] I got Cody.
[00:53:29] This boat I got Carla cat.
[00:53:31] Like so you're like, okay,
[00:53:32] I know folks are coming my way,
[00:53:34] but I'm already have relationships with where there may be opposition
[00:53:38] where who's most likely to want me out.
[00:53:41] Right.
[00:53:42] Forget my tribe.
[00:53:43] My tribe is going to want to need you, right?
[00:53:45] Even if I need to figure out who from the other tribe
[00:53:48] I can get to be there.
[00:53:50] Oh, I got her in my back pocket or I can go with her.
[00:53:53] And that's the thing where,
[00:53:55] when a person like Q where, where maybe you don't tell him the truth,
[00:54:00] but you want to queue to feel like you're someone,
[00:54:02] whatever he needs to hear,
[00:54:04] you have to figure out what you have to say,
[00:54:06] how you need to communicate for this person.
[00:54:09] And sometimes that's tough.
[00:54:11] And sometimes you all the water is not going to happen.
[00:54:14] But that's the way to,
[00:54:16] that's the way where you have to really work hard.
[00:54:19] And there's so little, I think it's so little time you can really try
[00:54:23] like she could have literally went to like two people for non me.
[00:54:26] I'm a tip and kids.
[00:54:27] He literally had one minute with Q before the sun went down
[00:54:30] and you're at a trap.
[00:54:31] You're at a tribal one next day.
[00:54:33] Yeah.
[00:54:34] That's just how quick it is.
[00:54:36] And it's hard if you haven't been playing to pick up on that pace.
[00:54:41] So that part I get. Yes.
[00:54:43] Yeah.
[00:54:44] Yeah.
[00:54:45] I mean, I understand what Mariah was saying in terms of that group of seven
[00:54:49] not getting back together again.
[00:54:51] But getting that information into circulation was literally the only chance she had at that point.
[00:54:56] Yeah.
[00:54:57] She put everything out there at tribal council,
[00:54:59] but Q was like, this is the first,
[00:55:02] I've heard about it and he even said the time to tell me would have been when I was 12.
[00:55:09] When I asked you.
[00:55:10] Yeah.
[00:55:11] About that.
[00:55:12] And, you know, at the end of tribal council, Mariah said she wanted to say it loud and clear for all of them to hear.
[00:55:18] And that's great.
[00:55:19] But she should have said it loud and clear much earlier because we have discussed many times on this podcast
[00:55:26] that the votes are decided and written in stone before people ever get to tribal council in by far most cases,
[00:55:33] meaning that surprise revelations at tribal council are unlikely to succeed.
[00:55:38] Right.
[00:55:39] And she knew that people already made a decision.
[00:55:42] She's like, Oh, the seven people already made a decision.
[00:55:44] Well, yeah.
[00:55:45] Then you're bringing them to tribal council where they've doubled down and like this is right.
[00:55:48] And everyone else has and she knew, you know, she knew the other players had made their decision
[00:55:54] because they told her that her shot in the dark was her only chance.
[00:55:57] Which is crazy.
[00:55:58] Yeah.
[00:55:59] Like,
[00:56:00] Who's saying these things to her?
[00:56:03] Like one in six.
[00:56:05] Okay.
[00:56:06] Like, so you say one in six to do that.
[00:56:08] She may not be the choice you want to go home.
[00:56:11] And if you're on the safe side, you're like, okay, if she say then we can vote out Venus or somebody like that.
[00:56:16] Whatever.
[00:56:17] So I get that.
[00:56:18] But I don't like maybe that's why I was a bad person, but I'm not telling people who is going home.
[00:56:27] Like, I don't care.
[00:56:28] Like,
[00:56:29] No, my live multiple times about that.
[00:56:32] Yeah.
[00:56:33] I don't want to be playing.
[00:56:34] I don't want any of this stuff to happen.
[00:56:36] I want the person that's going home and think the plan is somebody else.
[00:56:39] And they vote for that person.
[00:56:41] And that person catch.
[00:56:42] Wait.
[00:56:43] And the other part that I don't understand in all of this.
[00:56:47] Planning that they did and voting out Mo and telling her that she was going home and telling her to play the shot in the dark.
[00:56:53] Nobody said, oh, by the way, we should have a backup vote.
[00:56:57] Charlie was the only one who did because he was like, Oh, well just in case I want to make sure we, but they didn't like say.
[00:57:04] Well, we all know she's playing her shot in the dark.
[00:57:06] Who else are we voting for as a backup?
[00:57:08] Nobody's nobody had that discussion.
[00:57:10] What are we doing?
[00:57:11] I don't know what's happening anymore.
[00:57:13] He's playing a phenomenal game.
[00:57:15] Like he's making the right reads.
[00:57:17] Like I'm super impressed with Charlie's game.
[00:57:19] Yeah.
[00:57:20] And I'm not going to be playing the same thing again.
[00:57:22] I'm not going to be playing the same thing again.
[00:57:24] I'm super impressed with Charlie's game.
[00:57:26] Yeah.
[00:57:27] And that, and I missed the Charlie vote on Venus, but I was happy.
[00:57:31] I said no Hinky vote, but clearly there was.
[00:57:33] I didn't see it.
[00:57:34] Yeah.
[00:57:35] But like that's how you play the game.
[00:57:37] Like you have to.
[00:57:38] You need that.
[00:57:39] Yeah.
[00:57:40] It should be two votes on Venus.
[00:57:42] Like it should be a vote on Venus and a vote on Mo.
[00:57:44] Like when is the dog power?
[00:57:46] What?
[00:57:47] It's the mistake I made.
[00:57:48] Like if you know it's going to be a dog power vote, you don't ever know.
[00:57:51] But if you know it's not going to be a financial, it's like, if you
[00:57:54] people, if you can't trust the people you're playing with,
[00:57:56] you're not going to win.
[00:57:57] So are you playing to win?
[00:57:58] Are you playing to get to fifth place and get, you know,
[00:58:01] to my friends and the principal has to play the game.
[00:58:04] And, you know, like if your goals to win,
[00:58:07] if you know there's like 10 votes going on somebody.
[00:58:11] And it comes with, it's in consequence of you.
[00:58:15] There were voting for you.
[00:58:16] Like she can't call votes Noel called both everybody called
[00:58:20] both our birds.
[00:58:21] Sorry, like, right?
[00:58:23] Yeah.
[00:58:24] Well, at least, you know, Charlie was one up on last season where
[00:58:27] they kept piling on everybody and nobody ever threw a,
[00:58:30] you know, an additional, you know, but that was Riva great
[00:58:34] gameplay by Riva.
[00:58:35] Yes, it was.
[00:58:36] I love watching like that, that game playing and we're still
[00:58:40] over one and we're going to be quiet.
[00:58:43] No, but I mean, I think there's some of that here that
[00:58:46] nobody, you know, people were worried.
[00:58:48] You know, they were worried that they would be able to
[00:58:50] appear disloyal.
[00:58:51] I mean, even for as much as Venus complained and as much as
[00:58:56] she has also said on Twitter, she still voted Mariah.
[00:58:59] She didn't cast a vote on Charlie.
[00:59:01] Yeah.
[00:59:02] You know, so she did the same thing that she was
[00:59:05] complaining about everyone else doing.
[00:59:07] She went along with the pack.
[00:59:09] So yeah, but you know, to circle it back to finish out
[00:59:15] and to be honest, I think that's the rule.
[00:59:17] You know, just, I know that Mariah felt she faced an uphill
[00:59:22] battle by releasing that information sooner.
[00:59:25] And maybe that uphill was actually a cliff face, but it
[00:59:28] was still her only hope and she needed to try to do that.
[00:59:31] And you know, I who knows if it would have changed
[00:59:35] anything.
[00:59:36] I mean, I thought she was going to win after, you
[00:59:38] know, being out on the house.
[00:59:39] I feel like this is the spot where people like Mariah
[00:59:41] Venus, they can make it through murder story, not
[00:59:44] just the loving agency.
[00:59:45] They don't get the blame for any of the votes.
[00:59:47] And it typically can possibly make a move later in the
[00:59:50] game.
[00:59:51] A lot.
[00:59:52] I lie.
[00:59:54] I lie in Gables like this is where, like if you
[00:59:56] don't have agency and you get through and then
[00:59:59] the bigger alliance says we're going to
[01:00:01] capitalize each other because we can't be some
[01:00:03] right.
[01:00:04] And like you make it to the end of you win.
[01:00:06] She had a strong chance.
[01:00:08] Venus is just going to sit there and be like,
[01:00:10] I don't know about that.
[01:00:12] We'll talk about that but
[01:00:14] All right, we could go to the second rule which says not to scheme and plot too much and to keep your scheming secret
[01:00:19] Mariah told Rob that while she was worried she would overthink things coming into the game
[01:00:24] With Siga getting second place almost every time. She didn't have an opportunity to overplay things and
[01:00:30] She certainly couldn't overplay in her brief migratory time
[01:00:34] There was of course the impression that she would play too hard
[01:00:38] We'll get to that in rule six
[01:00:40] So I don't know can either of you think of anything that she did in terms of you know scheming and plotting too much
[01:00:48] No, I mean I think she
[01:00:49] Explained why she didn't because she didn't think she had to even though she did have to so she was a little bit failing in this
[01:00:56] Even though it's bad to overplay. She needed to do more. Yeah in leading up to
[01:01:01] Yeah, one thing I think I didn't do a lot of is I understood where the cracks were I
[01:01:07] Didn't understand certainly where the bonds were and I also may not have thrown out as much stuff to create cracks or
[01:01:15] To create so like you understand sometimes where the bonds are so some things you can do while you're playing the game is
[01:01:21] Throwout stuff in and what not have to worry too much about it going back to you
[01:01:26] Like a little it's a little embellishment of a lie here or there with somebody and that certainly isn't a bad thing
[01:01:33] True
[01:01:34] But I feel like that's something I could have did better to so but when you have information like like, you know
[01:01:41] Like a code you think Jesse will vote you out like you made a clothing, you know X Y Z like oh like you know
[01:01:47] Like you know oh and like would you take out? You know samey samey is definitely throwing your name out there
[01:01:53] It's like things you can say that you know
[01:01:56] Aren't playing hard and they come back to you you can deny if you can do more of that
[01:02:02] I didn't do what I played I wish I did so
[01:02:04] Right, that's the one thing about you can play harder
[01:02:07] But it's kind of you want to be very strategic and kind of do it in the shadows. Yeah
[01:02:15] All right, well the third rule tells players to be more flexible James, how do you think Mariah did here? I
[01:02:22] Don't fall her where I don't feel like she had as much of opportunities to be
[01:02:29] flexible where you know, it's not that much time
[01:02:31] So I'm literally going to give you know between
[01:02:34] Tribal council and her getting voted out was probably 48 hours, you know and that it was a merge in a challenge
[01:02:41] so like as
[01:02:44] Flexible as you can be I feel like she probably was only she could have there was probably maybe released that information
[01:02:50] Strategically a little better, but outside of that
[01:02:53] I feel like from an odd standpoint looking at the how to do error rolls
[01:02:57] You don't want to be the person that's perceived as being able to flip the vote or make a vote in front of everybody
[01:03:04] Well, you're the target and I'm biased
[01:03:07] But that's not what you want to be perceived as being able to do at these points
[01:03:12] So it's like are you playing a game to win a million dollars?
[01:03:15] Or you and you want to go far too, but like what is a winning actual strategy and
[01:03:21] What's been proven to be winning strategy is to kind of lay low and assert dominance once cracks begin the form. Yeah
[01:03:29] Yeah, I would I would go back a little bit to before this
[01:03:34] Actual episode, you know, because she talked in interviews about how she spoke to Charlie
[01:03:39] About what would happen after the Sega vote no matter the outcome because she had a feeling something might be up
[01:03:45] To me that showed she was willing to adapt if the landscape changed under her
[01:03:50] But before that much like after that she didn't really have much opportunity to be flexible
[01:03:56] She thought she was in an alliance of four people out of the six on her tribe
[01:04:00] And she tried to talk to the other two which is good, but hadn't gotten anywhere from what we heard
[01:04:06] So to me the only other place I think
[01:04:09] You know, she could have been more flexible
[01:04:11] Was in making the sub alliance within the four which we talked about already. Yeah, yeah
[01:04:18] So the fourth rule tells players not to let their emotions control them
[01:04:22] Jessica we've discussed some of the moves she made or didn't make do you think any of them were impacted by her emotions?
[01:04:29] I don't think so. I think that she was
[01:04:32] trying to
[01:04:35] Trying to play this game from a standpoint that was going to benefit her knowing that she had
[01:04:40] People on her side, but I don't think that it was based upon anything other than necessarily gameplay
[01:04:46] Like I didn't see her making decisions that were emotionally based. I saw her trying to make decisions that she thought were going to be
[01:04:56] Beneficial game wise and a lot of what she said in her exit press
[01:04:59] I think was interesting because she was clearly playing the numbers
[01:05:02] You know if you know that you have seven with this and if you go and so she was she was trying to
[01:05:09] Strategize in that way and I do think that she could have pulled more of a Venus, right?
[01:05:15] Knowing that her name had been dropped and knowing that she was someone that they were considering
[01:05:19] She could have been like well
[01:05:21] That's gonna be hellfire and brimstone and I'm gonna tell everybody what happened back at Sega
[01:05:25] And I'm gonna let everyone know what's going on
[01:05:27] And then that would have come from more of an emotional place as opposed to still trying to keep her
[01:05:32] What's about her because honestly I was surprised and like how was she still have everybody's back?
