Purple Pants Podcast | Survivor 50: What Worked?

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[00:01:23] It's the Purple Pants. Hello, hello, and welcome back to the Purple Pants Podcast, Survivor News. I serve as your humble and oh-so-gracious host, Bryce Isaiah, and I thank you so much for tuning in to this week's bonus Survivor News. If you could be so kind to ensure you are subscribed to the Purple Pants Podcast, we are available on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you listen to podcasts,

[00:01:51] the Purple Pants Podcast, awaits for you to subscribe. And as always with your Survivor News, you can watch this audio podcast on video. Head over to the Bryce Isaiah YouTube channel, click subscribe, give this video a thumbs up, and let us know in the comments what you think about this bonus episode. The baby boys are back, and we are giving you some more off-season

[00:02:16] Survivor News contact. Join Jack, myself, and Wendeezy as we figure out where Wendeezy was these past couple of weeks. We get his take on the ending of Survivor 50, and we also talk about what worked this season. The twist, the cast. We also talk about what didn't work. What would we like to see different in the open era? This and so much more. So let's get in to your Survivor News.

[00:02:54] Survivor News. Survivor News. Survivor News. Survivor News. Survivor News. Survivor News. And we are back. We saying back, but it's not a new season yet, but your baby boys, Destiny's Child 3LW,

[00:03:22] has decided to arrive and come back and give you some more Survivor 50 content. The baby boys is back, baby. Beyonce is back. Okay, now, let's welcome back to the podcast. You might know from The Floor is Lava, The Circle Season 2, Mr. Jackery Atkins was popping with you.

[00:03:49] Let's go, man. I'm excited to be here. You know, we did our other post-season 50 episode, and I felt like people enjoyed it. I was like, let's keep the momentum going and just keep there's so much to unpack and talk about with this milestone season. So I'm just glad to be back and, you know, get Beyonce back in the building. Well, let's talk about Beyonce, Jack, because...

[00:04:17] Because we all know the real Beyonce. Okay. But let's talk about that, Jack, because... I'm going to hold your feet to the fire, Jack. Oh, boy. People were asking, where's Wendeezy? Where's Wendeezy? I was seeing rumors that he was here, there, wherever. The bitch was home. Okay? So let's clear that up. Two, we started this season...

[00:04:48] Okay? The posse, if y'all remember, we started this season, and who was putting belt to ass? Jack. Okay? Jack was laying down the hammer behind the scenes, and when DZ came to the podcast four times late, popped up, popping, and Wendell, what did Jack say to you on that last episode after we hung up? Jack said, don't even come.

[00:05:16] So there's the answer. Jack put Wendell on spring break. Vice, whatever you say. My fault, Wendell. Wendeezy, am I lying? He's... He put me on spring break. So, Bryce, let me ask you this, then. Because there was a few times we were about to start recording. Wendell pops it, you know, he was on his phone, looking a little crusty,

[00:05:45] but he said, oh, he popped up. Hey, guys, I can't wait to... Last night's episode was crazy. Can you believe Rick Devins flipped that coin? And then you just, boop, X'd him out of the video. Is that not true? Yeah, because I know how you felt, Jack. You were heated behind the scenes. I mean, look, you can say whatever you want to say about me, but you're the one who... I was like, oh, hey, Wendell, I can't wait to hear what you think. You know, trying to play it cool, even though I was pissed. Okay?

[00:06:16] I mean, you were the one kicking him out, though, so don't put it all on me. I'm not putting it all on you, but I respect you, Jackery, okay? And I knew how you felt, but listen. Sure. I'm getting jumped right now. This is crazy. Yeah, Bryce, hold back. I've been hibernating in my house for a whole month, and y'all want to say, y'all just want to jump me right now. I thought I was doing a good job for a couple episodes. You know what?

[00:06:45] And you were, and this is why, now that you're back from spring break, I think we're not trying to jump you. We're trying to say, hey, maybe we were wrong. You know, maybe we did miss you while you were on spring break a little bit, and it's good to have you back. I'm just confused because in the episodes that you weren't there, people were in the comments saying, this is the most Windows Talk all season.

[00:07:13] But since he is off of punishment from Jack, let's welcome back to the podcast. You might know him from Ghost Island. You might know him from Beach Cabana Royale. You might know him from Extreme Home Makeover. You might know him from The Goat. You might know him from Hotline. You might know him currently streaming on Hulu right now.

