The Pride Has Spoken | Episode 15: Aysha Welch

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[00:02:12] Welcome back to The Pride Has Spoken Season 4. It's 2025 and we are back. My name is Grace Leder. I use she, her pronouns. But of course, I'm not alone. First, I'm here with Matt Scott. Matt, how are you doing? Yes, I'm Matt Scott. I'm happy to be here for The Pride Has Spoken. And I use he, him pronouns. But it's not just the two of us. It's the three of us. We've got Dr. Evie Jakoda. Evie, who are you? How are you doing? What are your pronouns? Hi, Matt.

[00:02:41] I'm Evie. I use they, them pronouns. I was on Survivor 41. And more importantly, The Pride Has Spoken Seasons 1 through 3. And I am so thrilled that we get to do another season of this beautiful show. So I'm just so excited for another year. I feel like I, this is one of the most special parts of Pride Month to me every year for the last, now this is our fourth year, which is so cool.

[00:03:04] And I'm just so excited to bring all the people, our beautiful, our beautiful collection of queer and other LGBTQIA plus identity reality show contestants. It's so special. It's the best. Yeah. And to talk with you both about it. I know. So fun to get to pod with you. Sometimes I wish the guests weren't even there. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I mean, like right now? Yeah. If you've never listened to The Pride Has Spoken, that's exactly what it is.

[00:03:31] It's an interview style podcast where we have LGBTQ survivor, mostly survivors, but we've had people from other shows on as well to celebrate those people who are LGBTQ, have been on our television screens, to get to chat with them about their experience being LGBTQ on the show. But also what we didn't get to see on the show and anything else that's going on in their lives. And it's lovely and wonderful. And I agree with both of you that it's my favorite part of one of my favorite parts of Pride Month that we get to talk with all these people.

[00:03:58] And then people start reaching out being like, I love this podcast and it's the best. So that's what we're here to do. If you are, you've probably seen, people have seen Matt, the title of the episode, but do you want to just like set up who is going to be joining us today? Yes, we have the phenomenal, the iconic, the ever beloved RHAP podcaster and Survivor 47 legend, Asia Welch on. And this is such a special one.

[00:04:27] I think we'll get into it, of course, in the conversation. But this is a coming out for Asia in so many ways. And it was a beautiful conversation. It will be a beautiful conversation as we get into it. Laughter, crying, all of the things along the way. But so beautiful. And I'm just thankful that we could have this space. Abby? Yeah. And there's a love story. Stay tuned. Check it out. It's wonderful.

[00:04:57] It's just so wonderful. And it's just, it is the most beautiful, special thing that someone would want to come out to the public on our platform here. And we're just, I'm so honored. Two years in a row. Two years in a row. Yeah. It's really the best. It's been so, so, such a treat to get to. I think, I think it's both so lovely that people see this as a space that they want to do that. And that's, we get to provide that for them as well. It's the best thing ever. So we all have a ton of other lovely guests.

[00:05:26] So we are planning to have five episodes this season. One every Sunday. So look forward to another Pride of Spoken episode coming every Sunday with a different LGBTQ survivor or reality TV contestant or personality or whoever walks through the door. Virtual door to hang out with us. Every year we also raise money for an LGBTQ charity. Yes, Grace.

[00:05:50] And I'm so honored to share that this year we're donating proceeds to the Trevor Project, the world's leading organization focused on LGBTQ youth and keeping them alive and thriving through prevention and intervention. Through crisis services 24-7, peer support, advocacy, public education, research. Overall, they're focused on reminding people that they and you, each and every one of you, deserve a welcoming and loving world. And you can check them out at thetrevorproject.org.

[00:06:18] There are t-shirts available on RHAP's store. I think it's RHAP's store. If you Google RHAP's store. Yeah. I'm pretty sure it's robhiswebsite.com slash store. You can definitely find it on robhiswebsite.com. That's correct. There are t-shirts. There are also very limited number of buffs still available. And I meant to wear mine because I have mine in the background. Check them out if you're watching the video. You're seeing the coolest buffs ever.

[00:06:47] And every time there's a live RHAP event and there's a group picture of everyone wearing their shirt, it's warm to my heart. It's like the best thing I've ever seen. It's my favorite thing. This year, I think we're also going to have other merch. So certainly a sweatshirt should be available because it's easy enough to put the RHAP, the Pride of Spoken logo on other pieces of merch. So if you have other things you would want, we can't promise, but we'll see what we can do to make those happen. Certainly a sweatshirt might be available this year as well.

[00:07:16] And then I am working in the background, Matt. Oh, the background. You two are helping me out. In the background. Not this background right here. You tried to put together another fundraiser this year. So we've been selling the T-shirts. We've sold the buffs. I am going to try something new. I think we're going to do a little bit of a raffle thing where I have been talked with many LGBTQ survivors about the potential of maybe some Zoom calls, maybe some items that are signed, things like that.

[00:07:45] So we're not ready quite yet. Typical queer people, not exactly on time. Whoa! Whoa! It's funny because that's not me. But that is a stereotype about the rest of our community. But I think that's how clear. There's only type A and type B. Like, yeah. Two types of queer people, yes. So we're working on it, but we should have some information about a special charity raffle that we'll do.

[00:08:13] So basically if you send us proof of a donation, we will enter you into a raffle to win one of several prizes. That's the plan. That's the plan. Anything else? Matt, did I miss anything? Oh my gosh. Well, yeah. We're, I mean, Evie's referenced this. We're on RHAP's YouTube. YouTube.com slash at RHAP or something like that. Find us on YouTube. Look at our beautiful faces. It's so much better than just listening. Well, you know, listening is great too. Keep doing that. We love that also. This is a podcast. Watch and listen. Listen to the podcast.

[00:08:42] Then watch us. Do both. If you're just listening, I want you to know we're all extremely hot. That's right. Oh, yeah. Hotter than you can even imagine. You might want to check it out. You might want to check it out. Yeah. Videos often get flagged for being too sexy and we have to go, oh, you know, it's okay. It's fine. Yeah. Too hot queer people. We can't like T-O-O. There's three of us. And we have a hashtag for social media, Evie, as well. What did you say? We have a hashtag for social media. Yeah, we do.

[00:09:13] Hashtag the pride has spoken. Tag us. Tell us how you're feeling. Suggest guests that you want to see this year or next year. Tell us organizations you want us to be supporting and send love to our beautiful guests for sharing their stories with us because it really is just the most special thing. And if it means a lot to you to listen to it, it probably will mean a lot to them to receive some glows back. So send the nice things your way.

[00:09:40] And if you even think about writing a mean thing with the pride has spoken, hashtag get the heck out of here. That's ridiculous. We definitely swore on this podcast earlier, but I like that. That's true. Get the heck out of here. I backtrack. It's okay. It's not in our nature to be so mean. All right. Well, let's jump to the conversation with AJ because it is lovely and a delight and a treat. I'm so excited for everyone to see it. I'm so excited.

[00:10:10] My Empfehlung an alle Entrepreneurs startet mit Shopify erfolgreich durch. I use Shopify already since the first day and the platform makes me no problem. I have many problems, but the platform is never one of them. I have the feeling that Shopify their platform continuously optimizes. Everything is super einfach, integriert and linkable. And the time and the money that I do so spare, can I invest in other than that.

[00:10:44] I have the feeling that Shopify their platform continues to optimise. Alles is super einfach, integrier and verlinkbar. And the time and the money that I do so spare, can I invest in other than that. Especially in growth. Now to test it on Shopify. Shopify.de Welcome back to the Pride has Spoken. We are here with another, our first interview of 2025.

[00:11:10] And we are delighted to be joined with the one and only Asia Welch. Asia, how are you doing? Woohoo! Hello. I'm doing well. So excited to be, I mean, talking to all of you, you know. Thank you. I think Matt, you're the only one that I've never like talked about a team. Well, maybe Big Brother. I don't know. We did one wrestling podcast together. Yes. One. Our one. That's it. The one that I was like, I was way in over my head. We're sorry. I'm sorry.

[00:11:40] Mari and I apologize for that greatly. But yeah. Yeah. But Grace, you and I have talked about Big Brother plenty. Evie, we have the ultimatum career love. And are we, are we officially, are we going to do season two? Oh, absolutely. Should we talk about it? Yeah. Okay. Hell yeah. Let's go. Coming June 25th. Yeah. And so very excited for that. That is like well overdue because that is just, if you haven't watched it, go check it out now on Netflix.

[00:12:06] If you like this podcast, you will probably watch the Quirrell Tomatoes. It's like on Netflix with like the suggested next thing to watch or YouTube next thing to watch. Like that's solid. Yes. Gosh, that's so exciting though that we're here. I mean, I feel like this is, I mean, Asia, you're the guest. Like it's, it's wild to think about because you, me and Grace, we became part of our HEP almost exactly five years ago. We haven't aged yet.