[01:05:36] How was she still defending Sega when she knows that they like
[01:05:41] Caught her loose and said out you can vote out moe if you want
[01:05:44] And she knows that her name is in the chopping block and she's still saying but you know, it was a unanimous vote
[01:05:50] Yeah, we were all together who raw I mean like that was impressive
[01:05:56] So I don't think she had any issues with her emotions at all. I just thought about this
[01:06:01] same thing happening at 43 is like
[01:06:04] Ellie was cool like gamer comes everybody like gamers like you know
[01:06:09] And get an alley because you're so with those tribal bodies
[01:06:12] So wanting to make them work because there's so much stuff there
[01:06:16] But at that point you kind of have to kind of say, okay, where is the power at that's making this decision?
[01:06:23] and
[01:06:25] As comfortable as I comfortable as I am, you know with the people that I'm with if they're comfortable enough that my name comes up
[01:06:33] At all then they I have to figure something out
[01:06:38] You know, yeah
[01:06:39] And that's a tough thing to kind of do but the time that you have even from an information standpoint
[01:06:44] It doesn't find me people and then be able to communicate information to the right person in a three hours time span
[01:06:50] Yeah, it's very tough. You know, so yeah
[01:06:54] Yeah, all right. Well the fifth rule reminds players they need to pretend to be nice and play the social game now James
[01:07:01] You tweeted that a big part of the game of survivor
[01:07:05] Isn't just having the right read it is building the relationships to make what you want happen
[01:07:10] I'm pretty sure you were mostly talking about Venus at the time
[01:07:13] But how do you think it applies here for Mariah?
[01:07:17] especially since
[01:07:18] Everybody on Sega seemed or at least pretended to get along and did everything together as a group I
[01:07:25] I
[01:07:26] Think this is the rule that I think is the most interesting of my head only because I feel like
[01:07:32] We have so much meta thought process out there where I think sometimes taking yourself out of the matter and what
[01:07:39] What is supposed to happen?
[01:07:42] Isn't necessarily a bad thing
[01:07:44] For the game or how to play the game especially in the new era. It's more of a gag than you know
[01:07:50] You know a thing I thought that player like Cody who you know didn't play a traditional game wasn't a big
[01:07:56] You know somebody really said he didn't win but he had a chance to win like yeah
[01:08:02] But he played his game, you know where he was like alright
[01:08:06] Played things and did in like build those relationships and Cody was a religious supporter
[01:08:10] You know where people weren't really oh you just here for a good time
[01:08:14] Where I really feel like that's the thing where you have to figure out
[01:08:18] You know how to put in put in time with people one thing that I
[01:08:22] Come back to fire. We have fire. You have a communal place where people have to get it
[01:08:26] So if people want to stay warm, they're going to be around the fire
[01:08:30] What happens around the fire, you know communication like camaraderie like so you have to figure out
[01:08:36] How to build those bonds with strangers?
[01:08:39] Which is the toughest thing where you may be the youngest you may be the oldest you may be from a city
[01:08:44] I read this from you know the countryside like you have to figure out
[01:08:47] We're how to build those bonds and that's the hardest part in the heart for them to show in the game is like
[01:08:54] How like how does Gabler build bonds with Jesse?
[01:08:59] Right, how is when it's how does Gabler and Cody connect?
[01:09:03] Where are James and Cassidy?
[01:09:06] Cool, you know those things are the things we're being able to figure those things out
[01:09:12] It's hard to show but you have to understand that the relationships are the crux and those relationships build you numbers and
[01:09:20] Those relationships are very fluid where you may feel like you're at the bottom at one point and you it's just that one vote
[01:09:27] You know like we're like, you know, and I feel like that's the hard part about the game
[01:09:31] Is you don't have time to emerge emerge in a time you get the merch
[01:09:36] That's you've been out there
[01:09:38] You get you as you get the merge when the sun goes down at a certain time the sun goes back up and then you're at a challenge
[01:09:44] And then you're at travel
[01:09:45] And it's a shorter travel because have to try it isn't there at the challenge
[01:09:48] You're right
[01:09:49] You have a shorter time to really get out there and do your thing and if you haven't been the tribals
[01:09:55] You don't understand like being able to make a vote
[01:09:57] Like if you probably went back and looked at survivor like yo
[01:10:00] Who made a vote who's like was on the on the right side of a vote and then who's gonna off the boat
[01:10:06] Not that many people make boats in some are like not many people actually are the people generating the votes for survivors
[01:10:14] A lot of people are you know added on but the generators of the votes
[01:10:18] You have to kind of figure out who they are get under them or get them out depending on your position
[01:10:23] And I'm like that's a tough part from a relationship standpoint
[01:10:25] We're understanding where am I investing my time? I have an hour left on this day
[01:10:30] Who am I supposed to be our with you can spend an hour with with
[01:10:34] Charlie or Maria or you spend an hour with somebody you were on the challenge with and that means nothing the next day
[01:10:40] Because it's a split chart. Yeah
[01:10:45] All right, she
[01:10:47] And just to add to I think there might have been a bit of a struggle for her
[01:10:51] Socially just because she didn't seem to have a true understanding of what connections she had with who for her to say
[01:10:59] You know, I thought I was close with this one
[01:11:01] But Maria thought I was close with that one and like there seemed to be such a jumble there that that
[01:11:06] There shouldn't be a question who your number two is you should be like this is my number two. That's my number three
[01:11:12] I've got this group over here
[01:11:14] Like there should be an idea of what your structure is based upon the social game that you're playing and to not
[01:11:20] Know where you fall within that and not to not to understand who's actually close with who I think that this is where Mariah
[01:11:28] Probably didn't do a great job of trying to really lock herself in which is then why no one had her back and no one was like
[01:11:36] Coming to her defense when they needed to put it, you know someone's name on the line
[01:11:40] Yeah, you know, yeah something, you know
[01:11:42] No one went to the mattresses for as they say in the you know godfather days
[01:11:46] You had to go to the mattresses you want somebody in the game that's going to go to the mattress for you
[01:11:52] Yeah, it doesn't happen as much
[01:11:54] You know in the new era where someone's like I need you for my game for me to win this game
[01:11:59] I need you here for one more vote right, right?
[01:12:02] And you have to have multiple people that feel that way and when they don't feel that way whether they feel like they can
[01:12:09] Take you to the end where they feel like you're gonna be somebody like we don't have that
[01:12:14] That's when you go home and
[01:12:17] That's when I went home and that's when everybody else goes home where you don't have somebody
[01:12:21] I
[01:12:22] Need you for my game to move further and I'm willing to put my game on the line because I know I can't win without you
[01:12:31] Yeah, I think that Mariah did well
[01:12:35] Socially agree again. There's the difference between the social and the social game
[01:12:41] You know, and I think she got along well with everyone, you know and you know talked about like even talked about
[01:12:51] How you know how much she liked Ben and everything else but wasn't able to turn it into the game aspect of things, right?
[01:12:58] Right
[01:13:01] All right
[01:13:02] Well now we get to the much-awaited sixth rule which warns against being too much of a threat
[01:13:07] Now I know we're gonna have some thoughts here because
[01:13:11] Everyone knows that anyone who likes Aubrey
[01:13:14] Must be a huge threat. It's the rule
[01:13:18] It is she needs to sell those t-shirts. Yes. Oh and by the way, I almost forgot
[01:13:25] I posted this on Twitter, but did you know that I actually had a picture taken with Mariah before she was ever on the show?
[01:13:33] It's it's you know right here
[01:13:40] That was funny I was really this way I didn't know
[01:13:48] So anyone
[01:13:52] So anyone who is only listening well, you'll have to either look at my Twitter or look at the video
[01:13:58] To see that it's you know, not exactly a picture of Mariah
[01:14:02] But but more seriously
[01:14:06] Mariah said that after her team lost the challenge she couldn't she said in the show
[01:14:11] She couldn't have people saying she's a strategist and that she was going to get them out
[01:14:15] But that's exactly what happened while Q of course
[01:14:19] Sparked a lot of this after she dared say she liked Aubrey. That wasn't the only thing going on
[01:14:26] Tim said at the merge feast that the person who knows the game the best was Mariah
[01:14:31] Tevin added that he heard through the grapevine that she's savvy Tiffany said she's a crazy survivor fan
[01:14:39] Tevin asked who's more manipulative Mariah or Venus Tiffany was more worried about someone smart who could outmaneuver them so
[01:14:48] somehow
[01:14:50] This got implanted into the brains of the seven safe players and while they were undoubtedly
[01:14:57] overstating it I do want to point out that in her pregame interviews Mariah said she's a super fan
[01:15:04] She began watching a Keram Owen went back to watch the earlier seasons and of course everything since then
[01:15:10] She called herself a nerd
[01:15:11] But one who is a very social person and she was trying to downplay
[01:15:16] The first part so she didn't become a target for being seen as both smart and social
[01:15:22] So like she didn't plan to talk about the fact that she read a bunch of strategy books to prepare
[01:15:28] After the game she told Dalton Ross that she was upset at being called a strategist and wondered
[01:15:34] What did I do other than look like me? And that was it
[01:15:37] It really was that I had invoked someone everyone was already thinking about I was honest
[01:15:42] I look like me. I talk like me. I walk like me
[01:15:45] But here's the thing. I mean, I understand what she's saying but based on her own description of herself
[01:15:52] They weren't wrong
[01:15:54] Right. Yeah
[01:15:55] Well, and I do think that this is a very interesting point as far as like the new era of survivor
[01:16:01] And what can be seen as a threat? It's no longer your physical
[01:16:06] Prowness, it's no longer like how well you can actually like perform in a challenge
[01:16:12] There is this new version of a survivor player and it's the one who looks like they can do a puzzle
[01:16:19] Really well even though Hunter we know as a puzzle person
[01:16:22] He's a combo but like there is that like like the David writes of you know, the survivor world who you look at and you think
[01:16:30] Wow, why is this person plain survivor because they're not an outdoorsy person
[01:16:34] They're not someone who wants to be like in the elements. They're not someone who is really having a good time out here in the rain
[01:16:41] This person must just be really really smart and they must be a strategist and there must be something going on
[01:16:48] That that they have and this is like that new it's a new threat and survivor
[01:16:52] Is that person who looks like someone who is not your typical like outdoorsy survivor person?
[01:16:58] They must be someone who is a super fan who loves the game who wants to strategize
[01:17:02] So I feel like if you fall into that and we seem to have so many more of that version of players as the new era progresses
[01:17:10] Yeah, and I want to say I know James you have something. I just want to say you say it's a new thing but
[01:17:16] You know
[01:17:18] Kelly Wentworth
[01:17:20] She got voted out early from San Juan del Sur because people said she's a strategist. She knows the game
[01:17:26] Yeah, and that's fair. Yeah, that's fair. Mm-hmm. I mean nothing is wrong with getting rid of like everybody goes home
[01:17:34] You would on the island you invent a reason to justify every vote off that you yeah
[01:17:40] I do think that team construction and in this construction of the team
[01:17:47] We have seven people
[01:17:48] Typically you want to when you're in a vision of power, right?
[01:17:53] You want to cast the people that need to go out as most opposite of you, right?
[01:17:58] Because you're trying to create the stereotype of who are the good people and who are the people
[01:18:04] Get rid of right? Yeah, like when you're in a vision of power, right? If I am a person that's considered
[01:18:11] Lions and hyenas Tony my guy like just I can't say everything's I want to play again
[01:18:18] So I'll be quiet on some things but
[01:18:21] Lions and hyenas and you have to watch the most even verse odd
[01:18:26] about how and when to make moves from a
[01:18:31] Yeah, okay, you have your threats to win the game like who actually has the tools whose charismatic
[01:18:38] Who's athletic who do people like right?
[01:18:40] Then you have but then the threat level shifts to who do people want to sit next to more than me
[01:18:46] Yeah, and it's like if you are a person that is perceived as a bigger threat or
[01:18:54] Alpha person, right?
[01:18:56] No matter whether you are you're not right, you know Charlie is part of the guys the lines whatever
[01:19:02] Right, you're you're you're pretty good right now. You have to figure out wait, okay?
[01:19:08] Like how do I need to paint it?
[01:19:09] I consider part of the big dogs and they are targeting the strong quote unquote stronger players
[01:19:17] Like hold up. I need to change the narrative of what strong is
[01:19:22] Strong is strong is stronger than me over here strong is Mariah. She knows the game
[01:19:28] She's a trickster
[01:19:29] So you're just pushing that narrative because that is the narrative that fits most what you said
[01:19:36] You know I'm saying
[01:19:38] this happened to be a part of
[01:19:41] Yeah, you know what these guys to be considered like their threats like right now
[01:19:46] They're not gonna say you know
[01:19:49] like us
[01:19:51] We worried about us, you know
[01:19:54] Oh on that side you have a riot the strategies Venus is a wild card, you know
[01:19:59] I see you have your strategy narrative
[01:20:02] About who the threat is at the month at the moment a like, you know from Q's perspective
[01:20:08] Q has the six or seven so
[01:20:11] He's like, you know, maybe have kids he aside pocket with a seven
[01:20:15] I'm maybe able to build someone else with Sega they got their six and like everybody's connected
[01:20:22] So now you just try to figure out, okay
[01:20:24] What's threatening to us as the collective hierarchy?