[00:07:43] Designed Glass. Hashtag. Okay. But more importantly, you know, I was about to say Ninja. Ninja. More importantly, you know him from the first merch booth and Winners at War when DZ was popping with you.

[00:08:13] Well, thank you for the gracious intro. I want to tell you guys that I'm here to do better. I'm going to podcast better. During the offseason, I'm going to give you all I got. And during Survivor 51, I'm going to give you all I got. So, I apologize for dropping the ball. We back. Let's get it. Can I have a clean slate? That's all I ask.

[00:08:43] Well, what did you eat? That all depends on what you ate. I don't know if your water is going to be cleaner. Um, what? I think it's a clean slate. What? So, listen, a lot has happened. 50. Aubrey won. Yeah,

[00:09:13] Wendell, when was the last time we podcasted with you? Was it? Devins? Was it Devins? It might have been. So, yeah, tell us about, you know, while you were on spring break, when did you have the opportunity to finish watching the season and, and break down your, your thoughts on the end game? Yeah, I started, I watched within the last week, I caught up on everything. And, uh, I was so proud and impressed with Tiffany.

[00:09:43] And like, I'm like, our girl is in it. Our girl is locked in. And then they basically, they jumped her. They're like, everybody's doing everything to get her out. I'm like, man, it was hard to watch, but I'm so freaking proud of Tiffany winning those immunities, standing up, just doing it on her own. While other people are collaborating and sharing info and sharing, uh, the, the, the lettering,

[00:10:12] all of that stuff. I'm, I was so proud of Tiffany. So I'm going to start there. That's our girl. We love Tiffany. And we were rooting for her all season. That's our real life girl. That's our friend. Um, but I will also say, no. And I will also say very proud of Aubrey, um, played a great game back against the wall. A lot. Didn't have the, the most locked in allies at times. Um, and she found a way, she found a way to stay in the game, stay in the game, stay in the game.

[00:10:41] And the name of these games is make it to the next day. You don't know what's going to open up. And in her case, and you make it to the next day, you make the next day. Maybe you'll win an immunity. I remember on winners at war, Michelle, I'm just like, please just make it to a next day. I'm on the edge of extension. Y'all know I'm the merge boot, right? But I'm seeing her battling each day. Just please girl, make the next day. Then all of a sudden you win an immunity. Then your game changes. In Aubrey's case, that's what happened. Like she stayed in it. Then when she needed to,

[00:11:11] when the three fellows were ready to get her out of there by any means, she won some motion, got to the end and did what she had to do. So, um, go ahead. Were you here for Ozzy? Did we talk about Ozzy? No, I, I, I was not here for the Ozzy. I was not here for the Sari. Oh, I was not here for Devin's. Yeah. So I, I saw, I crammed all that stuff when I, when I just did my, my watch, bro.

[00:11:39] So Ozzy went out with this, with the split, with the split on the same Island and Jonathan running back and forth. I'll tell you what I liked watching. I liked the, the, the mechanic of having these two tribes. And I liked Jonathan running back and forth. I thought as much as I was rooting for other people, I'm rooting for Ozzy. I'm rooting for Tiff. Um, I liked watching Jonathan do this. And I've said it all season.

[00:12:08] I've liked Jonathan's game all season long. And we can get into talking about his sentiment. Cause he really wanted to win. He vocalized all that after the fact. Um, but I liked watching him go. And our boy Ozzy, this is our friend. He handed his whole game to Aubrey. And she did what she was supposed to do. Cause she was on the outs in, in,

[00:12:37] in these games, you find whatever you can. And if someone hands you something that can be their demise. And that was Ozzy's demise. And he was playing such a great game. I thought in more reflection, I think it's so interesting of like how Ozzy went out and then like Jonathan, right? Where Ozzy goes out by essentially trying to like pat the jury, like, Hey, my friend, my friend.

[00:13:07] And like, in Jonathan's case, wow. Like, you know, and so it's kind of interesting to see like where, when people are like Aubrey ones, like, yeah. And like looking at the mechanics of it, uh, it almost is like poetry. I'd also, it kind of is. It kind of is. Ozzy went out trying to manage the jury.