[00:12:35] Oh, but five years ago, class of 2020. And now here we are like a different dimension. You are the guest on The Pride is Spoken. I know it's, it's so, it's so weird. For me, because I feel like I've grown so much since starting to podcast for RHAB. I mean, obviously grown as a podcaster, but I feel like obviously through experience going

[00:13:03] on to Survivor, I'm just like the person I am today. It doesn't feel like I'm just five years removed. It feels like that is a, oh, that, that was me growing up, but this is like me in full form. So it's, it's, it's wild to know. Like I could track it over just looking at podcasts over the years. That is a really interesting part. Yeah. It must be the class of 2020 of this. Like our lives are so documented over the last few years.

[00:13:29] Um, but it's, you know, when just, I'm going to break the ice a little bit here, which is, uh, uh, we were Matt, uh, I mean, I got together and we're like, all right, probably this is year four. Is that right? That's wild. That sounds about right. Yeah. We would probably talk all about this on the intro, but that's okay. We're going to do it again here. And, um, we're throwing out names of people, which is very fun. First of all, you have to say there's nothing that feels more homophobic than being on the Pride is Spoken and trying to get, and you're like, I think

[00:13:59] this person could be on, but I don't actually know if they're queer or not, but I was like, I think Matt threw out your name. And we're, I think I did. I'm going to clarify how I read it. It was like, Oh yeah. Like, of course. Yeah. Like, of course. Like, cause I couldn't remember Asia if this was like news or not. Let me just, let me just take, pick up where you left off with that. Because like, I also, I'm like, Oh yeah. Like even going back to last fall and you could talk more about that journey, but I'm just like, Oh yeah. Okay. Of course.

[00:14:27] Like Asia, Asia has a girlfriend, of course. Like, but I specifically remember going up to you and being like Asia. And I think Sam Moore was like, Matt wants you on pod friends. Uh, and you were like, well, there's that, or we could do the Pride has spoken. And I was like, great. And then you followed up on it. We made it happen. And so what a journey, but yes. I know. Go for it. Our reactions. I love that.

[00:14:55] I could be a guest on the Pride has spoken as like a coming out message. And I think people should use that if you're looking for a way. I actually met someone recently, a fan who was like, I listened to the Pride has spoken. Wink, wink. Nod, nod. And I was like, yeah, I got you. Yeah. I love that. We, we, I think are going to have new merch this year. Like, and I think the merch is generally just going to be like, you can get some other than a t-shirt, but there's also the idea we've been throwing around of other like new merch designs. And I do think a good one could be Asia. I could be a guest.

[00:15:28] If you know what I mean. Right. Wink with a nice. It'd be Asia winking. Oh, that's, oh, that's hilarious. Yeah. Cause okay. I have listened to every episode of the Pride has spoken. Um, and if people are like, what is Asia doing here? We're just, we're just circling around it. Uh, Matt, like you said, I do have a girlfriend. Um, I am bisexual.

[00:15:52] Um, and it's something that like, since podcasting, like since starting to podcast, I've known. Um, and so it's been one of those things, like even the episode y'all had when you had, like the, it was from the podcaster, like you had podcasts. That was just like, you know, uh, I don't, I don't like, I could say something, but then I could just like sit in the shadows and just continue to just exist. Right.

[00:16:19] Um, and so it's just been this interesting journey I've been on and just like learning about myself. I would say I've known my, most of my life. Um, but I think part of the privilege of being bi is that, oh, it's easier to just, like, I can just say men because I don't have to deal with talking about it with my family.

[00:16:47] I don't have to worry about people's perception. Um, and I don't have to worry about judgment or anything like that. And then it finally was like COVID when I was like, what, why am I like, who, who am I doing this for? Like, am I living my life for other people or do I want to, you know, be happy myself? And that's when I like came out to my brother who was also bi. And, um, yeah. Did you know that when you came out to him? Yes. Yes. Oh my gosh.

[00:17:17] And it's funny because, uh, when I told my mom, uh, I was like, me, we, we have more in common than you think. Like, what do you mean? Uh, and he was there with me, uh, to, to like deliver that news. Um, and so sweet. Yeah. It was, it was a really like pure moment. We were at my house. Um, and she was just like in town visit or they both were in town visiting. Um, and I had overthought it. I was just like, Oh, what if she like, you know? Yeah.

[00:17:47] Yeah. You don't stay. Um, so I'm like, what, preaching to the choir. Um, but yeah, I was just kind of, it like when, when I ripped that bandaid and told her and told my brother, I was like, okay, now I feel, I feel like me. Like, I feel like there, I'm not living in some type of like disguise. I feel like I can be fully myself.

[00:18:16] Cause you know, you, you could feel that way even in, in like playing survivor, like you're hiding one thing. So you feel like you can't be open about everything. And so I feel like, Oh, if I'm, you know, if I, if I'm being fully myself, I don't have to like hide how much I love the ultimatum queer love, you know? Right. Um, and so when I, I think even at that point, I still was in a place of just like, but that

[00:18:45] doesn't mean that I'm just going to start dating women. And like, at least I I've, I've identified that about myself, but that doesn't mean that I'm ready for that part. I don't, I'm not ready for, Oh, have a girlfriend people, you know, cast whatever judgment or whatever. And then, um, yeah, fast forward to now. It's one of those things where like, yeah, you, it's, you come out every single day, every

[00:19:11] single time you're telling somebody, Oh, I have a girlfriend or, or whatever. It's you coming out. And so I've, I have found like through the, like through my season of survivor, through season 48, going to events and stuff. And I'm like, the easiest thing for me is just be like, Oh, this is my girlfriend. It's out there now. You know, just we keep it pushing. Then you, then I don't have to have that moment of like, let me sit you down and tell you my sexuality.

[00:19:39] Um, but it's, I think what, for me, the reason I was saying up front is just like hiding in the shadows or whatever. It's because when I am, even when I'm on podcast with the hours and hours and hours of podcasts I've been on, it's something I've never talked about. And I just rarely talk in detail about myself. May talk about places I've been talking about my dogs, of course, but talking about yourself is completely different. Yeah, it is. And it's like, it is so powerful though.

[00:20:08] Like I have to just say the line because it's the famous line, Asia, you are forging your own path and we'd love to see it, but it's, it's so interesting because I think we all can relate and I especially wonder Grace's perspective on this, like when you're podcasting, you are so exposed and something I've come to with the pride has spoken, but also with pod friends is just like, I'm talking about whatever and whatever's out there, whoever's going to listen

[00:20:37] and like, you can't hide at some point once you share those things. And it's kind of like, I found it's nice to be seen by people. Like I was already, I know I was messaging with you yesterday about this, but like just the response that people will even have to this, even though they already like know you so much and love you so much is powerful. So thanks for, for sharing all this. Yeah. It's, it's, yeah, it's so, it's so awesome that you're here. You're talking about it.

[00:21:06] Like, and I, the thing is like no expectation for people to talk about it, but it's like the fact that you approach men were like, so, you know, the pride has spoken, you know, they're coming back. Like, but it really is like, I do think like one of the things that I really did, didn't expect to come out of the pride spoken is just how much, like, I think that this series has resonated so much with, with bi people and specifically by folks who have like often been in like hetero perceived relationships. Like the amount of messages I'll get every year about the pride has spoken being like,

[00:21:35] when you said like you're queer, no matter what, like, even if you're in a, you know, it's a cis man with a, like a cis woman, it's like my sexuality is valid. They're just like, thank you for saying that. It seems wild. Yeah. You have to say it, but I do think there is like, that's such a common theme of especially people feeling like, yeah, there is something I think it's like really interesting about that perspective from, from bi people. Mm-hmm. And I'll also just like add, cause this is, you made this comment Asia of like it being

[00:22:04] easier in a way when you're bi, but I think that's also like as a bi person who typically dates men more, it's like, it is challenging because it's not like, here's this thing. I'm gay. Like, this is my truth. Like I have to own this. You have this other way that society treats and perceives very differently. And I do think that adds to the complexity of it all sometimes. Right. Absolutely.

[00:22:33] Because I think even the just years of just like thinking about it or just like, um, even thinking, even like growing up and maybe having a crush on even like having crushes on boys, but then also having crushes on girls and me at the time thinking, oh, like if I dated

[00:22:56] girls, I would like her when that's not a thought a straight person has, but normalizing it myself for so long. Um, and then finally getting to the point where like, okay, I'm confident in this. I know this is like, I know this is how like, um, I feel and where my preferences, preferences lie. Um, I think it's still something that you still have to like stand 10 town, stand, stand

[00:23:25] 10 toes down on because I've dealt with both. I've dealt with, um, guys where I've been open and just like, Hey, just so you know, front, like this is my sexuality. And they're like, are you sure? And even women who are like, um, are you sure? And so it's just kind of like, okay, we already have to deal with people who aren't a part of the community questioning, um, people's, you know, sexuality, like for one reason or

[00:23:50] another, but then even to do it in like romantic pursuits is like, you know, it's not something that you think about that you have to deal with, but then when you encounter it, you're just like, okay, this is one more battle, I guess. That's so stupid. I'm so sorry that you've experienced that Asia. I also, I was going to ask, like you said, you basically like you were, there was a time when you really came to it and yourself of, um, like your buy-ness.