[01:20:28] And she just fell into that and that's the tough part about it in Venus
[01:20:33] What Venus did is she publicly gets the hierarchies like yeah
[01:20:36] I was a go against the fire he will probably get there and it's like at the beginning of merge
[01:20:41] I
[01:20:42] Feel like people so many people want to have agency and one of the troubles
[01:20:45] I think my right in the decision
[01:20:46] She was fine letting things flow
[01:20:49] And I think she just had to make sure that people saw how much of an answer
[01:20:53] She could have been in the game as opposed to a threat
[01:20:57] But I do think the people that were on the side were like
[01:20:59] Mariah somebody that people want to sit next to over me
[01:21:03] Right and that was more threatening to them
[01:21:06] Then her being able to strategize is like people gonna want to say to her versus me about Q if I'm too
[01:21:12] Yeah, if I'm been if I'm anybody on the other side if I'm took like you wasn't next to me
[01:21:17] I'm right from a observation standpoint, right? And that's where I think her threat level raised
[01:21:23] From a standpoint of they're going to keep her over me
[01:21:26] Which I think if you're perceived in the hierarchy of higher, that's the way to go
[01:21:31] Yeah, I think to I would want to add as far as who do you want to sit next to?
[01:21:35] They don't want to sit next to Venus at this point
[01:21:39] We got to keep Venus around because yeah
[01:21:42] Now the interest there's a couple things one, you know when you mentioned it has to be the opposite
[01:21:46] It reminds me of all the times that we've seen
[01:21:50] tribes we're like
[01:21:52] The second weakest person on the tribe will be like we got to vote out the weakest and
[01:22:00] We're sitting here going no don't say that because you're next in line if you lose again
[01:22:04] Don't say that you know and so yes, it has to be the opposite just like you said James
[01:22:10] And the other thing is this is one area where Venus did apparently you know come through and recognize what was going on
[01:22:17] Cuz you know according to what she tweeted she went to a couple of the other players and said if they're voting out gamers
[01:22:24] You're next you're going to be on the list
[01:22:27] Venus's problem in that situation was there was nothing those people could do about it, you know she you know so it didn't matter but
[01:22:36] You know, but she at least did
[01:22:38] Recognize this, you know the same thing that you're talking about. Yeah once they start down a path
[01:22:43] You know, it's like once you start voting out the most muscular players
[01:22:46] Oh, well then let's do the next and the next in the neck in this case. It's just a little bit different
[01:22:51] now in terms of a gamer type being a threat until
[01:22:57] Recently my advice within this rule was if you have studied the game never let on to how much you know
[01:23:05] Now a few seasons ago
[01:23:07] I watered this down in the language of the rules because the players being cast
[01:23:13] Featured so many who knew the game and have watched many or all of the seasons
[01:23:18] So it seemed not to be as big a deal
[01:23:20] I mean James your tribe alone had at least at least half of your tribe were why blank loss?
[01:23:27] Regular listeners and have now appeared on the show with you. Yeah being here
[01:23:32] And possibly more than half
[01:23:35] And there were others on your season too. So yeah, there are a lot of people who are this
[01:23:41] You know thinking this way
[01:23:43] but even so I had a feeling it could still come up and
[01:23:48] The rule does continue to advise players to keep that information close to the vest
[01:23:53] Until you can figure out where everybody stands
[01:23:56] We don't really know how much information people on Sega knew about Mariah's history with the show
[01:24:02] But based on what we talked about a little while ago
[01:24:05] It seems like they knew enough and of course Q was looking for reasons to put a target on someone
[01:24:11] You know, so he was willing to play up anything
[01:24:15] now, yeah
[01:24:16] James you tweeted that being a super fan in the new era makes you a threat and also you said that the threat stuff
[01:24:22] isn't so much nonsense, so
[01:24:25] It's very much nonsense
[01:24:27] I mean, it's only nonsense from the concept of someone has to win the game, right?
[01:24:30] There was a process where someone doesn't like there's a chance that it's not gonna be a winner
[01:24:35] It's like then okay, but we're voting people out. Everybody is a threat
[01:24:44] Like here's the deal like
[01:24:48] Okay, my season who when is out the game or it's gonna wait let me know
[01:24:52] Um never
[01:25:00] So like what I'm saying is like I feel like maybe I'm jaded from my season, right? Yeah
[01:25:06] Where you have the gaze threat levels based on
[01:25:10] You know what that threat level is to you whether can they a
[01:25:15] Do the can they vote you out right do they have the juice right?
[01:25:18] So they have juice is different right those players
[01:25:23] If you have juice
[01:25:25] That's different, right? We ain't just like you and tell me if I'm wrong
[01:25:29] You people know the hierarchy out there like there's a hierarchy. It happens. There's a proceeds hierarchy
[01:25:35] That proceeds hierarchy right or wrong like that's just what it is
[01:25:39] Right change they just you have to kind of understand that it's like who is going to
[01:25:44] Who do you want to keep over you right where they buy them as they want to see them go further because
[01:25:50] They can't make a movement shake as much as you and you're in a comfortable situation
[01:25:54] You know you have to but everybody is a threat to win the game
[01:26:00] So it's like when it's like oh
[01:26:02] You can't manage your threat level when perception is just made up, right?
[01:26:06] You only can try to be an asset to as many people as possible in the way that makes them feel comfortable
[01:26:12] Meaning right you have to make people feel comfortable with whatever you bring to the table meaning
[01:26:19] Cody felt comfortable that Jesse knew the game because he was not a gamer, right?
[01:26:24] Right, so just the being a gamer and understanding the game was an asset, right?
[01:26:29] So but somebody else that may not have been so it's very individual and it's very relationship based and
[01:26:37] Understanding what other people may view as threatening for me. I'm a person that people gravitate to
[01:26:42] I had a big personality. I didn't realize like
[01:26:46] Yeah, I'm thinking everybody's supposed to buy right now big person out not the case
[01:26:53] As my personality was more threatening than anything else
[01:26:56] That was going on and being able to manage that part
[01:27:01] Would have lowered my threat level, right? Yeah, and that's where it's understanding the traits
[01:27:06] That make people threat at whatever time in the game it is
[01:27:11] And that's why everybody's a threat because there's no
[01:27:14] actual
[01:27:15] Threat rubric if so much about the time effort in the game
[01:27:20] Like if they knew gamer with a threat, they would have voted gable her out
[01:27:23] But everybody wants to get rid of the end even the people that status the gamer was this game right then, right?
[01:27:29] Right. So it's like
[01:27:31] You know that's where we're at with it. So yeah, I like your diatron, you know
[01:27:37] Yeah, I would the the reason I would disagree is less what you're talking about more
[01:27:43] The people who are like voted out first or second in the whole game
[01:27:46] And go into their final words and say they voted me out because I was a threat
[01:27:51] And jessica and I are like no they didn't that's not why they voted you out. That's not what happened. I'm sorry
[01:27:56] No, and you know banu was not voted out because he was a threat, you know, he could have stayed the whole game
[01:28:03] He would not have won. I'm sorry
[01:28:06] Venus I'm gonna I'm gonna say it right now venus will not win
[01:28:10] No, okay
[01:28:13] And so
[01:28:14] To my mind now is she a threat to take someone else's seat at the final three? Yes. Is she a threat to win?
[01:28:22] no, but
[01:28:23] There can be these weird situations and your season
[01:28:27] I hate to call it a weird situation, but
[01:28:31] Where all the people that everyone considered to be threats
[01:28:37] Got knocked out and you were left with three people
[01:28:40] Each of whom wanted to sit with the other two because
[01:28:44] They all viewed each other as non threats and like you said the issue is someone has to win the game
[01:28:51] so someone has to get those votes and
[01:28:55] However, the jury makes that decision
[01:28:58] Then they make that decision
[01:29:00] And so
[01:29:02] Yeah, I would not and certainly did not peg gabler as being a threat to win
[01:29:06] But then you look at how it happened and you go
[01:29:10] Oh, it's because of the perceptions and who he was up against, you know
[01:29:14] And we certainly discussed that
[01:29:16] You know plenty and so
[01:29:19] Uh, but
[01:29:21] You know
[01:29:23] Yes, everybody
[01:29:26] Not everybody most people
[01:29:28] Have some situation
[01:29:30] Where they can win
[01:29:31] But like jeff said at the beginning of the season there is at least one person probably several who simply cannot
[01:29:39] Yeah, banu could not no chance
[01:29:42] venus at this point
[01:29:45] If you had asked me two episodes ago, I would have had a different answer at this point
[01:29:49] I am saying no venus cannot win
[01:29:53] And so everybody else
[01:29:56] I think probably can I mean, you know, I mean
[01:30:02] I was just I do think that there is a lot to be said and this is something that we've mentioned before that
[01:30:08] One person can be a threat to one other person's game
[01:30:11] In that person doesn't have to be a threat across the board
[01:30:14] But that's when you really have to start looking at
[01:30:18] How is this person going to impact my game that ripple effect?
[01:30:21] And so if someone is dropping your name, well, guess what?
[01:30:25] That person is now a threat to you because they're out there dropping your name like charlie talked about that
[01:30:29] You know venus was the only one out there saying my name
[01:30:32] So I needed to vote for venus because that's a threat to charlie
[01:30:35] And so the the threat level is something that you have to look at like do I think venus is a threat to win?
[01:30:41] No, but do I think venus is a threat to take that third seat away from someone?
[01:30:46] Yes, do I think venus is a threat when it comes to just wreaking havoc and chaos and
[01:30:52] Throwing all kinds of like, you know wrenches in the works
[01:30:55] Yes
[01:30:56] And so those are the decisions that you have to make when you're looking at
[01:31:00] Who do I want to vote out as opposed to who do I want to stay and in this particular circumstance?
[01:31:05] I thought it was very interesting that they looked at it and said
[01:31:10] venus is just creating chaos who cares
[01:31:13] Right mo on the other hand
[01:31:14] She's someone who is going to strategize and we need to worry about long term
[01:31:19] And so I feel like that's to me. I don't remember there really being a moment in survivor where people are like
[01:31:26] Whoever's creating chaos. That's fine
[01:31:27] We're not worried about that person because they aren't going to be making votes happen as you talked about like can you make a vote happen?
[01:31:34] venus is not going to make a vote happen
[01:31:37] So they're willing to keep her and so that's where that component of determining what type of threat you are
[01:31:43] And what type of effect will it have on the game long term?
[01:31:46] Become so significant when you are looking at your game and where you're positioned
[01:31:51] And what are these other people doing that could potentially affect your game
[01:31:56] Yeah, I mean
[01:31:58] In every season is different like and that's the thing
[01:32:00] It's kind of like we're in every single as a different theme different different people
[01:32:06] And I feel like you have to adapt like you have tenets that are the same
[01:32:09] Right, you have the same tenets you want to adapt when you're playing
[01:32:12] And you want to take your rules. I have rules like things you want to do like my rule
[01:32:16] I had a rule like if you don't find the idol someone has it, right?
[01:32:20] I forgot about that rule
[01:32:23] Like completely
[01:32:26] But I forgot about the rule don't put somebody in the corner
[01:32:29] kind of
[01:32:32] Like like there are things you you kind of forget but it's about having that discipline
[01:32:37] But from a don't be too much of a threat is
[01:32:40] It's something that you really don't have as much control over
[01:32:44] As much as you do forming what a threat is for the season or at that time with the
[01:32:51] Mitzvah
[01:32:52] And because like people wouldn't perceive whatever you bring to the table like there may be season where mode plays where there's like three bigger
[01:32:59] Way bigger super fans than her, right?
[01:33:02] So her being a super fan. They're like, oh these people are super strategic. She's just having a good time
[01:33:08] It's about the people that so it is very much has changed
[01:33:11] So it was very much about the season you're on and being trying to create that narrative
[01:33:15] And like this is one of the I remember here at Kim Spratland say that I tried to do that was accessible because then when
[01:33:21] It's understanding the narrative and tribal councils and everybody's talking where you you're like and I even said it when I was out there
[01:33:27] I'm like, yo, this is a narrative
[01:33:29] That we're going for when we go to tribal with Jeff has these questions. Here's what we're going to say
[01:33:35] Here's our thought process. We're gonna say it's going to be this person
[01:33:38] We're gonna act like it's here when we're voting this person out like that's what we're giving
[01:33:42] You know, we're gonna be frustrating to production. Who knows maybe who knows
[01:33:47] But that's just that's how you had to do it. Jeff
[01:33:51] We have to kind of do that to get these votes off. So right
[01:33:54] It's tough. It's very tough and I feel bad for a mo I feel like she didn't do anything super duper wrong
[01:33:59] but I also feel like you have to
[01:34:02] You you have you can't you have to rely on
[01:34:05] Washeships that are you have to find the person out there when you're playing
[01:34:09] Yeah, you have to have a one person and that main person may screw you at the end
[01:34:13] But you have to find that one person out there. Yeah. Yeah
[01:34:16] Yeah, it's interesting what you're talking about, you know, the seasons can be different like I know you haven't watched Australian survivor, but
[01:34:23] on Australian survivor
[01:34:25] Because the challenges in the early goings are so much more physical
[01:34:29] The typical way that the season goes without spoiling anything is
[01:34:34] Big burly men get together and rule the roost for a while until those types of challenges don't matter anymore
[01:34:40] And then they all get picked off
[01:34:43] But in a recent season, I won't say which one
[01:34:48] Uh a recent season
[01:34:50] The smarter
[01:34:51] I hate to say smarter because it makes it sound like the burly people are not smart
[01:34:54] but the non burly people got together and we're like no, we see the muscly
[01:35:01] People getting together already. We're not gonna have that
[01:35:05] We're going to put a stop to that
[01:35:07] We're gonna turn on them early and because one tribe did it right away
[01:35:12] The other tribe saw it and said, oh we can vote out our strong people too
[01:35:17] And so it completely changed the way Australian survivor is usually played
[01:35:24] and so, you know and that goes back also Jessica to what you were saying about venus because
[01:35:30] She massively overplayed
[01:35:32] But the irony is that her massive overplaying
[01:35:36] Saved her for now. Yes because of what you said
[01:35:39] She was less of a threat than mariah because they figured out we can get her whenever it, you know
[01:35:44] Whereas mariah's danger level would just grow
[01:35:47] Yeah, and I do think that the fact that mariah was willing to like
[01:35:53] Make the play that she made at tribal council
[01:35:56] Probably didn't do her any help in that regard either because
[01:36:00] He was like, why did you wait till now to do this?