[00:24:19] And I was wondering if, if there was something that happened at that time or like, really like what, what brought you to that place? What, when are we in life? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I guess like, I mean, for sure, it definitely COVID times. Like, and I would say like, um, if I'm thinking like 2020, 2021, um, even. So what are you up to? Right. So I'm starting a podcast. I'm working from home fully now.

[00:24:46] Um, and so I'm just kind of like in that full, just like self-reflection, self-discovery phase. Cause I'm getting all this time without interaction with people. Yes. So I'm like, is this what I needed? Like, it's a little bit of like things out. Yeah. You're like the whole, you just, the people that we kind of, I feel like we're, I was on autopilot for so long and then it's like COVID and you're like, Oh, there's so many of my routines that are not like, that's just cause that's the way the world was, you know? Yeah. The world changed so dramatically. Exactly.

[00:25:16] And I was single. And so I think being single, especially in this day and age where it's just like, okay, where I'm at an age, even then, what is that? Five years ago. So even then I'm at a place where a lot of my friends are married, have kids, the ones that are single are actively looking. So then it's kind of like, okay, you're kind of the oddball if you are choosing to be single because you're just trying to like figure things out.

[00:25:44] Um, and so I think in that place, I was just like trying to figure out, okay, what does this even look like? If like, what does this look like in future dating? Like you, you pill the bandaid, you express your, uh, like your sexuality to like a future romantic interest. How are they going to react to it? Are they going to also have another like, Oh, well, are you sure moment? Then you're just like, okay, then maybe I didn't have to say anything.

[00:26:12] Cause I did, I, which isn't the, isn't the solution. Like, I think it's very important to like, no, um, like know who you want to love. Uh, and because I don't necessarily, I'm believe that like, well, it's not that I don't believe, but I think people put such an emphasis on labels. And then if people don't understand the label, then it's on you to have to explain.

[00:26:39] And it's just kind of like, it's a lot when you just want to be yourself. Right. And so even thinking about that, I'm like, okay, if I'm dating someone, do I just go from Asia or am I just like, Oh, this is Asia who's confused on who she wants to date? You know? Um, so it's such a stigma, uh, with, uh, bisexuality as well. Um, yeah, that's what made it like very, I mean, like it was odd.

[00:27:06] So even once I realized I was like, okay, this is who I am. That's why it took me a while to even like, okay, let me change my preferences on hinge. Let's see what's out there. Um, you know, go on a few dates, but I think it was, so I, one, I went on a date with one guy and he was like, Oh, so like, um, have you like, tell me about your exes? Like, uh, what was she like? What was he like? And I was like, wow. Why? I was like, why did you say she? He's like, I don't know.

[00:27:36] I don't want to assume. Uh, I love that. No. Um, but I was like, okay, that's such a nice perspective. I was like, that was one of the moments that just was kind of like a sigh of relief. It was like, okay, not everyone in the world is going to be like, Oh my gosh, just this, you know, I'm going to judge you for this. Um, and so that's kind of what like brought me to that place. And I also was in a place in life where like I was raised Christian. I still am Christian.

[00:28:07] Um, and I was in this place when I graduated from college, which was in 2013. So yes, 12 years ago. Um, so long ago, I am 33. Since not that long ago. Oh my gosh. No, no. It just feels like, yeah, I'm in the same way. I'm also 33. So it's like, I'm about to be 33. Oh my gosh. You guys. Wow. Look at us. Okay. Oh my God.

[00:28:38] And you guys are queer. Oh my God. Shocker. But I will take this minute to be the baby for two more months. Okay. I'm 32. Just 32. Wow. Yeah, exactly. So after college, I was in this place where I was just like trying to figure out like what my faith is going to look like because growing up, it was always a thing I did with my family. And so being out on my own, I'm just like going to church. I'm like, Oh, this is feels different without my family around me.

[00:29:05] So now I'm like trying to, you know, be more established in my faith on my own. And then I got to a place where I was a part of a church that I was serving every weekend. I'm talking Saturday, Sunday, because it was a mobile church setting up, breaking down, serving the services. And then serving. You were serving all kind of looks. Right. That too. No, I was on like the production team.

[00:29:34] And so I did that for three years, like consistently, like maybe I would have a weekend away where I was like traveling or whatever. But like every weekend at this church and it turned, I was like, I got burnt out. Right. Like it was no longer like, Oh, I'm going and enjoying the service. It's like, Oh, I'm no, I'm going to work and I'm not even on staff. And so that I also stepped away from serving and from serving at that church at the beginning of 2020.

[00:30:02] So now I'm just like really in this, like turn the page, like, okay, I'm about like relationship over religion. And so it's kind of like, how do I define that? Cause you know, people ruin religion is what I believe. And so I'm just like, okay, how do, what does this, what does my relationship with God look like moving forward now?

[00:30:25] Not being a part of that church also while discovering my sexuality, knowing the, the, the stigma that is in the church. If you weren't had even witnessing things of people around me that were serving that may have like come out at the time and like how people were passing judgment then. Um, so, so then I was in this really transformative period in 2020, um, because it was such a big part of my life at that time.

[00:30:54] And then also starting a podcast. So now I'm in this space where like, I don't even post, like, I'm not the type of poster on Instagram where I'm just like, Hey guys, check out what I'm doing today. Da da da da da. Like I don't talk to my phone. I'm like showing you what my dogs are doing or showing you like an experience. You do have my best, you do have the best content online. I won't say. The best content. They're the best. Oh yeah. Thank you. Um, and so I'm like now, okay, now I'm the face, right?

[00:31:24] Or like I'm a face speaking in front of a mic and now I'm opening myself up for people to have opinions about me, like about whatever, like it doesn't even like even just about my opinions about big brother, you know? So it was in, a lot happened in 2020. Yeah. Well, just on that note, I was also a full pandemic. I was like, I'm curious if you knew there was a full pandemic that was happening.

[00:31:50] But it's, it's interesting because like, I'm so curious about like what your relationship with feedback is like, this is, we'll get to more of the queer stuff, but like, are you, were you like looking at the comments? Cause I feel like the thing is like when you're so out there and exposed, like, and I think of Deshawn with this actually, where like you're on survivor and we haven't even gotten to that point yet, but like you're on survivor and people just perceive you in certain ways and that could be insanely vulnerable. Like you are on podcasts all the time.

[00:32:18] People perceive you in certain ways, whether or not you're like comfortable sharing that. I'm curious how that has been. I'm in what role like podcasting has played with your coming out journey. And then of course there's survivor with that too. But curious if podcasting was a factor in that at all. It's so funny you say perceiving. Cause that's like something I always tell my girlfriend cause she's so observant and she'll be like, Oh, I noticed this. And you didn't, you know, you were acting this way. So are you okay?

[00:32:47] I'm like, stop perceiving me. You say that all the time. But with feedback from podcasting, so pre-survivor, I was very much so like, I read it, but it's just kind of like, I don't know, like if I value opinions from people that I know. And so in that situation, it's like, this is this faceless person. I have no idea.

[00:33:12] I think I just had, I think, well, just growing up as a black woman, I've developed very thick skin throughout the years. Right. And so even just like, Oh, getting a random DM of someone calling me the N word, you know, just like, okay, blah, you know? So it is, it's disgusting. Like the type of people that will engage because the people that love you, like you, you meet them at events and stuff, but they're not the people that are constantly like in your DMS,

[00:33:41] like saying something or hiding behind like a Twitter profile picture. So it's kind of just like, I, I, I block very easily. I don't respond much on, on social media. Like, okay, if it's in a DM and you're personally telling me something that we like, we can, it's a conversation we can talk about. But if you're just attacking me, then I'm just like, I just blatantly ignore it.

[00:34:06] And so that was interesting heading into survivor because I was just like, okay, I gotten it on a small scale. So no matter what happens, you know, if I go out there and go first and people have all these opinions or whatever, then I'm just like, I had, I, I, I feel like even though I am, um, uh, online a lot, what, what do you call it? Um, I don't know. Chronically online. Chronically online. Chronically online. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:34:35] Even though I'm chronically online. Um, I think I have a healthy relationship with like notifications. Um, so, you know, comments or whatever, like, I don't, I don't even think I've seen all the comments that were on like the post that survivor posted to like my torch being snuffed. Cause it's just like people, people always have opinions that are just like, I don't have to pay attention to. And just like, literally who cares?

[00:35:02] Like if you, like, if you watch survivor and like thought Asia did bad at survivor, who fucking cares? Like, like, Oh, you're going to write that on an Instagram post. Okay. Like, you know what I mean? Like that's okay. It's just going to go like live her life and like got to go on survivor and play the game that you want to play. And like, I'm just like, like truly, truly like, what is the, if you find yourself doing that,

[00:35:28] what there's obviously so much more missing from your life than like, like the, the thing that you're trying to put out there, it's just like, it doesn't matter. And I just, yeah, I'm glad you went in with that attitude going on already. Yeah. It's like, what do you, what did you get out of that? No, right. Yeah. Like instead of me responding, what did you get out of that? Um, what's the ideal outcome for that person? Exactly. Like, yeah. Like, Oh, I'm sad. Hmm. That sucks. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Exactly.