[01:36:03] Now it's not a good game move to think that you're gonna be able to change the vote at a tribal council like that
[01:36:09] But the fact that she was willing to just be like, all right
[01:36:12] Let me tell you everything that's going on right now and let me just put it all on the table for you
[01:36:18] I think if anything they looked at her and went, oh gosh
[01:36:21] Now we really need to worry about her like yes now
[01:36:25] We really need to get her out of here because she is willing to like
[01:36:29] Lop everyone's heads off at tribal council right now
[01:36:33] So we need to take care so it's almost like she solidified it for them at that moment that like this is the best vote because
[01:36:40] Yeah, this is she's being very strategic and in her timing. She made this decision. She's trying
[01:36:46] It's not she's not being chaotic
[01:36:48] She's like I am telling you truthfully and honestly like right now
[01:36:51] I'm telling you everything as clear as I can
[01:36:54] That's someone you don't want to bring back to camp with you because that's someone who has like
[01:36:58] Drawn a very deep line in the sand and yeah, so I think at that moment they're all like, okay
[01:37:03] We definitely have to vote out no
[01:37:05] So what said this I said I wasn't going to say this but wherever this conversation
[01:37:10] In the new era, I feel like it's it's better to mask your votes on emotion than logic
[01:37:16] If you can
[01:37:19] Like where you want to make your vote seem emotional because that
[01:37:24] Because that is better than you making a logically good decision, you know
[01:37:28] So like say say someone oh, I'm voting for them because they pissed me off rather than saying I'm voting for them because
[01:37:36] You know, I know strategically it's best for me. Yeah, exactly
[01:37:40] And what mode did a tribal was kind of I think cement like whoa, this was a whether you like it or not
[01:37:46] It was a strategic move to hold and wait, right? So if you're saying
[01:37:50] If the argument against you is that I am strategic person. I'm a strategic thinker
[01:37:55] Like the more like you're marching a land of slaughter, right? It's like all right cool
[01:37:59] When you go to the tribal with a deliberate like I held this information back. I let this information out, right?
[01:38:06] Without having a ally there or somebody that's like you have to put people you have to have that person
[01:38:12] You know could be kids who knows who are you gonna have that person?
[01:38:15] It's like oh or your other side when you drop this information
[01:38:19] That that like the rules of switching the rule that tribal has to be
[01:38:24] Already like the person that tells you to play or shine a dart
[01:38:27] Hey, I'm playing my side of the dirt, but I'm about to tell this like, you know
[01:38:31] Yeah
[01:38:33] Like, you know and she cemented that she's a strategic player because it takes a lot of god to keep your calm
[01:38:39] Not full of beans at camp in this day. Yeah, we had tribal
[01:38:44] Yeah
[01:38:47] It was really going down, yeah
[01:38:49] You know so and with venus was venus was like venus was raising help at charlie badigy traction
[01:38:56] So everybody said whoa like
[01:38:58] Like what get what a what can she do and then be is she a target for next week for us if we need to find a
[01:39:06] When tim said we could do both this week or viz next week or right then like can she be a possible target for the
[01:39:15] For that because that's the goal in your head and I'm thinking you're playing when you pull somebody out
[01:39:19] You want to lay the groundwork for who was the next one or two?
[01:39:23] specifically to going into this split you're knowing a split's happening
[01:39:27] You want to keep as many targets out there as possible?
[01:39:29] Which doesn't even encourage more
[01:39:32] path of play at this book because it's you don't want to actually pick size this early. Yeah. Yeah
[01:39:40] So all right, so
[01:39:42] Um, I do want to say before we leave this rule
[01:39:45] There is one thing we haven't talked about because I think the real threat that mariah posed
[01:39:50] Was that she and liz looked too much alike?
[01:39:54] So one of them had to go so that the other players wouldn't accidentally talk to the wrong person like come up
[01:40:00] They should have just switched glasses. Yeah
[01:40:03] Which jackets, you know and you know mariah could have grabbed liz's jacket and gone over and said hi
[01:40:10] I'm liz. What do you think about that mariah person? You know
[01:40:14] Was liz vulnerable?
[01:40:17] Yes, yes
[01:40:19] Yes, they were both they were they didn't even show her she didn't get a confessional
[01:40:23] She got like a couple of glimpses and I on it. I swear. Okay that part
[01:40:28] I was obviously joking about but I think the reason
[01:40:31] Production really didn't show us much of liz is they were afraid
[01:40:36] Viewers would get confused. Oh probably
[01:40:39] So you're saying now this is the list story from here on out like what you think is like now the mariah's going
[01:40:45] Liz is going to
[01:40:48] I would say probably Mary and her way to the finish like liz is your like I thought mariah I was going with uh
[01:40:56] Tyson, I thought mariah was in a good spot. Good place, you know
[01:40:59] I thought she I think liz is even in a better place like
[01:41:03] Like once you establish the hierarchy she she's a quote unquote, you know, we should be talking about this now
[01:41:09] But I just I'm just I'm pre-styling. Yeah, I was like I feel like and I could be jade
[01:41:13] That's why Liz and it's like really spot where she's not responsible for anything. She has a lot of shield in front of her
[01:41:21] And like oh, yeah, who's gonna target her we have ten and hunters. She had two shows
[01:41:27] Remember so they might be like uh
[01:41:29] KB was rich too. If you didn't know
[01:41:33] Like that was yeah, I'm jaded. I'm jaded. I'm just telling you what I am my personal jaded experience about the
[01:41:40] Yes, I just think they're all gonna go back to camp in the next morning. They're gonna see live and be like wait, didn't we vote her out?
[01:41:51] That's the other that's the other one
[01:41:54] That's not mo that's this yeah, we protect billionaire lives. Yeah
[01:42:00] I just want I just want her to uh give me a lesson on how to turn my tiktoks into millions, you know
[01:42:06] That's that's what I need. I just want to know how she's actually like all these emails these spam emails
[01:42:12] I get and somehow she's making tons of money sending people spam emails
[01:42:16] No, she doesn't send the email she teaches other people how to send but how to make people read them like well, yeah
[01:42:23] Uh-huh. Oh gosh
[01:42:24] So it's amazing. Yeah, I need a lesson. I'll be consulting with lias after you know after the season is over
[01:42:30] um
[01:42:32] All right, we can move on to the seventh rule which covers idols and advantages and game mechanics and
[01:42:37] The picture for this rule on our poster has a certain somebody immediately after her rock draw
[01:42:46] And as we discussed earlier
[01:42:49] A rock draw impacted mariah as well, but that's not something you can do anything directly about you just you know
[01:42:55] I mean you can't go. Uh, you know in addition to I think what
[01:43:00] I think rob talked about this on one of his podcasts, you know, you got practice picking rocks, you know
[01:43:05] In addition to puzzles practice picking rocks. Don't take the first one you touch. Okay. That's my suggestion. Don't but
[01:43:15] What you can do is be in the best situation possible for whatever may happen
[01:43:20] Yes, and we've already talked about how that didn't work out for her from the sega vote
[01:43:25] Uh that that had just occurred so
[01:43:27] You know there's not
[01:43:29] Not a whole lot more we could talk about other than her shot in the dark which was obviously correct to play
[01:43:34] It just didn't hit
[01:43:36] Which I think is again fascinating and no way to talk about this but that it was so well known
[01:43:41] That she was playing it and I just
[01:43:44] I don't
[01:43:47] I don't understand and I also don't I don't like the shot in the dark. I don't agree with it
[01:43:52] She was talking about how she hadn't gone on a journey and so that's affected things for her and again
[01:43:59] I am of the mindset that there's too many
[01:44:03] Additives that are taking away from a player's ability to just play the game
[01:44:06] And when you have someone like mo in a confessional saying there's this
[01:44:11] And you know this person went on a journey. So they have an advantage
[01:44:13] This person went on a journey. So they have an advantage
[01:44:15] This person, you know, we have these shots everyone has a shot in the dark and this person has like
[01:44:19] She's taking off all of these things and it's like you are definitely negatively affecting people's ability to just play
[01:44:27] Like can we have less and I know I've I've been on a soapbox about this before
[01:44:31] But I just feel like her actually pointing to the fact that she hadn't been on a journey yet
[01:44:36] And other people had and that that affected her ability to play the game
[01:44:40] And that if there was one thing she could change it would be trying to like
[01:44:44] Skiw the ability to go on that first journey because then maybe she could have built some
[01:44:48] Bridges, you know across the way. So I just feel like there is something to be said about
[01:44:54] Adding so many things like a rock draw to create a team
[01:44:59] Let them play just let them do it because they will yeah, absolutely well
[01:45:04] That's an interesting concept like even when I went on my journey. I didn't think about my journey as a surly
[01:45:10] I mean clearly they wouldn't be out
[01:45:13] Like
[01:45:16] I thought about it in a way where I wanted to build bonds
[01:45:19] But I didn't think about it from from the way she thought about it as a way
[01:45:23] When losing draw, how can I actually build relationships to gelasty?
[01:45:28] Not the way he played it, but you know, I wouldn't give up and just die
[01:45:33] but
[01:45:34] That is an interesting concept just like you have so little time right
[01:45:38] So if you have a two hour conversation with somebody prior to the merge that's two hours of
[01:45:44] or hour and a half or hour of
[01:45:48] Understanding a little bit and if you're able to pull some tribe dynamics
[01:45:54] From that that could be very beneficial
[01:45:56] If you're able to get some tribe dynamics from those as opposed to we're making the
[01:46:01] So I'm pretty sure, you know, if you're sharing information, you may not know it's on the bottom
[01:46:05] But some shows variety
[01:46:08] Maria so, you know, she didn't eat something say moe right
[01:46:13] Like you didn't say kids
[01:46:16] like so it's kind of just
[01:46:18] Like and even
[01:46:19] You know, I think Ben all these things say stuff
[01:46:22] And give people a comfort level or not comfortable level possibly with you
[01:46:26] So maybe your journey is a you got people may look in the journey as a different way of saying
[01:46:31] Even if I lose my vote right at the merge, right depending on how you use your what maybe this is a thing where I'm trying to build these bonds
[01:46:39] Like how what information am I communicating do I need to go on a journey and say
[01:46:44] Come on the outs or I'm feeling good like what is your journey story?
[01:46:48] And you need to tell a journey story and what is your your best way to move forward, you know
[01:46:53] Like I should like yeah my journey. I should just took that advance and I'm on the bottom
[01:46:57] Give me this advantage xyz right instead. I'm just like, oh, you know
[01:47:03] I'm trying to build bonds that way like that. I need to be more aggressive. Maybe you need to go on a journey
[01:47:08] Maybe you need it like yeah, it's just kind of a way to kind of think about it in the sense
[01:47:13] Of I thought giving up and being like, oh, I'm willing to be it's a good thing when I should have been like
[01:47:19] No, I know I'm in a good position. I know I'm not going to travel
[01:47:22] I know you are so I'm in a bad position. I want this
[01:47:27] I'm risking it regardless. I wasn't in good position. You know, I was like
[01:47:31] You know, it's just those things are the new parts of the game where
[01:47:35] Thinking about that from an agency point of view like you may want to be second on the boat
[01:47:39] Maybe not the first journey
[01:47:40] Maybe want to make sure you're on the second journey
[01:47:42] Maybe you want to tell the person on the first journey to tell people, you know
[01:47:46] If you get a chance to choose somebody choose this person
[01:47:48] Yeah, I'm cool with it's like it's a whole new level of how you gotta think about your relationship and what you're doing
[01:47:54] Right. Yeah, it's sharing of information. Yeah, it's you know, I think even Jeff said this it's
[01:48:00] Maybe I'm misremembered. Maybe it was mariah, but because they rarely do swaps now
[01:48:06] Journeys are the only way you're meeting people from the other tribes other than
[01:48:11] Talking to them on the mats, you know, right and so
[01:48:15] You have to use it that way
[01:48:18] About that too
[01:48:19] I feel like they gotta switch the map positions up for challenges sometimes only because
[01:48:24] Oh, I think I'm just I think I'm just if you're in the middle mat right every single time
[01:48:30] You have the advantage to communicate with both teams suddenly
[01:48:35] You know and then we saw that on my season
[01:48:37] Damn, I got a cyber game my season. No
[01:48:40] It's just right here
[01:48:41] Where it's like
[01:48:42] We weren't next to vessi ever, you know, so it's like you're
[01:48:46] You're at the things so people are so it's those even those little things right you're in a mess
[01:48:52] You're looking over you see the person shoes. Oh, you got the same shoes. Oh, you wearing your buff the same way
[01:48:58] Like it's just it's anything and you can buy those little things. So that's just my thought process like
[01:49:04] I feel like you have to move the tribes around to do all this stuff, you know
[01:49:09] Yeah, a little rain, but it's just I like that. That's a good point
[01:49:12] It's those little things from just what can you build like me? Oh, I have the same hocus-pocus sneakers on so we're looking at each other like
[01:49:19] I'm thinking well
[01:49:21] Maybe you want to do you never know but right clearly you got along perfectly and never argued or anything because of the
[01:49:28] Sneaker connection. I thought your connection was working
[01:49:31] But clearly but no but uh
[01:49:33] But like having the ability to to be next to another tribe today, you know
[01:49:37] At a boy or give a look or give a
[01:49:40] Whatever you can do there is, you know important
[01:49:42] Yeah, yeah, yeah
[01:49:45] All right
[01:49:45] Well, we can move on to appendix a which is about the players keeping their end goals in mind when voting and we talk about voting out
[01:49:51] The week than the strong than the week than the strong now because of the rock draw splitting the group into one team who?
[01:49:58] Fit the mold of strong physical threats in general and one group who
[01:50:03] Didn't uh, you know one avenue for discussion here was removed
[01:50:06] So the next question is who might be a stronger player in other ways?
[01:50:11] And this takes us back to our rule six discussion about who is or isn't a threat
[01:50:17] But it's also bigger than that because this vote helps set up what will potentially happen for the future
[01:50:24] There are several and I don't mean seven
[01:50:27] different alliances
[01:50:29] and groups who think they're in control
[01:50:33] And all of them had a common goal which was make it through
[01:50:37] Do damage to the other groups and not start a war too early
[01:50:42] And what this means is if they could come to agreement
[01:50:46] On one person who wouldn't piss anyone off who they consider important
[01:50:51] They were going to do it right now the groups that we have are the journey six
[01:50:57] The nami core alliance the journey six. I like that. Well, that's what uh
[01:51:02] Well, I think you is calling them that so I like that. That's good. Uh, don't stop believing in the journey six
[01:51:09] So you had the journey six the nami core the sega core
[01:51:14] Um and the yanu alliance now these of course overlap making the situation more complicated
[01:51:21] Uh because for example the journey six don't want to tip their hands about where they stand to their individual tribe alliances
[01:51:28] but
[01:51:29] There were two people outside of all the alliances
[01:51:33] mariah and venus
[01:51:36] Yes, and list the lizis, you know, I I mean, I think liz is part of her
[01:51:43] core in that like
[01:51:46] They were at least involving her in talking about getting rid of soda or getting rid of venus. I mean
[01:51:54] And that's a great game flag, right? Like yeah, because you have your you're at a tribe of five
[01:52:00] So you're like, okay. We got our three so
[01:52:03] So we know who our one is but we're gonna make sure this person feels comfortable enough that they're part of it
[01:52:10] And that's the game that people I want people if you're thinking about playing the game and thinking about the game
[01:52:15] That's great survival
[01:52:17] When you say, okay, we know
[01:52:19] We're we're we're we're slowing down this pre pre merge phase. We don't realize me both left
[01:52:24] Let's make sure liz is with us. Yeah, you know
[01:52:28] Going into the merge and make sure she knows that we're targeting venus and soda
[01:52:33] So in her mind liz is like, oh, I got 10 in 100 there. You know target soda and venus
[01:52:39] Yeah, I feel like those are the little things you have to look at from a gameplay that are
[01:52:46] Magnificent yeah from a hunter in a tevon where
[01:52:50] It's not like liz doesn't feel like she's on the outs
[01:52:53] So it's not Liz and mo and venus getting together and saying, oh, we have three
[01:53:00] Let's talk to y'all new and then what other person
[01:53:04] Is this like those are the little things that keep you further in the game?
[01:53:08] So I wanted to highlight that that yeah, yeah, yeah
[01:53:12] Now hunter noted that he wanted to take out mariah because sega was so strong while nami
[01:53:18] Having obvious cracks made them seem like less of a threat to others
[01:53:22] And the yanu three felt the same way not to mention, of course that you know mariah scared q because oh
[01:53:29] Aubrey
[01:53:31] But this is where we get to some of the things venus and others were saying on twitter
[01:53:37] Oh, baby
[01:53:38] Yes, yes
[01:53:40] Because you know she complained that players quote chose the boring safe vote period
[01:53:48] If you think mariah was the smart vote and I should have kept my mouth shut then lmao
[01:53:54] She also tweeted why is it a curse for young women to express logic and reason?
[01:53:59] I generally want you to ask yourselves why it was a smarter vote to pick mariah over charlie answer
[01:54:05] It wasn't it was just easier for the brochachos to maintain control
[01:54:10] Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean it's kind of answered her own question because I understand venus's perspective
[01:54:18] But the goal of the game of survivor is not making exciting moves
[01:54:26] Save votes. No, it's not. Yes. Thank you
[01:54:30] Save votes right now are often the right moves for the majority and that was the case here
[01:54:36] She wanted charlie out
[01:54:38] But she didn't understand where charlie stood in alliances
[01:54:41] There was no way sega players would go along with that now
[01:54:45] I could say well nami and yanu together could have voted charlie
[01:54:49] But again, it would have started a war
[01:54:51] It would have threatened the journey six alliance that she doesn't know about
[01:54:55] And so yeah, she's not wrong about it being easier for the brochachos to maintain control
[01:55:01] But that's the thing they're currently in control
[01:55:04] He wasn't going to change that
[01:55:06] It's like, you know, you're you're you're not going to convince the people in control to give up control
[01:55:12] plus
[01:55:13] It could be risky with the with this split tribal council coming because you never know who you'll end up with there
[01:55:21] Why make enemies right before it?
[01:55:23] And you know, I said all those things and then I scrolled on my twitter timeline
[01:55:28] And I'm like, oh hell james tweeted the exact same thing 10 minutes before I did
[01:55:35] Great minds think alike
[01:55:38] It's one of those things where I feel like it's something in the game, right? So I I never was on the bottom
[01:55:44] I mean, I was I wrote it out
[01:55:46] But like from just a gameplay standpoint like talking to other people like that actually were on the bottom
[01:55:52] I don't understand how that feels like right on the island like right
[01:55:56] I had a really fun good like
[01:56:00] Experience right but on the bottom it definitely probably feels like and she knew she was on the bottom from day
[01:56:07] One, right?
[01:56:08] And I don't understand that feeling of being on the bottom for so long. Yeah, it has to suck
[01:56:14] I mean, I'll I'll it has to suck
[01:56:17] and
[01:56:18] And and the thing about is what and I think what where where she's coming from is you're also here in the bottom
[01:56:24] You're at an information deficit to everybody else because you're at the bottom. So like that's your perspective
[01:56:30] You know from her perspective
[01:56:32] She doesn't and we'll get to this in a little bit
[01:56:34] But she doesn't think she's at an information deficit. She thinks she has all the information based on what she's been tweeting
[01:56:40] But in reality, you're right
[01:56:43] She's in an information deficit. But that's good survivor where it's kind of like when
[01:56:49] I was a little out of my season where the person comes to me and is like, hey
[01:56:52] But I'm like, yo you try to hook me out
[01:56:55] The people you tried to vote out came and told me that you were trying to hook me out
[01:57:00] Okay, like before you even came up here and talk to me
[01:57:04] Like so from an information standpoint when you're communicating
[01:57:08] Like you have to assume or try to assume where the information is is situated
[01:57:13] And that is like very tough if you are deliberately
[01:57:17] Keeping you out of the creation now with that being said
[01:57:21] understanding
[01:57:23] You want to fight the hierarchy because because it seems so
[01:57:27] finite
[01:57:28] But is it like there is no finite alliance in survival?
[01:57:33] The reba floor had a crack
[01:57:35] You know, right, you know
[01:57:37] So even that's the tightest alliance in america. But she could three
[01:57:41] I mean they didn't have a crack, but maybe they had pressure. Maybe there would have been one
[01:57:46] But they there aren't these big long-standing alliances in the new era
[01:57:51] They have never lasted they have never happened and even when they have
[01:57:56] Even last year they could have probably sent de home had a chance for something else to do
[01:58:00] In the day you get banked on the big alliance collapsing and clumpled at the beginning of the merge
[01:58:08] It's hard to be patient because people want to have agency and the question is can you do a jam jam and say
[01:58:15] And your game is at risk. He could have went home Dennis, which are like can I rely on relationships?
[01:58:21] and let
[01:58:23] And not necessarily be the puppeteer or the move maker
[01:58:27] right for the move
[01:58:29] and
[01:58:29] Can I didn't take that not taking that heat
[01:58:33] And use that to propel my game forward to the end which I think
[01:58:38] In this era of survivor
[01:58:40] I feel like D winning has been that nominee of the new era
[01:58:44] Meaning you have an alliance and you put to the end with them. That's the way I want to play. That's why I
[01:58:49] I mean jam jam did the same thing
[01:58:51] however
[01:58:52] From a power standpoint
[01:58:55] People knew D had power going into the merge right people discounted jam jam
[01:59:00] discounted social relations discounted jam jam decided caroline
[01:59:04] This this kind of cartoon for various different reasons
[01:59:08] Down with the most emotional karsten is small and jam is his
[01:59:11] Poichett's personality person who may not be in the quote-of-quote best shape, right?
[01:59:15] So you have three people who you had reasons to look at compared to other people like oh
[01:59:19] Like that's why they you know, they're this so from an agency standpoint being able to understand
[01:59:26] That having agency. That's it isn't the best thing. It may be the funnest thing. It may be
[01:59:31] The it may be what you want
[01:59:34] Some sign is not having what you want
[01:59:37] It's better like did I what I would rather I played the game with people perceiving an agency versus not
[01:59:44] If the goals win the game, I want people will not to proceed to have agency
[01:59:49] Right until the end until the end when you do want
[01:59:53] You know and that's where that fine line is drawn
[01:59:55] But that's a parent upon the rosa
[01:59:57] Right a little ponderosa
[01:59:58] That's the thing that you don't know what you're playing is that right most is revealed
[02:00:03] And you understand like oh you had real conversation there. It's like, well, you know, they said it
[02:00:08] But you
[02:00:10] That little thing just happened. Yeah
[02:00:12] Yeah, oh, yeah
[02:00:15] Oh, yeah
[02:00:15] Yeah, so I just say that to say from a rule standpoint of penising having agency versus not having agency
[02:00:22] It's funner to have agency
[02:00:24] But it may not be the best thing
[02:00:26] It's sometimes not having agency is a blessing because people don't see where you're coming from
[02:00:30] right, right
[02:00:33] Getting back to venus's tweets
[02:00:36] Um in the first one that she mentioned or that I mentioned
[02:00:40] Uh, she
[02:00:42] questioned, you know, if you think that I should have kept her mouth shut
[02:00:48] Well
[02:00:49] Yeah venus I I do sorry, uh, you know
[02:00:54] She was told it was her or mariah
[02:00:57] Overplaying at that point
[02:00:59] Could have turned things around on her
[02:01:02] Usually would have and her idea to target charlie was never going to work
[02:01:08] She did her best to turn this into the why venus lost podcast and
[02:01:15] Only thing right? Yeah, it's gonna work for y'all. It's like
[02:01:20] Like literally it should have worked for y'all like
[02:01:25] like in the day
[02:01:27] Sometimes war is good like
[02:01:30] It's yes because because because I want to say this because
[02:01:34] Everything under the surface is like a facade because everybody is a good player
[02:01:39] Like everybody's pretending to be friends like one of your rules pretend to be friends right if
[02:01:44] However, you need war war is good. You have to make you do
[02:01:51] But if you know a rock draw a rock draw is coming that's gonna split the try the the groups
[02:01:57] And you could end up with anyone then you don't want to be at war with anyone at that point
[02:02:03] True, but they're still at war with you. Like this is like one of the things I'm gonna say right
[02:02:07] But like so it's like yeah, so like formally, right? I did try to play nice and maybe I'm
[02:02:13] Internalizing right I could try to play nice, right?
[02:02:15] But no matter how nice I am right like I get like
[02:02:20] Love to me like I love jenise. He's like my baby sister. Love her to death, right?
[02:02:24] had a great conversation
[02:02:26] It's cold. I got the fire. I gave it to me my shirt on the beach. So she's like she's warm just you know out there
[02:02:32] Give her a clothing
[02:02:33] Oh my god, it's a big deal
[02:02:36] I give her my my shirt like yo, I'm warm. I'm good. Here you go. I know who's
[02:02:42] You know what I'm saying? She's still trying to vote me out
[02:02:45] Yeah, she's like yo
[02:02:48] Like you gotta go at the same time you have to understand like
[02:02:53] No matter how nice you are
[02:02:55] The war is still there, right? No matter cold war. It's the cold war. So you have to sometimes say
[02:03:02] Regardless of if I'm playing nice now if these people consider me a threat and I go into this swap as a merge
[02:03:10] Right. Yeah, it's still war. Right. So yeah
[02:03:14] so like I feel like like that is the hitting part about it
[02:03:18] That's tough and it's risky, but it's not really risky like if you were in power you had to take the most
[02:03:26] You have to
[02:03:27] Be deep keep your foot on the pedal. You're taking our Kayla. You're taking our pewie
[02:03:31] Anybody that can make a vote if you're here trying to take those people out because you are in power
[02:03:38] And that's what you have to do and where's the split?