[00:35:58] Um, but that, I mean, even just knowing that no matter what I say, um, people may have an opinion about it. I think that helped me going into survivor and just knowing that like, it was very easy for me to talk with the cameras around where like plenty of people off my drive would say things like, Oh shoot, you know, forgot the cameras.

[00:36:23] Um, and so it was like, I'm used to being in a space where I don't have to be like, Oh, if I'm going to say something, are people going to feel a certain type of way? I'm like, no. Cause I watch, I listen, I do podcasts. I don't listen to them back, but I know that I can stand behind everything that I said. Oh, it's such an interesting, I think we've never had this conversation on here before. And it's, it's almost like above and like, it's different than, than the queer experience,

[00:36:49] but this thing of like, on one hand we, we do, we, we often, we all have chosen to like podcast or for the two of you to go on national television because you want to play a game, but we all podcast because we assume like to some degree, like it is nice that people are like listening to us speak, you know? And so it is nice. Thank you. It is. Yeah. Thank you so much. Like, yeah. Every once in a while, people are going to be like, Oh, I love listening to that. And it was like, Oh, that is weird that you were like, I still like a full imposter syndrome

[00:37:19] to be like, you want it? You do want to hear my opinions about whatever random thing, you know? Um, and that is meaningful. And at the same time, there is a level of like both the super positive and the super negative that you kind of have to like figure out how to like live your life. Like we do this thing because yeah, we, we, you know, like it'd be impossible if nobody listened. Um, and, and there are times where I think like, especially this series is, um, this one bigger, like it's really important for people to hear like our respective and

[00:37:47] the perspective of all of the people that we choose to interview, including you. And at the same time, like we have to sort of figure out how to have like a healthy relationship with the fact that like people do listen to us, you know? And then in the world of like intense social media, anybody can have an opinion on anything, including us talking about like having opinions about a thing, you know? It is exactly really messy, real messy. And meta too. Yeah.

[00:38:13] Cause the difference is that even with podcasts, like even if it's a live podcast, we can say, Hey, Rob, can, can you edit? Like when you repost that, can you edit out this part? I mean, like I, I've, I've never done it, but it can, it could happen, right? Like we have the ability to do that. But yeah, no control over the edit that goes on CBS. Right. Right.

[00:38:37] And so for me, even applying, I, I was very open about being bi and going through casting. Um, and, and for those out there who have never heard me say this in any of my exit interviews, I did not talk about RJP at all during casting. Like it literally was something that was like found out after the fact, um, like I did everything. It was like, wait, what's our HAP?

[00:39:04] So like, because you were afraid, you were afraid or why not? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't want that to be a reason that they were like, Ooh, no. Yeah. But then they put it in the show and everything. Cause they loved it. Yeah. Yeah. It's just wild. Cause I said it one time. It's just a show. Sometimes you're afraid of something and it's the thing that people like about you. That's true. And there's no metaphors there. Right. Yeah. I said it once.

[00:39:31] And then after that, they were like, Oh, just say the podcast. And I was like, okay. So I was like, okay, they definitely not going to use that. They definitely did. Um, but going, knowing that like, okay, I was being open through casting. I still was in a place. Like I had dated girl. I had like gone on dates with women, but I had never had a girlfriend. And so it was still this place of like, I'm still trying to figure out what that looks like for me.

[00:39:59] Cause it's like, I felt like, not like a fraud, but it felt like, how can I go on here and try to be this representative, uh, you know, for the LGBTQ plus community when I'm still like dipping my toes. I'm still like feeling the, I'm, I'm still in the shallow end, like waving the water around. Like, is it, is it warm enough? I haven't adjusted. Um, but you're like the 33 years, you know? Yeah, exactly.

[00:40:28] Of life experience. Yeah. Exactly. Of being a bisexual person. Yeah. Feeling that. And now you're like, there's also so many men and women. I want to date who are in the deep end of the pool. I'd like to go there. I'd like to get the deep end looks real fun. Like, it looks amazing. I'm like, like I said, I've listened to every episode of this podcast and I'm like, that's just so amazing. Even listening to Deshawn last year. Like, I remember reaching out to him,

[00:40:57] just like, thank you so much for sharing your story. Like I could relate on every level. And it was just kind of like, I think you, if you're going to apply to Survivor, you don't need to be in a place where you feel like you are 100% know yourself. You're 100%, like in full form. Like I still felt like I was developing in so many ways, even at 32 years old at the time. But I remember even in a confessional, I was like,

[00:41:26] oh, so like you're very open about like, you know, you open up at a lot of things. Are you that way with your sexuality? And I was like, I'm still like trying to find the words. And they were like, we don't have to talk about it. I was like, oh, okay. And that was it. So I was like, oh, that, that feels amazing. Cause I, and I immediately felt the pressure to have the right words. And I'm like, I'm being recorded right now. Right. Like I, I don't want to say anything to like,

[00:41:55] we have enough people in the world that are in the closet. I don't want to say anything that makes people think like, I don't know, just being on that type of platform, you start to feel, cause I already felt like being a representative as a black woman. Right. And it's just like, okay, there, you can, you could probably go through and name, you know, the black woman that plays, Especially like, okay, new era. Right. And so I'm like, okay, if I'm going to speak on this, I need to make sure that I'm being thoughtful.

[00:42:25] And in that moment, I just kind of was like, Oh, I don't know. You know, it's like at that point, it was the beginning of the game. And I just like, they were like, you know, I talked about it. So I was like, okay, that felt like a huge relief off my shoulders. I was like, okay, even though this is something I'm still like trying to figure out how, how to casually come out to people. Do you need to, you know, like what, what is the, like, people don't have to say, Hey guys, I'm straight. You know, it's just like, right. It in the,

[00:42:54] in that I still was in a place where I'm just like, I don't know what needs to happen. What doesn't need to happen. What needs to be said doesn't need to be said. Um, so it was very like nice that I, I didn't have to worry about that at the time. Um, but even in the game, uh, Keyshawn and Tini were the only ones who knew. I told them like in casting, um, separately. Um, uh, and then we had like a really heartfelt moment with Keyshawn,

[00:43:24] like sharing his story, uh, with like me and Tini. And so for me, it was like, Oh, we're connected. Like you got three people, people from our community on this tribe. Like we're, we're good. And so it wasn't a situation where I was trying to use that for the game, but I think it adds context to why I felt like we had like more of an emotional bond. Totally. In the game. Totally. And so it, uh, that was like,

[00:43:53] that was something that I was just like, Oh, well, okay. Wow. Now when you look at the boot, now when you look at the 47 boot order, it's real home, it's really homophobic. So homophobic. I'm not great. It's real homophobic. Wow. Wow. And were you, and that was like, that was on camera. Are you all talking about that? I've so, I wish they had shown that. So when I, when I told Keyshawn and Tini separate, I think Keyshawn was for sure off camera. Um, it was just kind of like, we were like moving from one place to another in the camp.

[00:44:23] There were no cameras on us. And I was just like, Oh, Hey, by the way. And then I can't fully remember, uh, with Tini. Um, but I knew that they were the only two that knew. And so I was like, okay, I feel good with them. It felt like, okay, I can let my hair down with them. Um, yeah. But, but then, yeah, turns out Keyshawn had the same conversation, like emotional conversation with Genevieve. And so that just evil, uh, evened out the playing field, I guess.

[00:44:52] evil Freudian. Is that a Freudian? Yeah. Oh my gosh. Wow. Um, no, I, I, I really relate to the, um, to the, the, yeah, the pressure to like find the words and to be able, and to distill your identity or figure out your identity for the purposes of communicating it to a national audience. And it's a really, really intense experience. And, uh, Tini has written beautiful things about this as well. Um,

[00:45:22] and like, yeah, it's like, it's, it's kind of like, damn, there's no matter what you do, there's a cost and there's a benefit. Like, I feel like you and I kind of had opposite, uh, opposite strategies where I was like, okay, I'm going to like force this to be at every second. I'm going to wear rainbow underwear and like, you know, uh, put this, put this everywhere.

[00:45:45] And then there's like something really nice about not being able to have the option of being in the closet. You know what I mean? There's like, there's, you were saying before about, you know, being a bi privilege to like, not, not, you know, to date men, um, and not be perceived as queer. But then I think it's like a privilege and there's also a cost, right? Where it's like, not being yourself and like being in the closet is, is a tax and a toll. And like, you know, even though it's hard to be out and be open, it's also a blessing and a gift.

[00:46:15] And so it's like, it's just so wild and intense and, uh, there's no right or wrong. And there's just which hard, which gifts, which curses, you know, it's like, it's a lot. Exactly. Because I even like, I try, I mean, cause I'm only a year out right from playing. So I'm still in the thick of, uh, every other day, regretting things in a game. And so, um, how long does that last? Evie?

[00:46:44] Let us know when, yeah, I'll tell you, I'll tell you when it stops. Oh gosh. No, I'm just kidding. I actually rarely, I rarely, rarely think about what I did wrong. But if you want to know what I did wrong, I could tell you the exact, the exact list. I know it's, it, and it's wild to think. Cause I try not to think about it in that context. I try to just think about it like, okay, alliances or whatever. Um, but when I think about it in that context, I'm like, I wonder if I had like,

[00:47:13] just taken the time and like, share, share that with Genevieve. Cause we had such a barrier in the game of like, Genevieve wanted to work with Rome. I wanted to work with Saul and we couldn't get the four of us together because there was just beef. And so I'm like, if I had just taken that time to open up to Genevieve and just been like, Hey, this is who I am. I'm just sharing this with you. Um, just so you know more about who I am. I just,

[00:47:41] it makes me wonder because now we're in a place where we're a year out of the game. And like, Genevieve is one of the people I'm closest to on the cast. Um, like her and my girlfriend have a great relationship. Like we, and, and we talk often. And so it's kind of like, um, I mean, it took, it took us like not a full year to get there, but it's just like, it makes you, you just wonder like, okay,

[00:48:08] what if it could that have changed anything being more myself, not just specifically with Genevieve, but just if that had been my approach coming into the game, would that have changed anything? And it could have not, like it could have just not been, um, a factor, but you all, you, you want to think of everything. Like, you know, let me, the one thing I think like, and I don't know if this is how you feel, but part of me, what I'm hearing is, is like, you'd be like, Oh, if I had have done the same, if I had been more open about my sexuality, while also at the same time,

[00:48:37] like me wanting to be like, no, it's totally understandable that like people like the whole thing about, um, we have like Nashua coming out there. I always think about like, there are people who then like feel embarrassed that they're not out yet. And like, it's the time that it's right to come out to whoever, like I say this every year, like, uh, I think you beat me to the bingo card, which is like, unless I say it in the intro, which I probably, I will, um, which is like, you come out all the time, like constantly, like, like for me being,

[00:49:05] like you go to deliver a mail and it's like, you get, and they're like, you're great. And it's like, yeah, yeah. You know, so I'm like coming out in that moment, you know? And so, um, yeah, I did the idea of like, I just want to like reinforce mostly to the audience. Cause I don't know how you, you, but like, you're like, I regret not coming out. I don't, I'm putting words a little bit in your mouth, but like, you know, I want to people to understand, like, know and recognize, like it, it's because of like society sucks is why like, yeah. Yeah. Like if you weren't able to have that conversation with, um, Genevieve,

[00:49:34] it's like not because of anything you personally, it's like, you know, it's this whole structure that's built around everything. Yeah. And, and like, Oh, I was just, no, I was just going to say adding like survivors also, as someone who has not played survivor, but it definitely seems like a pressure cooker where like for all, you know, Genevieve might've still done the same thing. Yeah. Like it could have played out the exact same way. Yeah. It's hard to know, but maybe the next time if someone comments on your torch, nothing thing of like,

[00:50:03] you played so bad, you could, you should comment. You should comment. You're right. I should have come out. You're so right. You're right. I should have come out. Oh, right. There's going to be some moment. I see it with Genevieve. If someone comes out to Genevieve, we're like, that's the winning move. Literally. Now I see what happened. That will happen. Cause there's not that many queer people on season 15. You don't,

[00:50:32] we don't know. As far as we know now, but there's a devastating lack of intersection between pride has spoken guests and survivor 50 contestants. Not if they come out to Genevieve. Okay. That's right. That's right. Hopefully that's the path. Look, yes. And I mean, speaking of that, I'm so proud of Genevieve. I'm so excited to watch her on season 50. And so, yeah, like I don't say any of that to say like her actions would have been

[00:51:02] different by any means. But it's been, it's just, it's one of those things that I have like reflected on. Like, I'm very appreciative of like her and I's friendship now. And then it makes me wonder like, Hey, what is, what, what relation, what relationships or bonds did I prevent by not just being myself, which could have been, which could have been anything. Right. But you want to blame me. Like, what if I took shorts instead of pants?

[00:51:32] You know, you, you just think about all the what ifs. And so like, because I feel like reflecting on my survivor experience, the biggest thing I got out of it was being unapologetically myself. Um, because even coming out of it, it wasn't like I immediately was thinking like, Oh, maybe I should have like just come out to my whole tribe. It was like, no,

[00:52:01] I feel like now I've put myself on national television and now I feel like, um, and I like openly talked about it at Ponderosa and, um, John always had such great advice for me. Um, so, um, and I remember the moment TK found out, he's just like, wait, what? We've talked so much. You never told me. Wow. It's just like, we had, we bonded. Blacked out that John Lovett was on survivor. I was like, Oh my God. What?

[00:52:32] Like, wow, we should get him on the pride has spoken. No, we, I guess we did talk about that. But it's still, I was like, John, Oh my God. We should have like killing it for 47 representation. Yeah. Yeah. Um, okay. Wait, sorry, that's sorry to interrupt you. Yeah. It was something that like, okay, even though coming out of the game, it's like, dang, okay, it's over. But now I have Ponderosa, which is like a continuation of your experience. And it was like, Oh,

[00:53:01] feeling like I could fully be open with my sexuality. And like, it like no one cared. It was just like, they knew that was them learning one more thing about me was amazing. And it just was like, when I get back, I need to just like, who cares? Like it really is a who cares. And so I definitely can like give credit to me going through, like playing a game helped me come on the other side of it. Just like more, uh,

[00:53:31] unafraid to be my authentic self. Um, which is really cool. Like even like some of my best friends are like, they're like after like, you're still Asia, but you're just like a more confident Asia. I don't know what it is. And I'm like, okay, that's cool. Like that, like growth happened, you know? And it's, and so it makes me really appreciative of the experience when I start getting into the weeds of like, why this, why that? I'm like, you know what? I don't, I wouldn't be where I am today. Had I not gone through that experience?

[00:54:01] Um, which is something I can be very appreciative of. I feel like so many times there's like a thing of people come off and there's, we're like, there's a more of like, you know, I feel like, like Bryce's situation, like they've had tons of people been on this podcast who have talked about what like survivor, like the, the ways in which the structure of society, which then survivors of microcosm of society is like, was like hard. But so it's really interesting to hear you actually talk about survivor was like this thing that you got,

[00:54:31] like in terms of queerness, actually got something like a positive thing out of it. I think it's like really fascinating. And I, I really love hearing that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and I think like, I definitely feel that my experience was also extremely positive in that regard. And like, especially like, um, you know, I definitely think like, especially new era casts, like, I think everyone is coming in expecting there's going to be queer people. Like there's not going to be someone on there that is like overtly or even like one layer below overtly homophobic, like,

[00:55:01] like in general. And like, it's cool to be able to share yourself with a variety of different people from all walks of life. Like it really is special. Like I think of the moments of like talking about my queerness with like Tiffany or Nasir or like Danny McRae. And it's just like, that's special and cool to like, like be in a totally different environment and talking to people with totally different life experiences of you and having them accept you because they're nice people.

[00:55:29] And you're like, like have connected in this totally different way of playing this ridiculous game. And I think there's also something I was just thinking about. And when you were saying, Ijav, I think there's also something so freeing about losing survivor where you're like, all I wanted to do was not lose survivor. And then I did. And it's just like, okay, you know, it's like, it's like a near death experience. It's like you, you faced the thing that you were so worried about and, and that you, you know,

[00:55:57] you wanted this other thing so bad and you didn't get it. And you thought that would be the worst thing in the world. And yeah. Okay. Not to brag, but Matt and I don't know what you're talking about. No, that's right. Never lost forever. But you're still in chains, baby. Undefeated. That's right. You're the same grace I knew in 2020. Oh, no. No evolution at all. Right. Sad. Yeah, no, it's so true. And I think like, I mean, that's part of the like hidden experience too,

[00:56:26] specifically with Ponderosa is that like, we're not being televised. You're still in this environment with people that you're just meeting. And yeah, everyone's from different walks of life. And so it's kind of like, wow, this is a nice little testing ground for what, what I can share when it, you know, it can be socially acceptable, you know, or people going to like, like, ah, we're not gonna, you know, it's, I think things are always worse in your head. Right. And it's just,

[00:56:55] it was just so nice getting to just like open up and, and bond. So shout out to John and TK and Keyshawn and Anika and Tiana. Um, they're all, yeah, yeah. So they're, they're all so amazing. And, um, it just was like, wow, this is, and then John wrapped it up for us on like one of our last nights. He was like, none of us came in here wanting to lose survivor. Right. So he was like,

[00:57:25] but this became part of our experience. This Ponderosa experience was, it is part of our survivor experience. I'm like, you know what? You were so right. I have to say, I think universally the pre merge has like a beautiful Ponderosa experience. Yeah. And the post merge is crazy. A nightmare. Dark. I like, you're having to go to tribal. And just like, so much more. I feel like you reach a different, like,

[00:57:55] like the, the, the, yeah, the next level of the freedom thing happens to the pre merge people. And then everyone has a transformative experience from the suffering. Yeah. Yeah. It's still wild because even coming back, I, I would, I mean, obviously I'm dealing with losing, but I wasn't in a place where I'm just like, okay, now I just share with the world. Yeah. It was just still kind of like, okay, no, now I can, I can be on hinge. I can have my preferences as women.