[02:03:41] You have to if you're in that power position
[02:03:44] You have to take the most damaging person off the board
[02:03:47] And risk that war if you want to go far with your imposition
[02:03:52] Is the mistake with somebody we don't know yet, but it will be yeah
[02:03:56] I mean the thing is and we've talked about this before
[02:03:59] And other people like taren armstrong certainly has talked about it for big brother as well and
[02:04:06] When producers put in these twists
[02:04:09] They think it's livening things up, but it's really making players
[02:04:13] Contract and play more conservatively because if they didn't know there was going to be this split tribal coming up
[02:04:20] It might have been more willing to start the war now
[02:04:24] Right and would have had something that was more exciting and interesting happen possibly exactly
[02:04:29] Yeah, but because they know this is coming and they have to
[02:04:33] Keep themselves a little safer then they're not willing to make those moves
[02:04:37] So jeff says you got to make big moves, but he makes production decisions that work against making big moves
[02:04:44] Yeah, I think one of the secret scenes tiffany was actually talking about how she couldn't wait to get past
[02:04:50] This so then they could start really playing the game and it's like just let them play
[02:04:55] Yeah, just just let them play. They will play and they will play
[02:04:59] Yeah
[02:05:00] That's what tribal at the Murray's like you're just building relationships
[02:05:04] And like you know, like it is like you if you want people to play like yo, we're at the merge. We're we're voting people out
[02:05:11] Like this is what we are doing
[02:05:14] Like we're not like that's like that's split like knowing that splits coming
[02:05:18] It's so dead to the game
[02:05:20] When you're playing the game and it's hard to see like it's very tough when you're outside of say
[02:05:26] After split and keep going because you can't actually say after split
[02:05:29] like it
[02:05:30] Yes
[02:05:31] Like I want to say the strategy I said is the right thing to do start the war in my head though
[02:05:36] I'm trying to build every ally came for the split
[02:05:40] I think starting the war is better television
[02:05:43] And yeah better television, but yeah, and you know related to this
[02:05:49] Um, well somewhat related to this uh, steven fishback said on twitter and also i know it all's that the frustrating thing about the survivor
[02:05:57] Emergatory is that venus was right. She should work. She won't hurt. Yeah
[02:06:01] She shouldn't just gratefully go along with the vote while the self anointed power players generously spare her until the next week
[02:06:09] And then he continued in a pre 41 season that would be bad gameplay
[02:06:13] And she would have wiggle room to do something about it
[02:06:16] But because over half the tribe is immune
[02:06:19] She is tactically forced to go along with the plan that seven totally safe people
[02:06:24] Legislate from on high
[02:06:26] Because the risk of making waves is too great
[02:06:28] The time frame is too short and the possible targets are too limited now
[02:06:33] Venus quote tweeted this with a thank you
[02:06:37] But I have to say I don't think she quite understood exactly what he was saying because he wasn't saying that what she did was right
[02:06:44] What he was saying was if this had been a pre new era season
[02:06:49] What she did would have been right, but it's not now
[02:06:53] And you know and then venus herself tweeted
[02:06:56] I'm never going to be the player that sits quietly with a stupid grin and plays dumb if your strategy is bad
[02:07:02] I will tell you
[02:07:04] If you think that's bad gameplay then don't watch
[02:07:08] So i'll say it. Yes, that's bad gameplay and no i'm not going to stop watching because
[02:07:14] I'm sorry venus. You're not the only reason that we're watching
[02:07:17] uh discussing good and bad gameplay is kind of what we do here and
[02:07:22] You know, you might even say if your strategy is bad. I will tell you that's something she should be familiar with since she said it in that tweet
[02:07:30] In this case, she did not
[02:07:33] They'll tell you yes
[02:07:35] She did not get punished for that bad strategy by being voted out yet
[02:07:39] But again that was
[02:07:43] It was more due to the other issues that we've discussed
[02:07:48] Yeah
[02:07:50] Sorry just go for it. Oh, no, that's okay. I just find it fascinating that like
[02:07:55] I understand the dynamics of it all and and the desire to
[02:08:01] Stir the pot and make things happen
[02:08:02] But because of the way that production has created this mergetory
[02:08:06] It really does cut people at the knees and I just it drives me crazy
[02:08:12] Like I just feel like go back to an actual merge
[02:08:16] Because do you want seven people controlling the vote? You do
[02:08:19] But do you want cbs or production deciding who those seven people are? No, no, let the players decide
[02:08:27] I just like they're not
[02:08:29] Excuse me
[02:08:31] But that's what you mean like let the people figure out
[02:08:34] Who is going to be the majority and who's gonna be in control right? I'm mad. They got a
[02:08:40] Freakin
[02:08:41] Puzzle puzzle we got a word puzzle
[02:08:43] We're out by like 45 minutes like if we got an actual regular puzzle
[02:08:48] We would have actually won
[02:08:51] Like there's so much stuff where it seems as we're just so much PTSD where you're like
[02:08:56] There's so many little things
[02:08:59] There's so many little things that happen that survivors season when you're a player
[02:09:03] We're gonna like use one as much agency as possible as a player
[02:09:07] Like this is all you want like as much agency as possible
[02:09:11] well, and that's
[02:09:13] I mean, and that's you know another venus thing here
[02:09:16] She tweeted it speaking of agency. She tweeted that it wasn't luck
[02:09:20] She made the necessary moves slash promises to the right people to guarantee her spot in the merge
[02:09:27] I'm sorry venus. I just don't think so
[02:09:29] We did not see that her standing is the game in the game is such that I don't think anyone would care about promises from or to her
[02:09:38] It's very possible and likely that people told her
[02:09:43] They were keeping her for whatever reasons, but that doesn't make it so it goes back to what you were saying James
[02:09:48] Yeah, that's good gameplay on their part if she feels so strongly about this good on them
[02:09:54] And it comes back to perspectives and this goes back to why you know way back
[02:09:59] Almost two hours ago when I mentioned the tweet about charlie voting for her
[02:10:05] Because it shows she has her perspective
[02:10:08] But that does not make it objectively correct based on all of what was going on
[02:10:14] mm-hmm for sure
[02:10:16] Yeah, I mean, you know
[02:10:19] I actually like the fact that the survivors are actually expressing how they
[02:10:25] They voted and how they wanted to vote. Yeah, I wish I wish I like, you know did and could have and all the other stuff
[02:10:34] Yes, like, you know, I was talking about torches too. I would be quiet about that
[02:10:38] Yeah, like you know, I didn't you know
[02:10:41] Well, I digress it's good to see because I feel like the one thing that
[02:10:48] With the least of people that are super duper fans and super insolent
[02:10:52] Is that you want to accurate portrayal of the time out there from your perspective?
[02:10:56] But also just like what actually happened and sometimes you're learning things for the first time depending on your cast and what's communicated
[02:11:03] Well, also you just want it to be how it feels like you want the episode to say yo like this makes sense
[02:11:10] You know, you know
[02:11:12] In I I I want to say
[02:11:15] And that's why I said I say I feel for me. It's only because I never was at the bottom for a long time
[02:11:19] Right. I'm at the bottom bottom for two hours. I didn't know it. So like
[02:11:24] That's a different feeling and
[02:11:27] You are giving up so much to play the game
[02:11:30] So you just want to a quote unquote accurate portrayals of what you see it
[02:11:34] And sometimes what you see is the way it was and that's right. Oh, yeah for sure
[02:11:39] And you know, but you know this case I feel like
[02:11:43] You know
[02:11:44] It's tough. It's tough to be in her position
[02:11:47] I'm not writing her off as much as you have yet did only because I feel like I'm from a season where I feel like anybody can win
[02:11:55] Understandable understandable and I don't think she's going home next with a split where I feel like people are gonna try to take shots
[02:12:02] So
[02:12:04] We'll get to the predictions. Yeah
[02:12:06] I'll be quiet now, you know, but uh
[02:12:09] Yeah, and I mean, I know we've spent a lot of time talking about venus and people may be like
[02:12:13] Why did you spend so much time talking about venus in the why mariah lost podcast?
[02:12:17] Well, because this
[02:12:18] Appendix is about what the other what the the rest of the tribe should have done
[02:12:22] And venus is saying this is what you should have done
[02:12:25] So I think we need to address that and of course venus was part of the rest of the tribe
[02:12:30] And was the main other option
[02:12:33] But I I agree with venus. I feel like charlie was the move around
[02:12:37] Like literally if you say, yo sega who'd be went out?
[02:12:40] We want this person out
[02:12:42] And I just feel like, you know the other any other person is the move
[02:12:46] I don't know people that people went out and you have to
[02:12:49] You know go there and figure it out from there. You break out whatever you can break up and go from there
[02:12:55] Like you don't keep these status quo, but that's the problem
[02:12:59] The problem I think is that
[02:13:01] There is no yanu by itself. There's the journey six also
[02:13:06] And I think cute that is why I mean q is the one who brought it up q. I think it matters more to
[02:13:12] Huh?
[02:13:13] Maria
[02:13:14] It's like the journey five in the head. Yeah, mariah is like thank you for this
[02:13:19] alliance that I did
[02:13:21] She did the perfect thing. She was like
[02:13:23] Oh
[02:13:25] Will did not
[02:13:27] I told him to not tell me this however
[02:13:29] Yes, thank you. I will be in the recipient right. I appreciate the protection. Thank you. Yeah, but I mean from q's perspective
[02:13:36] He wants this alliance to succeed and therefore doesn't want to piss off the people in that alliance
[02:13:42] And if
[02:13:44] Tim and mariah don't want charlie gold
[02:13:49] You know and they didn't then why why start already an infighting there right? Yeah, and so
[02:13:56] You know, so that's where all these intertwined things come into play
[02:14:01] and
[02:14:02] you know
[02:14:03] But I really think the main issue for mariah in this appendix was
[02:14:07] Something she described to dalton ross where she said ultimately
[02:14:10] Is such a tidal wave and once seven people start piling on and then three more join
[02:14:16] It's just not worth it to sink your game worth it for the other people, of course
[02:14:21] She you know and and yet those people all came to a decision we discussed earlier
[02:14:24] How difficult it was to try to get them back together to rediscuss it
[02:14:29] And this you know that was another reason venus's move to
[02:14:34] Try to vote out charlie was never going to work
[02:14:37] But it was also a reason she didn't get herself voted out while trying
[02:14:41] You know once seven had spoken
[02:14:44] Everyone else had to fall in line or risk putting themselves in imminent danger for the upcoming votes
[02:14:50] And so it was kind of yeah, like she said it was a tidal wave
[02:14:54] And I think under estimated was tevin's extra vote
[02:14:59] That solidified that there was seven because hundred did lose a vote
[02:15:03] You know, so it could have been a six six situation
[02:15:07] But you know, but I'm and you know
[02:15:10] Is all these little things add up
[02:15:12] We got an extra vote for you know, jelinski to leave I'm probably not the tribe and clearly maybe he did
[02:15:18] We heard somebody but someone got an extra vote and instead of it being a possible, you know six six or whatever
[02:15:26] It's I have extra votes. So now we we're really seven
[02:15:29] So this is it's kind of like where ryan tried this it was almost accessible
[02:15:36] You know a seven to the end, you know at the merge attorney piece
[02:15:40] So like it's it's not a set in stone thing like let's just
[02:15:45] Like it's not a set in stone thing, but certain things make it a set in stone thing. Yeah, right
[02:15:52] All right. Well, it is about time to wrap things up. So james. What are your final thoughts on mariah?
[02:15:59] I picked her to be my winner pick on tyson's podcast when I was on it. Um
[02:16:05] Oh my gosh, look at that. Yeah, like I don't think that um
[02:16:10] Steve did anything
[02:16:12] That was super
[02:16:15] detrimental to her game, right? But also don't think that
[02:16:20] She did anything that was a super affirmative to your game too
[02:16:24] And I feel like it's tough when you aren't
[02:16:28] I've got like as a tough games you play when you
[02:16:31] It's a different level of toughness to play the game and not go to try
[02:16:35] Then it's to play the game and go to try like I don't think that y'all do have any hard votes
[02:16:41] Like I feel like I feel like they they wouldn't travel right? It was something was bad
[02:16:46] but their votes weren't texting from a
[02:16:49] The core three knew they were the core three from the beginning
[02:16:52] I decided that was jelinski
[02:16:54] They lost again. They're like just they lost again
[02:16:57] And like that was decided from the core three and because they didn't have that that last vote
[02:17:03] They get to play hunky dork
[02:17:04] So I don't think there have been any hard votes this season, right?
[02:17:08] So this is the actual first vote for everybody
[02:17:11] You know everybody wants to actually bc
[02:17:14] so
[02:17:15] I feel like mo just came up into this, you know
[02:17:19] This patch of and let me not discount the sega vote for jem
[02:17:23] I thought that was a consistent easy vote for them even though it may not be easy
[02:17:27] But I think it was the easy vote
[02:17:28] Um for whatever the four was in that power alliance and I feel like it's tough when you don't have your
[02:17:35] Tribal uh travel counseling. You don't have your scrambling playing well where she's like, you know
[02:17:40] You haven't scrambled you haven't been in tribal you haven't like so I feel like it was a tough situation
[02:17:45] I feel like she did what?