[00:58:25] I thought you said unhinged for a second. I'm like, Oh my gosh, I can let loose. That's what I thought. I was like, Asia, Quebec. She, she feels pretty unhinged, right? We've all been talking about it. That actually, cause I was, I was just about to say, I mean, I think there's like the, I feel like the goal is not necessarily share everything with everyone. It's be true to yourself. Yeah. And it seems like inherent to your personality is some amount of, I'll share what I want to share. I'll post what I want to post on my Instagram.

[00:58:54] I don't need to be taking you in the bathroom with me all the time or like, whatever, you don't talk to your phone. And like, you got to stop posting your bathroom. TikToks. Do you know how many times I've taken an awesome hair photo while sitting on the toilet and I'm just filled with regret at my personal boundaries? Like this is the best lighting in the world. And I can't share it. You know what I mean? Like, and I, and I really do feel like, I just feel like that is like, like,

[00:59:24] you know, there's, there's not telling people things because you're afraid. And because you're like, you are just like afraid about the reaction. And then there's like not telling people things. Cause you're like, that's my business. And I don't need to like, even the thing with like TK, I was like, obviously you guys talked more than we saw on the show, but I'm like, when in that challenge were you supposed to be like, Hey, by the way, TK, I'm by look over there. Like I'm going to get the thing first. Also, I'm sure TK is lovely, but are any of you going to know it when, when you, when like you've come out to someone and then people get it. They're like, why do you tell me before? You're like,

[00:59:53] cause I was stressing about it. Like it's great. Yeah. Yeah. He's yeah. It's so funny. Cause like we had a full, I mean, even though like our tribals, like I went out day seven, the PlayStation, but me and TK had a full day of just like talking and getting to know each other and like learning about our backgrounds and stuff. And I think it was like,

[01:00:21] it wasn't until a couple of days later that like it came up and he was like, wait, why didn't you say anything? Yeah. But yeah, that's why I'm like, I wish the world could see, had gotten to see more TK. He is so amazing. He's like the kindest guy. He was in Houston a couple of weeks, weekends ago. And like me and my girlfriend went to dinner with him and he's just so sweet. Oh, love that. Oh, there's so much there, but I, and there's more on the experience. I mean,

[01:00:51] I think one of the things just to clarify, like you, it sounds like, I mean, well, going into watching this season, I'll say like, you didn't expect for there to be anything about your sexuality on the show because it sounds like we're talking about that in confessionals. Cause we often ask people about, and one thing we see often with queer women who are on the show. And I think of like, I mean, so many people like Kelly now bandy and being a great example of this.

[01:01:20] And we've had these different conversations on the pride of spoken where people share part of their lives, but it seems like a lot of the women share part of their lives. And then it just does not end up on the show, but your experience seems different than that. Just based on what you're sharing. Just to clarify, I want to clarify that. Right. Like I did know it wasn't going to be an edict. So it's like, they can't use anything you didn't talk about. But then I knew like, Oh, I didn't talk about it. Any of my preseason press. And it's not like it's casually coming up. Like, all right.

[01:01:49] So unless you're like, you're making it like not, unless you're defining yourself, like when you are explaining who you are, including it that, you know, no one has the line of questioning to kind of get there. And so going into survivor thinking like, Oh, this might be my coming out. You know, like if I had lasted a lot longer, like maybe I would have opened up and been more open to talking about it. But I think I was able to process like coming back. I knew I didn't have professionals talking about it,

[01:02:19] knowing like, okay, it didn't happen. Survivor is not going to be my coming out, but it doesn't change how like much more free I feel in just like navigating the world. Now knowing like, okay, I was able to like go and do that. Like, I never thought I could, like I grew up thinking survivor was way too hard. I've never camped. There was like plenty about survivor that I didn't think that I could do. Right. Yeah. You're a big,

[01:02:48] big brother person. I feel like going back, you mentioned applying and getting very far in casting. Yeah. Big brother 17, which very, very different than survivor. Less. Well, I was going to say less bugs, but I'm not sure if the big brother house has less bugs than survivor. Yeah. Lots of ants. Do you know how I know that it's not like the most common ones that you're out is because you're not on the survivor wiki, LGBTQ contest. Exactly. Not yet. Not yet. But assuming the day this drops, that shall be updated. Yeah. I know.

[01:03:17] And that's another thing is like, there were articles coming out and like, okay, LGBTQ plus contestants on survivor 47. And just knowing like, okay, yeah. Like John and Andy had their moment in the episode. And then teeny's, you know, very proud. And so it was just kind of like, I knew like, oh, well, you know, did you want to like post something at the time or anything like that? Like, did you feel, feel that? I was like not. Cause it,

[01:03:45] I never wanted it to be like, I'm, I'm coming out for attention. I think I, I have that relationship with social media that I'm very weary about posting stuff. And then it makes it look like I'm doing that for attention. Okay. But where are you, would that have been you doing it for attention? Would that have been you doing that? So you could be seen more authentically to people. Ooh, I'm just saying like, like people are thinking about whether you're doing it for attention.

[01:04:14] Who cares what they think? Just very true. Just a little, just a little, uh, sprinkle for you. You know, it really, what it was was I was like, I'll just do the pride of spoken. Yeah, that's right. That's right. That's right. That's right. No, it's just like, I just, it just makes me, it makes me sad to think that that would be like, yeah. It's like everybody. Yeah. Everybody has like, I don't know what it would be. There's, there's probably like some like research name for it, but all the things that you, you immediately then like, and maybe, maybe you don't regret it.

[01:04:43] I don't have any words in your mouth. But like, I always think about like, man, if I had been out as trans when I was in high school, like I could have gone to prom. And it's like, you're also not remembering how the things that like, what have, you know, like the way it would have been hard. You're the thing that you're talking about before, Evie of like the gifts and curses that you get, you know, you all have those things where you're like, Oh, if I hadn't been out at that time, when we come out, it also reminds me of this hilarious tick tock sound. That's something like people say I'm only being gay for attention,

[01:05:12] but where's my attention? Where is it? So anyway, if anyone out there wants to come out and wants attention or is afraid of being thought of that way, whatever the hell you want, just please tag us in the post so that we know to give you attention. We'll give you attention. Yeah. Yes. Hashtag the pride has spoken. Hashtag I could be a guest on the pride of smoking. Hashtag I could be a guest on the pride of smoking.

[01:05:41] On this national hashtag, I could be a guest on the pride of spoken day. But yeah, I don't know. Yeah. In the moment, I don't know. I just never, I was just kind of like, well, but I love that for them. Yeah. And it was kind of like, okay. I get that of not trying to like, also like step on someone else's experience or something. Right. Yeah. And it, and it was pre, it was before the season. I would say, I have grown a lot in the past like nine months because like,

[01:06:11] I could tell the story of my girlfriend. So when I, I was like, how do I work that in? Yeah. So when I went on survivor, I was single and it's so funny because I, I had even talked about that. I think that was in like my little 30 second. I'm like, Oh, you know, everybody's in relationships and like, I'm single or whatever. Even in our season, there were maybe four of us who were single.

[01:06:37] And so it was just like a very relationship heavy season. Um, and so I was like, I, you know, and I met someone at an event that was just like, thank you so much for speaking up for people that are single. Like, I really appreciate it. And I was like, Ooh, that's my girlfriend. Sorry. I'm no longer single. Um, but, um, yeah, I come back. I'm in this huge cloud of sadness and sorrow. Um,

[01:07:06] then I can't kind of come out of it. The jury comes back. I'm talking to them. Like, it's, you know, I take a trip to LA, me and Anika, we go visit John and like, we have, I'm having some good times, but I'm still in this place of just like, Oh, season doesn't start till September. I, you know, I would love some companionship. I'm not looking for anything serious, but let me just ease into the apps. Let me find some quote unquote companionship. Yeah. Let me just dip my toe. Like now I'm fine.

[01:07:35] Just like having my preferences open. Like, we'll just see. Right. And so I took like a work trip to Chicago and then I come back and I had a light, uh, on hinge, um, from a girl, um, who is now my girlfriend. And one of the very first conversations we had, this was like August. And so this is before the cast has been announced. And so, uh, but, but after I played, right. Yeah. So, uh,

[01:08:04] one of my prompts was don't match me. If you don't like reality TV, not trying to talk about survivor, but I'd love other reality TV as well. So we just not going to connect. You don't watch reality TV. And so she was like, what, um, what reality TV do you watch? And I was like, Oh, survivor, big brother. Sorry. Naming everything. Love is blind. Married at first sight, everything under the sun. And then she's like, Oh my gosh, I love survivor.

[01:08:33] I've been watching survivor since I was eight, but I stopped at 41. Cause I don't like the new era. Oh, daggers, daggers. Didn't know I was going to be a stray. And so Asia's, Asia's girlfriend. Yeah. That's so funny. He's actually not watch Asia season, not a fan of the new era. And not even Asia could save it. Oh my. Oh, I wasn't ready. I stopped watching survivor. Oh,

[01:09:03] okay. She wants over. Wow. Small world. And, you know, connection here. So I was like, well, that's crazy. So at this point I'm at a decision point. Like, I know I have a premier party coming on September 18th. And I'm just like, okay, if we keep conversing, like, I, maybe I could tell her, maybe not. I don't know. We'll see how this goes.