[02:17:48] Most people should do in these situations
[02:17:51] Except I just don't know if she had the bonds and the people that were went to the mattress for her
[02:17:58] And I think that was the hardest part where you needed somebody on that power side
[02:18:03] And that's why you have to kind of to go to the mattress for as your number one
[02:18:08] You have to try to find that number one if it's your tribe
[02:18:11] So was that I was the strive and if you don't have that number one
[02:18:15] Right then you're playing a sinking ship
[02:18:18] And the only person to win without one is gabler probably
[02:18:22] Yeah
[02:18:24] No
[02:18:27] Listen, I love that you ended with gabler. That's great. These are facts
[02:18:32] I love gabler and gabler played a phenomenal game. It's just like he literally
[02:18:37] navigated
[02:18:38] Without having the number one like Mary played with omer omer
[02:18:42] Uh, you had eric playing with heather
[02:18:44] You had cabler playing with everybody, right? Here you have jam jam to play with a tika three
[02:18:49] You had tita played with the reba. So i'm just taking staying stuff that's like literally historically facts for the new era
[02:18:56] I'm not discounting. Oh, yeah. I know y'all. I'm to the listeners. I'm just like, yeah listeners
[02:19:01] I'm not being I'm just telling you
[02:19:03] This is how the game is played now. You need to find someone that is your person
[02:19:07] Now you're not percent of time as long as stuff doesn't work
[02:19:10] Yeah from the top
[02:19:15] I do think that mariah from the beginning really did
[02:19:19] I had a very interesting take on her and I was very curious to see how she was going to do in this game
[02:19:24] She intrigued me immediately in her pregame interviews because I felt like she came across as someone who is very well rounded
[02:19:32] Someone who was had like was grounded as well
[02:19:36] Had a good idea of what she wanted the game to consist of and how she wanted to play it
[02:19:40] But she was also a bit of a wild card
[02:19:42] One of the things that I thought was fascinating is that she described her favorite hobbies as beer brewing surfing
[02:19:49] And dungeons and dragons if that doesn't give you like such a wide swath of like
[02:19:55] Who a person is I I don't know what does I mean my gosh, how do you how are those three things?
[02:20:00] What you're doing, you know, I mean it's like they are so crazy
[02:20:04] Different and and I don't play dungeons and dragons
[02:20:07] But I can't imagine that it really relates very much to surfing or beer brewing, but maybe I'm wrong
[02:20:13] But I don't think beer brewing and surfing necessarily relate to each other either
[02:20:16] so I feel like mariah has a lot of skills and has a lot of
[02:20:22] quirkiness about her and
[02:20:24] So I feel like she came into this game with like she's either going to like
[02:20:29] Go all the way because she's going to be able to draw on all of those different components of herself
[02:20:35] And then do really well in the game or
[02:20:38] She isn't going to have a focus and like like one point of her
[02:20:42] That's going to be the best part of her game
[02:20:43] And I feel like that's the mariah that we ended up with is that she had a lot of structure
[02:20:49] But there wasn't one thing that she really wanted to
[02:20:52] Focus on in the game, which is why she didn't know who her number
[02:20:56] One was she didn't know who her person was
[02:20:58] She had a lot of feelers out and she had a group out on part of the charlie's angels
[02:21:02] But charlie doesn't want to strategize with me. So that's a red flag
[02:21:06] so I I feel like she really didn't know where to
[02:21:10] put all of her energy and she kind of
[02:21:13] Let it all I don't it was like it was too too many tentacles too extended
[02:21:18] And then kind of hoping that it was all going to come in and it was all going to work for her
[02:21:22] When she found herself in a really really tough spot when she knew she was being voted for
[02:21:27] She knew that the seven and dropped her name. She knew that it was it
[02:21:29] She was going to play her shot in the dark. That's when she should have said hold up
[02:21:33] I'm cutting ties with these people that are that are throwing me under the bus
[02:21:37] And I'm going to tell you what's really going on
[02:21:39] But she waited and she held on to it and she tried to do it later
[02:21:42] And so I just I feel like the ideas are there
[02:21:45] She had a really good structure and the way she wanted to play the game
[02:21:48] But she didn't know how to focus her energy and attention on that one thing at the correct moment at the correct time
[02:21:54] So I I was really hoping that mo was going to do great
[02:21:57] I was really intrigued with her at the beginning because I didn't know how she was going to end up playing this game
[02:22:03] And unfortunately mo was seen as the strategist and seen as this incredible player
[02:22:08] And we've said it before perception is reality and also when
[02:22:13] You want to divide and conquer
[02:22:15] You want to take out the people that don't look like you and don't seem like you and don't act like you
[02:22:19] And mo was someone who was not like the majority which was
[02:22:24] the strong
[02:22:26] Herculean type individuals because of the damn rock draw
[02:22:30] so mo
[02:22:32] Suffered for a rock draw and she suffered for perception and she tried to play the game
[02:22:38] But unfortunately she just didn't like hone her skills enough. I think and that was why
[02:22:43] All right, I
[02:22:46] Yeah, I I
[02:22:48] Really think that sega had the best of intentions by acting like they were all fully solid
[02:22:53] And suggesting to mariah that she not mentioned how she was on the outs at the previous vote
[02:22:59] Tim and ben tried to protect that appearance and
[02:23:02] Not give her up until they were pushed into it
[02:23:04] But they weren't going to risk their own games over it and it backfired on them
[02:23:09] More specifically on mariah for a number of reasons
[02:23:12] The main one is they thought yanu would want to side with a solid group rather than one with a bunch of infighting
[02:23:19] However, everyone else agreed that they didn't want an apparently tight group of five to move forward while everyone else was in
[02:23:25] two's and threes
[02:23:27] On top of that word had already spread that mariah was strategic and could pose a threat
[02:23:33] We discussed the various reasons some potentially valid some not
[02:23:37] But the point is that perception grew someone who could gather allies was more dangerous than someone like venus
[02:23:44] Who had none and didn't even seem to have the potential to gain any because she'd managed to alienate so many people
[02:23:52] I of course
[02:23:53] No, that's not the way she views things
[02:23:57] But it's what other people think that matters more in this case
[02:24:00] And that view saved her for now by making her seem like less of a threat than mariah
[02:24:06] Once the determination was made. It was very difficult to change
[02:24:10] I still say
[02:24:11] much as you already did jessica and
[02:24:14] And we discussed earlier that mariah should have tried presenting the information about her being on the out sooner
[02:24:21] Maybe it wouldn't have worked
[02:24:23] But maybe it would have especially with the way venus was raising a ruckus as well
[02:24:28] Her shot in the dark only had a 16.7 chance of working and she played that
[02:24:32] So why not play something else even if it only had a small chance?
[02:24:37] We'll never know if it might have worked
[02:24:39] Going with the odds probably not
[02:24:42] Which really means mariah's path to this point as I said earlier started back on siga when she was out maneuvered and left hanging by everyone else
[02:24:52] And then even when they tried to appear together all of siga was itself out maneuvered because they didn't properly read the situation
[02:25:01] mariah
[02:25:02] Was the one who paid the price and that is why mariah lost
[02:25:06] That was sorry your winner pick is gone james
[02:25:11] Mine's actually still in the game
[02:25:13] congratulations, right
[02:25:16] Yo, so what what happens if six people play shots in the dark?
[02:25:20] Can you give away your safety don't like I wonder could you like get saved give away your safety as someone who could somebody else
[02:25:28] Can you give away?
[02:25:30] Oh, I think it's only I think shot in the dark is only for you you could give away your shot in the dark
[02:25:35] But once it's pulled you can't
[02:25:38] As far as I know you can pass your shot in the dark off someone. Yeah, they did it last season remember
[02:25:44] um
[02:25:45] So it's simply six shots in the dirt
[02:25:48] Nobody has ever they've never played more than a couple
[02:25:51] I mean like if you gave someone six shots in the park since people don't vote
[02:25:56] Oh, no, no, no, you could still only play as many votes as you have so you trade it for your vote. All right. I mean
[02:26:05] Let's just do away with it's too confusing
[02:26:08] Tribal counsel and someone gives you another one you can play it again, you know and
[02:26:12] So that's the part where I was like wait can we get sick?
[02:26:16] I would love to see six people play
[02:26:18] They get they give it to the right person and then like the person on the majority vote one vote
[02:26:22] And like if somebody out and like since people don't vote like let's just
[02:26:26] Bratch it up to 10,000 if you want to well, but the problem at the problem it emerge
[02:26:32] Is that there are actually 12 scrolls in there?
[02:26:35] So there's two safe and 10 non safe to make the one in six chance
[02:26:40] So it's possible six people could play and all of them could be not safe at this large thing once it gets smaller
[02:26:47] It's down to just six scrolls, but at the large group. They actually use 12 scrolls
[02:26:52] That's like great thinking on top of your head because that was not that deep into the thought process
[02:26:57] so like that's why you're David boomer and you know, I
[02:27:01] That is why that happens, you know
[02:27:04] And you know, I
[02:27:06] Hey, thank you for you know having me on the podcast. This has been a long time coming but a great time coming
[02:27:12] Um, and oh yeah, like this isn't so much fun. You know
[02:27:15] It is yeah
[02:27:16] Thank you and we still have more to go people may think
[02:27:19] No, you're okay. You're done because they're saying thank you. No, no, no
[02:27:22] We still got more and we still have predictions. But before before we get to predictions
[02:27:29] Just a reminder that the rules we discussed are in poster and t-shirt form
[02:27:36] And you know checklist t-shirt form. So again go to rob his website.com slash yx lost feed now
[02:27:42] I know that uh, you know james you had mentioned
[02:27:46] People should wear these shirts in pregame ponderosa now imagine
[02:27:51] If you guys had all done it on your season, then you and lindsay and cassie we've all known
[02:27:58] You know right off the bat and and you know possibly others in that season too
[02:28:03] So don't let lindsay hear this because that's the alliance that like, you know
[02:28:09] That was there. It was it was very much there like yeah, don't don't don't do that lindsay
[02:28:14] Okay, you know like, you know
[02:28:18] You had to run twice maybe three times and you shouldn't do that to talk about that possibility and you know
[02:28:25] That's not
[02:28:30] You know my villain edit that was very
[02:28:35] Your non-villain edit um
[02:28:39] So so uh
[02:28:41] Now other than that, you know, people don't have to send messages by wearing t-shirts. There are other ways people can send messages
[02:28:48] Yes, they can they can tweet us like we've seen so many survivor tweets as of late the survivor
[02:28:55] Tweet universe is blowing up. I am at jesca louis 89 and david is at david bloomberg
[02:29:02] Uh james, what are you at on twitter?
[02:29:05] So I am j the number two da jones on twitter instagram and allegedly tiktok
[02:29:12] But I don't really do those
[02:29:13] But you know, i'm like, you know, but j to the jones j the number two da jones
[02:29:18] So that's why you can find me on all type of platforms that are relevant
[02:29:23] That's why it was so hard to find you
[02:29:24] I didn't find you on twitter until several episodes in because on your season because you know, I was looking for your name
[02:29:32] Everybody thought I was a parody account. This is like the fight literally everybody's like, you know, they saw my like
[02:29:37] I didn't know about the survivor can be like
[02:29:40] I didn't know how deep like people just have random account
[02:29:43] Faces on it. So like if you saw my account with my face on it and it's like
[02:29:48] Like what my bio and everything like that you're like
[02:29:52] Is this real james jones or is this a
[02:29:56] big james jones
[02:29:58] stand-up pound, yeah
[02:30:00] If there is like a whole inside thing about my whole facebook profile
[02:30:03] My ike my my twitter profile and my like the whole thing about it that maddie who I love for 40 board
[02:30:09] who I
[02:30:11] Loved her to death and talks about all the time. So as a whole topic conversation
[02:30:17] You do your research. It's funny. Yes. Yes
[02:30:20] Well, david bloomberg, there's a lot of places people can find you besides twitter
[02:30:25] Which is why you have put it all on a nice little
[02:30:28] Page
[02:30:30] Yes, look see james trying to read it. Isn't that great? I love that
[02:30:34] Yes, uh, yeah, you could track me down that uh link tree slash david bloomberg with a dot before the ee
[02:30:41] In link tree in the url there
[02:30:44] As you mentioned i am also more directly on uh
[02:30:48] Most text-based social media like twitter and blue skies at david bloomberg
[02:30:52] On video platforms tiktok youtube and instagram is at david bloomberg tv
[02:30:57] And because threads is connected to instagram i'm at david bloomberg tv there as well
[02:31:02] I have pretty much limited it now to
[02:31:06] uh twitter
[02:31:07] for text-based twitter
[02:31:10] Threads and blue sky
[02:31:12] Uh, things just weren't happening anywhere else. So uh, but of course, you know, like I said tiktok youtube and instagram
[02:31:18] And i've been posting two or three sometimes more clips per day at at the video sites
[02:31:25] Um, you know, of course there's clips from us survivor amazing race deal or no deal island
[02:31:31] Um, the circle is starting up again soon. So i'm sure i'll have stuff from that and I think there might be another show starting up too
[02:31:39] But you know, whatever it is if it's
[02:31:42] interesting or fun
[02:31:44] I'll post it there. That's right. If it's on reality tv
[02:31:48] He's gonna do a tiktok or three about it. Yes. Yes
[02:31:53] That's right, that's right
[02:31:56] All right predictions
[02:31:58] So next week is the double boot episode where the players will presumably be split up into two groups for
[02:32:05] Two tribal councils. It's it's james's favorite
[02:32:08] Uh
[02:32:10] But and you know we have to do this because nothing says merge like splitting up the tribe
[02:32:17] I know
[02:32:19] Stop it. Yes, i'm gonna say something inappropriate. Oh
[02:32:23] uh, if the journey six
[02:32:25] Sticks together
[02:32:27] And sega sticks together and the nami core sticks together and yanu sticks together
[02:32:34] Well, then that leaves venus hanging
[02:32:36] Uh
[02:32:37] Depending on the outcome of the rock draw for the tribal councils
[02:32:41] She could be the very easy consensus and I know I know what you've said. I've thought about this before
[02:32:48] She is perfect to take to the end
[02:32:50] Yeah, but
[02:32:53] I really think they are still in conservative mode
[02:32:57] And I think they will go to the split tribal council and one group will have venus on it
[02:33:02] And they'll all look at each other and go well, that's easy
[02:33:06] And that's my prediction for one of them
[02:33:10] Other than that
[02:33:11] The only thing we saw really was
[02:33:14] Uh tiffani telling kenzie. It's not the q show now. I don't think that means that they're going to turn on q
[02:33:19] I think that means the two of them will be separated from q in the split
[02:33:24] And q will have previously told them. Hey, this is how we should vote and they're like
[02:33:29] He's not here. We don't have to listen to him and that's what that clip is from
[02:33:33] but
[02:33:34] If they are indeed split from q
[02:33:37] I think kenzie could be in trouble
[02:33:40] Because if you're one of the journey six
[02:33:43] And the journey six happens to have the majority in that group
[02:33:48] Well, they know that q is in the group and tiffani is his number one
[02:33:52] Who is the person that q didn't mention?