[01:09:33] So basically you're planning for your second coming out. Is what you're saying? Yeah, that's right. And so we just like text nonstop, like novels on novels on novels. And it's just like, we're hitting on all cylinders. We like have so much in common. Like, I'm just like, oh, I played French horn growing up. And she like sends a tattoo of a French horn. She has on her. No. Yeah. She literally has this huge French horn. Tattooed on her thigh. Are you kidding? No, both grew up.

[01:10:03] I was like, oh my gosh, I grew up playing basketball since I was six. And then she sent all these pictures of her growing up playing basketball. She played through college. So we just had all this stuff in common. Yeah. Yeah. Right. It's so much in common. And the fact that we were just like, we talked a very little bit about Survivor. Both love Sari. We were just like, oh yeah, we had like, we liked people, liked the same people. It's like, okay, we're on the right side of history with Survivor. Great. And then, um, except for Evie. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, we like all the same stuff. We hate all the same stuff.

[01:10:33] Oh. Oh no. We hate all the same Survivor's issues. That's fine. Sure. Okay. I love this feud that's, that's starting between Asia's girlfriend and Evie. Like, it's great. Yeah. I liked her when I met her. And I didn't know. So, so then I think it was, so the night before our first date, um, which was, I mean, women move fast.

[01:11:02] It was like a week later. So we've done a lot of just like, we've got really gotten to know each other. We've fallen in love. We've really gotten to know each other. Um, and so that was like a week after we had matched, but the night before, uh, she was nervous. And so I was like, Hey, let's just FaceTime. And so when we on, when we got on FaceTime, I was like, I sent her the trailer and then she's like, Oh my gosh. Like, I was like, yeah, this season's coming out soon. Uh, I was like, I was kind of nervous to tell you,

[01:11:31] we literally talked about it for maybe like an hour. And then, uh, she didn't want to be spoiled or anything. And so we were just talking about like what the experience was like. Uh, and then we continued to be on FaceTime for seven more hours. Oh, this is the most sapphic thing ever. Women, lovely women, beautiful. Oh my God. And so then, um, seven hours. I know. Then I like, that's eight hours total. Yeah. That is an entire work day. Yeah.

[01:12:02] Uh, yeah. So then I like napped, worked for the day. Then we went on our first date. And so when I like met her in person, I was like, okay, like this is everything that like, I imagined it to be. Um, and so then, yeah, then like, I would not have been able, I mean, I would have made it through the season, but having her support through the season was just like, and, and to not have to explain. Yeah.

[01:12:29] Like she remembers people that I don't even remember, like in early seasons. And it's just kind of like, we can nerd out about survivor, which is just really cool. Um, but even just to like, I think like it was, there was a point where she was just kind of like, she just still didn't want to be spoiled. She was, she really wanted to like, believe that I won. And then I think like I was, I was dealing with it leading up. She's like, okay, I have to know because I have to know how to support you.

[01:12:56] And so then she was just really supportive and just like helping anytime. She's like, you can, she always tells me you can never talk about survivor too much. And so any random time I'm like, okay, if I had just, she's just like, well, talk me through it. Um, and it's so incredible. Um, and so, I mean, we have way more outside of survivor. But to have survivor in this time in my life is like, so amazing. That's so sweet.

[01:13:23] And I just want to say any person out there that knows a survivor player saying to them, you can't talk about your driver too much is the most supportive, nicest thing you could ever say. And that's so beautiful and sweet. And I love that for you so much, especially while the season's happening. I mean, Oh my gosh. You have to, it's so unbelievably consuming. And that's a lot. Yeah, for the people around you. To just process and just like, and not have to be like, okay, so this is what a tribal council is.

[01:13:53] It's just like, you know, like, Oh, thank God. I've always wanted to ask, what is that? She just brings up things that I haven't thought about. And it's just like, it's, it's so nice. So like, it's so nice that like, we met exactly when we needed to. Cause I, and I think about it. I'm like, if pre survivor Asia had met her, I don't know if it would have been like, I don't know if what, I would have been able to just fall all in. Cause I still would have been like, probably like,

[01:14:21] I don't know if I'm doing this right. And like how to date. Or if I, you know, making up any excuse under the sun, not to just be like, let, let it happen. And so, yeah, I like literally every day. I'm like, I just couldn't find a more perfect person for me, which is just wild. And I feel like we met exactly when we did. And I always wonder, I'm like, if I had not gotten out pre jury, like say I made it through the jury, I probably wouldn't even gotten on hinge.

[01:14:52] I would have just been like, let's see how the survivor season plays out. I'm not trying to like, I'm so focused on that. Then it's like, we never would have met, but it's just kind of like, we just, it works so well. And so I'm just like, I, it's like that a tick tock trend. Like the one that says like, sometimes like you forget, like this is what it was all for. And it's not like I want on survivor to meet a mate. But not a bad, not a bad outcome.

[01:15:22] Right. Yeah. No, I know. Yeah. So it's like super cool that like, like my premiere party was the first time she met everybody. I'm like, Oh yeah. It's not like, we like made it official like a couple of days before. So I'm like, so I can introduce her as like my girlfriend. And like, she met everybody and it was like, this is the bandaid. Wow. And you know what? It's like, I'm so happy for you. Thank you. So happy for you. Yeah. And you are like, Asia,

[01:15:51] you are like glowing. You are radiant. You are just like, and that's the thing that like feels so amazing and hopefully freeing for you. But I feel like secondhand people pick up and feel that we're like people. And this is the, by the way, wild time for you to meet your girlfriend when everyone's on social media, like dropping their like red A's, like dropping their orange hearts, like, Asia, we love you. Oh my gosh. Like you're trending every day. Like it's wild time.

[01:16:20] But I feel like that's, I don't know. Oh my God. It's just so amazing. Cause like everyone, you already know this, but like people, you don't even know, love you so much. Like there's so many people who would like take multiple bullets. For you. Right. And so it's like, I just think it's amazing to also see you like this free and all of it. And I know that people will resonate and connect with that. So just like, so happy that we're even here talking about all of this right now.

[01:16:51] And I feel like I, sometimes I'm jealous of people who are more restrained and like not saying every bit of their personal life on a podcast. I'm like, wow, that's so cool that they can do that. Yeah. What is that like? But I really appreciate you coming on because I think, I think that like, I have, I think it's been so fun over the last year. Like I remember the night of the 46 finale. There was like podcasters were being like, so we're going to jump on a zoom at the end. And I was like, okay, all right. And then I, okay, this is my embarrassing moment, Asia,

[01:17:19] that John Lovett appeared before you. And I was like, Oh my God, I'm like Googling John Lovett. And then didn't realize that everybody else was actually freaking out about you being on Survivor. And then, and then realized you were on Survivor and went back. It was like, Oh my God, you're Asia's on Survivor. And people were just so proud of you, but that's not just because you were like, like an R.J.P. class of podcast. It's because of specifically you as a person are like this incredible, like kind, smart, like amazing person that like, we're excited that like, you're the person we got,

[01:17:48] we got to root for, you know, on the show. And so I love that people like even me in this conversation, like getting to learn more about, about you. I think this is, I think you're going to get a lot of attention and love after this, when this episode airs. So, yeah. Thank you. And just to say, there are so many beautiful bisexual people in this world. Like, it's just, I'm so glad that we have you on here and to talk to that specific experience, because I think you brought up so many things that like a lot of people don't know about, about that experience.

[01:18:17] And you know, the, the, all the stupid questions people might ask you and things like this. And I'm just like, just like, just, you know, I'd say my personal view is like a lot of most people are kind of gay. And that means there's like a lot of bisexuals out there. Yeah, exactly. It just really is. And I just think a lot of people are, are attracted to multiple genders of people. And I just really, really, really, because it's such a beautiful community. Yeah. I mean,

[01:18:47] some of my best friends are bisexuals. That's a little. Yeah. And it's like, you know, but it is also true. And I'm making a joke of people saying that, but it is also true. Yeah. I'm so sorry. Asia, it's like, I know that you, like, I feel like part of what I'm like is like, you're talking about like come out all the time, but also like you've known since COVID, whatever. So I was, what I, like, I feel like I don't know how to frame this question basically, but it's like, I feel like, are you doing anything for pride month? And is this kind of like the first,

[01:19:18] like talking about like coming back and feeling really like, you know, sure of yourself and wanting to be, you are. Right. Is that, will this be your first pride month? Like, yeah. With that, like sort of mentality, I guess. Absolutely. Yeah. Because I've like, you know, there are people that like, we mentioned it earlier that the, you know, some people will post during pride month, like, Oh, this is my coming out. Um, and I've debated it for years. Like, Oh, should I make a post? Should I just say something? You know? Um, and, and,

[01:19:47] and I always was just hesitant and I'm like, okay, this is, then this doesn't feel like the right moment. Um, but then like, you know, you know, falling in love changes things. And I was just like, you know what? Like I've literally thinking like wanting to be a guest on the pride of spoken was without a doubt, like what I wanted to do. So that for one, it was like on my mind. Um, and then, yeah,

[01:20:14] me and my girlfriend and my brother are going to pride night, uh, at the Dallas wings game. Oh, that's so fun. So excited for that. Um, so yeah, so that's, that's in June, obviously. Um, so, um, so very excited about that because the Dallas wings, um, I mean, I just, I'm so into the WNBA. I've been for years and, um, so excited about the attention that women's sports are getting.