[02:33:55] kenzie
[02:33:56] So
[02:33:57] They could take her out without any other repercussions
[02:34:00] Because literally the only people that would piss off
[02:34:03] Are q and tiffani who are already solid members of the journey alliance
[02:34:08] So my prediction venus and kenzie
[02:34:12] Those are fascinating
[02:34:16] Go ahead james go ahead. No ladies first. I'm a gentleman. Oh gosh
[02:34:21] um, well see here's the
[02:34:24] You brought up a very interesting
[02:34:26] Little idea in my brain as I was sitting here looking at all of these things
[02:34:31] lis
[02:34:32] she really is like
[02:34:34] On her own even though she's part of nami
[02:34:38] She doesn't who's her number one? Who is she with she doesn't have anyone that she's with so
[02:34:45] I feel like
[02:34:46] Liz is potentially in trouble and wouldn't it be funny if we had back to back mo and then lis and then they could go to
[02:34:52] Ponderosa together and like share clothes and stuff
[02:34:54] And switch glasses and they really throw people off when they go
[02:34:58] They could dress like twins when they come in for like
[02:35:02] Oh, that's right. Gosh darn it never mind. I was thinking ahead
[02:35:07] But anyway, I think that lis is in a tough spot just because
[02:35:11] We haven't seen much of her and we don't she doesn't have she doesn't have anybody
[02:35:16] And I feel like it's going to be the same type of thing with mo where no one's fighting for you
[02:35:21] And she's going to find herself in you know a group of six and no one will be fighting for her
[02:35:27] And so I feel like lis is going to be in a in a tough spot in that situation
[02:35:31] And as much as I don't want to
[02:35:37] Gosh
[02:35:41] I I gotta do the venus thing too, even though I don't want to just because I agree with you that
[02:35:47] In a situation like this when you've got six and six and it's like anybody but me, right?
[02:35:53] And if you don't have anybody that's fighting for you in a group of six if it was 12
[02:36:00] I'd have a much different
[02:36:02] Thought process on all of this. I wouldn't I wouldn't want to say venus because what threat is she to anyone at this point
[02:36:08] But when you're in a group of six and it's like someone's gotta go
[02:36:12] And you start looking at well, who am I who am I with and who do I have with me?
[02:36:17] And she's not gonna have anybody with her. So I'm gonna say venus is my second choice
[02:36:22] I'll be wrong though. So it doesn't matter
[02:36:24] man
[02:36:25] I hate the choices about to me
[02:36:28] Oh
[02:36:29] I really hate the choices about to me. All right like it bring it on
[02:36:34] Um, I think it's going to be Tim and q
[02:36:39] Wow
[02:36:43] I feel like
[02:36:46] From a
[02:36:48] When people get to this
[02:36:51] Uh point
[02:36:53] Right, if you haven't had too much agency in a vote, right?
[02:36:58] Do you I think there's players now once you have agency
[02:37:02] And this is the biggest vote to have agency when you don't have agency in the larger
[02:37:09] Um, so I think basically a revolt that the peasants
[02:37:13] The people who have been treated as peasants are going to say
[02:37:18] Our king is vulnerable. We can take him out now
[02:37:21] Or it's kind of like if you like do you see
[02:37:25] Like q already has reservations about so right?
[02:37:30] A little bit, right? So they're separated, right? Now you're looking at okay. You only need three to four votes
[02:37:36] To make something happen
[02:37:38] Um, do you have four votes? I feel like there's
[02:37:42] Like they could easily put four votes on the queue
[02:37:44] If you are a sega member
[02:37:47] You know, you can at three segas in the queue. You just need one other person, right? Yeah easy vote, right?
[02:37:53] You know, I feel like with regards to so I feel like q is also a person
[02:37:59] That around this time at the merge is where people
[02:38:03] Like q and tim go out where you have these people who
[02:38:07] That you may not feel okay if I don't get this person out now
[02:38:12] To they have been making decisions
[02:38:15] And they have been their decision makers
[02:38:19] On their respect the tribes and other people want to have agency
[02:38:23] And then you start thinking
[02:38:25] If q because had a steam or someone's had a steam
[02:38:27] Can I beat them at the end?
[02:38:29] Tim was a family guy
[02:38:30] Tim has a tim has two kids at home
[02:38:32] Oh, oh, oh, oh
[02:38:34] Q his story, you know
[02:38:36] One of I think 15 or 16 children, you know worked up like I don't know how much he's shared of this story, right?
[02:38:44] And also look at the allies if you have three you don't have a unless you're three years super tight, right?
[02:38:50] You only have two so kinsy and tiff
[02:38:53] For tip perspective, right tip and kinsy and tip and q it's still two votes
[02:38:58] Yeah
[02:38:59] You know, um in the day
[02:39:01] I feel like charlie and maria
[02:39:04] They feel like they're strong too
[02:39:06] Then there's nowhere else to go either way, right?
[02:39:09] You know
[02:39:10] At the end of the day
[02:39:11] I feel like those two people that any everybody from namie can get behind
[02:39:16] And namie still has what for people and venus as much as she wants to make a move
[02:39:22] If you say it's either tim or or tim or
[02:39:26] Tim or q she's going to choose self preservation, right? She had one vote guaranteed. That's a self-preservation vote, right?
[02:39:35] So all you need is three people other
[02:39:37] Liz is going to self-preservation vote which is a guaranteed vote from two people that you don't view as threats, right?
[02:39:43] She has two people. We don't view as threats and self-preservation votes
[02:39:46] Yeah
[02:39:46] And you can take out people that are perceived as bigger threats in the big alpha guys
[02:39:51] Which is to see that venus planted or everybody else also probably see obviously
[02:39:56] So with that being said, I feel like typically the bigger person in any duo or any group
[02:40:01] Is going to be her take the shot. So I think that's tim. I think that's q
[02:40:05] I think if they're not on the same tribe one of them goes off
[02:40:08] They're the same tribe that I didn't think us is going to be venus or Liz
[02:40:12] I just head my best but I feel like it's very
[02:40:14] Succinct on where those two end up
[02:40:17] And I picked those two to go home. Yeah, I mean that's right
[02:40:20] I don't want to but I just feel like that's just where it's going to go
[02:40:24] Yeah, I mean, I do think when q goes it will be because
[02:40:29] Yeah, you know spoiler alert for the eventual yq lost
[02:40:32] Um, I think it will be because he has taken too much control
[02:40:36] I just don't we see it happening immediately yet. But based on what you're saying
[02:40:41] Yeah, if people were annoyed by the way this vote went down and they have the opportunity to
[02:40:48] Strike back
[02:40:50] It may be their time. I mean it all again. It all comes down to the rock draw if it's if it's q venus
[02:40:57] soda
[02:40:59] charlie
[02:41:01] You know and Liz and someone else then yeah, they're probably gonna turn on q
[02:41:06] So let me ask you this question right?
[02:41:08] Typically the person's in vain if everybody said this is yannu vote, right?
[02:41:12] Who's the most vocal person from yannu wc?
[02:41:15] q
[02:41:17] Yeah
[02:41:18] So
[02:41:19] Whether q determined the vote or not, right?
[02:41:22] Like we're at a masi
[02:41:24] Sorry to do that do it all the time jessey coating flips. I caught the front of it, right? Like, you know, that's the narrative, right?
[02:41:32] so no matter what happens if q is catching the
[02:41:36] The shradinal from this vote
[02:41:39] People that people told
[02:41:42] The vote therefore everybody wasn't happy with that vote. That wasn't the consensus vote
[02:41:47] No, it's the shahnavert and that's why I say q
[02:41:50] Yeah, love love q like I'm saying I feel like that's where people want to have agency
[02:41:55] Also, people haven't voted so you're you're a nominee. You didn't have any a to see you didn't get the vote
[02:41:59] If you're on c you got without jump like
[02:42:02] So people will also want to have agency in the game, right?
[02:42:05] So that's why I feel like it's a q something and that's just where I'm at
[02:42:08] Yeah, no, it's yeah, it's interesting. I think I think it'll depend
[02:42:13] I hate to end this way, but it'll depend on the rock draw again
[02:42:17] It really does
[02:42:20] It sucks like you you have a competition for captains or whatever like that
[02:42:24] Whatever it is it can be musical chairs captains
[02:42:28] Who cares but give people agency to choose these things right? Yeah, right? Yep
[02:42:33] All right. Well, you know the one thing people do have agency to do that is to join the rhap patron program at rob has a website
[02:42:41] com slash patron
[02:42:43] You get access to all the special podcasts that are put out just for patrons plus the facebook groups and discord
[02:42:50] And of course you support shows on the network like ours
[02:42:53] And uh, so go to rob has a website dot com slash patron and join there
[02:42:59] Also, make sure you're subscribed to all the reality tv rehap ups podcast by going to rob his website dot com slash
[02:43:05] Rehap ups feed and selecting your podcast service of choice
[02:43:09] You'll not only find content like us obviously
[02:43:13] The b&b
[02:43:14] survivor international also though podcasts on a number of other shows like the amazing race which is going on right now
[02:43:20] Canadian big brother, which is going on right now and
[02:43:24] The number of different other shows and topics all of them on the rehap ups feed. So make sure you go there
[02:43:32] And I would like to thank everyone who is part of
[02:43:36] The
[02:43:37] R half that you have just heard about all of the incredible content
[02:43:40] Thank you just got same here for all of the editing that he does not only for
[02:43:44] Wide-blank loss but all of the content that you've just heard rob sister
[02:43:47] You know puts out so much material and so many things that are of just great
[02:43:53] Context and quality and just a range of things and james is clapping
[02:43:58] And he should because there is so many things available to you as a listener
[02:44:01] So you should definitely become a patron
[02:44:03] So thank you to everyone from our half for all of the things that you do on all of the information
[02:44:07] And all of the content that is created
[02:44:09] And thank you james for joining us today
[02:44:13] And as we did say this was a long time coming and this was a lovely time
[02:44:17] So thank you very very much. Thank you to the listeners for hanging in there for over
[02:44:22] Two hours and we're gonna be over 40 minutes. So
[02:44:25] Thank you for listening. I hope it was well worth it for you. We do appreciate the support
[02:44:29] Oh, yes, you well
[02:44:31] I think you did we'll have to we'll have to go back and check but yes
[02:44:35] Wait, we had a three hour though once in me. I think
[02:44:38] I feel like that was was that was Carson or no, I think that was adam
[02:44:42] I think it was three hours. Well, okay. Well, but yes, but james you're right up there
[02:44:46] So thank you so much for joining us. I really appreciate it. This is a good time
[02:44:51] David as always I appreciate you and you make me come back and do this all the time
[02:44:55] And I love to be here with you. So this was lovely. Sorry mo that we had to talk about you though
[02:45:00] Yeah, and and venus and venus
[02:45:03] Because we talked a lot about her uh, but
[02:45:06] But at least venus is still in the game whereas mo doesn't
[02:45:09] Yes
[02:45:11] Yes, thank you also for me james, you know, I'm so glad we're finally able to get our schedules to match up
[02:45:17] And it ended up being great timing to discuss this in
[02:45:20] mergetory, uh, you know if we
[02:45:23] You know like uh, so with the and the whole discussion of threats it all came together
[02:45:29] Really well, uh, so
[02:45:32] Finally at least it worked out well
[02:45:34] Uh, thank you. Of course jessica for another great episode
[02:45:38] We will see everyone in a week for a double episode
[02:45:43] and of course
[02:45:44] People can find us online
[02:45:47] Between now and then and see what we have to say
[02:45:50] On twitter and some of these other places until then
[02:45:54] Bye everyone. Bye
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