[01:20:42] So very excited about that. And yeah. And, and I'm wondering what that looks like too. Cause my girlfriend is also bisexual. And so we are, we're just like, what does pride look like in terms of like, does that look like going to the pride parade in Houston? Does that mean going to pride events? So we're kind of just like on the lookout for like what we want to go to. There are going to be plenty of events going on across Houston. And there's like, there's like, there's a, um, a women, uh,

[01:21:12] owned bar. Um, that's like next to like the lesbian bar in Houston that plays all women's sports. So we've been meaning to go there and check it out. Um, that's so fun. So yeah, all of, all of us like TBD, but for sure, pride night, WNBA game. Can't wait. Um, but, um, yeah, it's just been, it just, it's just, I was trying to think of what, um, Oh, Evie,

[01:21:41] you mentioned, uh, just like what you were saying something a second ago that made me think of even people on my cast, um, just being so open and being such themselves, like teeny. He's such an inspiration. And just like the article, um, articles being written and just being on, uh, unauthentically himself, even during the season when he's still figuring things out is just like, like if he can be that way at 24,

[01:22:11] I'm like at 33, like, Oh, what do I say? Uh, it's, it's kind of like, it's so, it's so cool just to see how everyone is on their own journey and how different people can inspire different people for, you know, whatever reason. Um, so it's really cool just to be surrounded by people like that on my, on my season and just like, you know, Andy and John and then like Keyshawn, it's really, it's just really cool that, you know,

[01:22:40] you can meet people that are so different from you, but it's like all of us can like relate to each other in one way or another and inspire each other in one way or another, um, which is just really cool. So, and just to say, I feel like the, the ripples go just like all so around and like something I remember very distinctly when my season was coming out, there was a lot, you know, pretty much every intro podcast at some point people in the comments would be like, wait, what pronouns have you used? Blah, blah, blah, blah.

[01:23:08] And I really remember you Asia being a podcaster in one of those that I was obviously not supposed to be listening to podcasts about myself. You've not, I highly discouraged that behavior. Um, but, uh, and I really remember you being like, at the time I was using day and she, and you're like, Evie uses day and she, and I was just like, wow, thanks podcaster Asia. Thank you so much for explaining that you want my pronouns. And now here we are on the pride is spoken and you've played survivor. And now you're on my podcast.

[01:23:37] And the world is crazy. That is insane. And it's, I was actually just getting, I was just tearing up, uh, even just like, as you're talking about teeny and like his journey and just everything else. And it's like, I think it's just so beautiful that, I mean, Evie, you have had your own jet. Like there's everyone's, we're on our own journeys in so many different ways,

[01:24:02] but I think it's just beautiful that this survivor community and everything that revolves around the pride is spoken and the people on it could be this great, um, just like place where we grow. Like, isn't that wild people like, Oh, that show's still on. And it's like, yeah. And it's helping me through my gender journey. Yeah. Like, what are you doing? Literally, literally. And queer people love survivor and queer people love survivor. Yes. And queer people are so good at playing survivor. And it's just, yeah, that's,

[01:24:32] that's, it's part of it. I mean, I think there's something people and people, and we talk about this every season on the practice book. And like, why is that? Why is this show so resonant with queer people? Why are, queer people so drawn to play survivor? And it's just like, it's an ultimate social thing. And yeah, people are just like inherently social and hyper attuned to their social surroundings. I think hyper attuned to their social, hyper tracking social situation sometimes. And like,

[01:25:00] and it's also like been this show that has been this amazing platform for so many people and for people to see themselves reflected in so many ways. And the first ever fricking winner was a gay man. And that just like, will always be in the DNA of the show. And so it's just, yeah. Yeah. Uh, one thing we, yeah, you go ahead, Matt. Yeah. No, you're just such, you're such a winner in so many ways. Like,

[01:25:25] I feel like this is just something that I feel like I've realized maybe a lot of us have being closer to, I mean, Evie, I guess your journey is different with connecting with folks after your season and the like, but like, there's so many different ways to win and you won in your own amazing ways. Right. So just want to shout that out. Yeah. Grace. I mean, yeah, I, I, that's what I do try to constantly remind myself. Yeah. Like,

[01:25:54] I feel like I'm very rich and just love. I forgot about that. Yeah. Jason doesn't let me forget it on our podcast. Yeah. Um, so, uh, yeah, I just, I, I'm very like, I'm like, I'm so surrounded by love. I don't think, I feel like everything happens like it should. And, you know, even thinking about like, some people can think of survivor is silly. Like it's a game, right?

[01:26:24] Like you just, you're just voting each other out. You're on a random Island. Right. Um, but to the people that play it, it means the world at the time. And so it's kind of like, I feel very like rich and being able to like have a partner who gets the, the gravity of it and not like, Oh, when I'm like watching the, like the first, like the first individual immunity really triggered me because I wanted to make it there.

[01:26:53] Yeah. And so I just like, just started bawling. And she was just like, just there. And just like, so, so there and present for me. And like, new, like, I know what you're feeling is so deep. And it's just not like, Oh, come on. At least you got to play. You know, some people in instinctively want to say that you had to be on it, but it's just like, you really deal with like the aftermath of playing that game,

[01:27:23] no matter how many days you lasted. So true. I'm so happy for you, Asia. I'm so happy for you that you have that and you deserve that so much. And everybody out there deserves a partner like that. And that's just, I'm so, so happy for you. That's so beautiful. Thank you. So appreciate you coming on. One thing we typically do. And the thing I wanted to say earlier, when you were like, you, you were like, Oh, and I was on the Island. I wasn't sure that I, you know, was going to say the exact right thing. And I,

[01:27:53] my first instinct of that was like, as soon as somebody is being like, I don't know if I'm like going to say the right thing. I'm like, Oh, there's such the person that will probably say the right thing because they're thinking about the fact that they're not sure. The right thing. It's like basically the first thing that would like pass the test for me. One of the things we do on the show is, is give like sort of, the word, get handed over to you to say anything you would want to other LGBTQ fans, people who might want to apply to the show in the future, anything you would want to like sort of say to those, um,

[01:28:21] to our lovely LGBTQ survivor fan listeners. Yeah. I mean, if you were like me a year ago, like, and before just closeted, but listening to the pride of spoken, relating to different guests, relating to Evie, Matt and Grace, and just thinking like, Oh, that's just, that's amazing. Right? Like just, Oh, I like, I want, I want the, the confidence and the, the, the, the, I don't know, just the,

[01:28:51] the freeness that they feel. Um, then just know that as long as you have someone in your life that is, that, you know, loves you. Like it, and the, the question always is, is it unconditional? It's unconditional. Like, you know, the people in your life that have unconditional love for you. Um, like I have best friends that I came out to that are just like,

[01:29:14] like cried because they were questioning what they had done to make me feel like I couldn't tell them sooner. And so it was just like, of course I knew that they would be still so loving towards me and still so like accepting of me. It's just like, just know that the people in your life that love you unconditionally will be there after you have discovered that side of yourself. No matter what that means to you, no matter what that looks like for you,

[01:29:42] just know that like being on the other side of it, being open, even if it's just to yourself, even if you being out of the closet is you accepting that about yourself, that's a step in the right direction. And that already is one step further than you were the day before. Um, and if you're thinking about applying to survivor, do it. I don't like as much as like, as much as it eats me up, like, you know, still to the, you know, and I'm,

[01:30:11] I'm waiting for the day that I'm just like, Oh, I didn't think about survivor this week. Um, it will come. It will a thousand percent come. Yeah. As much as that is like looming. I just, I wouldn't be the age I am today without having going, gone through that experience and just, soaking up everything that I could and, and really doing the self-reflection after the fact and just like what it meant to me. And just you,

[01:30:38] like I embraced the therapist. they provide. Like it was amazing, um, all the way through the finale. Um, and so I, I, I would say like as much as like, especially right now with like dialogue around survivor 50, I just think like, if you want to play apply, I think it's as simple as that. The more you overthink it, the more you're going to delay the process when you really could just put

[01:31:07] yourself out there and discover something about yourself, whether that is your sexuality or whether that is just something about yourself to just make you a better you, um, then do it. You probably spend true love. Probably. All right. This was so lovely. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for listening. My name is grace leader.

[01:31:36] You can find me on social media at high from grace or echo from grace. And I'm Evie Gota. You can find me on Instagram at Evie Jag and on Tik TOK with the account name Evie from survivor. And I'm Matt Scott. You could find me at Matt Scott GW and all platforms. And this is the pride has spoken. This is the pride has spoken.

[01:32:07] That was pretty good. Yeah.