[00:13:37] His forte is not jury management. And Jonathan lost because he couldn't do great jury management. He was just trying to eliminate his threats. Um, I will say though, I think there was an era when a Jonathan's game would have got the job done. Oh yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. Like, I mean, just like Stephanie said, it was, you know, kind of the quintessential old school game among other things that she said.

[00:14:07] I mean, dare I say season one through 40, the way he was cracking those coconuts open. Stephanie wanted to be a coconut or maybe Bryce did. I don't know. I don't know. Did you, um, did you watch the live finale? Yeah. Yeah. What did you think of?

[00:14:36] What did you think of the probes slip up? I thought he managed it. Well, I thought the way he came back and called it a twist or whatever. I'm like, all right, like, I think it sucks. And I think if you're Rizzo, especially, I think for this to happen to anyone, if it happens to a Rizzo, it's like, dag, that is the super duper, duper, duper fan. That's probably crying on the inside right now. Um, but Rizzo looked like he took it well and probes kind of kept things moving. Fine. Uh, it was a slip up. It's live TV.

[00:15:06] Those things happen. Um, I hope in the moment people weren't like, Oh, probes is losing his, whatever. I don't know how people received it at the moment, but, um, yeah, it sucks, but they kept the show. I think it's one of those things where kind of sucked in the moment and being on the West coast, I heard that this had happened before I saw watching it. Like the first thing I saw about it was my mom texted me. Oops, Jeff. I was like, and then I started hearing from a bunch of other friends,

[00:15:36] like, Oh my God, he, and I was like, wow. Um, but I think it's one of those things like kind of sucks in the moment. Although, you know, the Rizzo versus Jonathan matchup, we could kind of anticipate where that was going. Uh, and I think looking back, it's going to be one of those things that will sort of live in survivor lore as kind of a funny moment. So, you know, if you rewatch it, it's, it's one of those things where you might be like, Oh, here's when, here's when this happens, you know, Rizzo is going to play 10 more times.

[00:16:03] He's going to get his win and they're going to look back on this and laugh. Yeah. Yeah. And I, I even think there was a lot of behind the scenes footage. Uh, and I think there was a clip. Someone even played where Rizzo was like, I'm glad I don't have to cry on TV now where it kind of almost saved him. I didn't think the pain from the shingles rash would affect simple everyday tasks like bathing, getting dressed, or even walking around. I was wrong.

[00:16:32] Though not everyone at risk will develop it. 99% of people over the age of 50 already have the virus that causes shingles and it could reactivate at any time. I developed it and the blistering rash lasted for weeks. Don't learn the hard way. Like I did. Talk to your doctor or pharmacist today. Sponsored by GSK. There was apparently a lot of drama between the cast, uh, going on, which was interesting.

[00:17:01] We didn't really get a live reunion. Jeff just asked like two questions. Yeah. Wendell. I'm curious too. Actually, we, we, Bryce and I did an episode breaking down all of the finale tea. And you were obviously on the last returning season before this. And I think what lent like lends itself to a lot of the conflict that went down

[00:17:27] is those past relationships is the heightened emotions involved with, you know, what it was presumed to be a iconic season, much like winners at war. What were the vibe? And you got, or I guess you guys didn't have a live finale cause it was COVID, but when the, your season was wrapping up, like, was there a lot of drama going on? Like, how did that feel with that 40 cast compared to, you know, your original ghost Island? That's a great question. And it's the same. I think there might be more drama now and we're,

[00:17:57] you know, a month out. So there's, we're in the heat of the moment right now, but I'll tell you this as a one-time player going into season 40 with my scope only being one awesome season that I won. So it's like, I left ghost Island was a tight cast. We all left as friends, the majority of us. And it was so recent. I was, I was riding this high. I'm so excited. I thought winners at war was going to be the same thing. You go in there, you make a bunch of friends, win, lose, or draw.

[00:18:26] It's all good on returning seasons, especially with players that have played a few times, have lost a couple of times, et cetera. It's a different game. They're going out there for business. They ain't trying to make friends. And you got $2 million on the line, just like winners at war. They, they are out there for that money. They don't need friends. They don't want friends. And that was kind of my mistake on winners at war thinking that, you know, we could play hard and leave with a bunch of friends.

[00:18:55] I didn't leave winners at war with a bunch of friends. I left with maybe like five or six friends, you know? Now, granted. It's a good amount of friends. I mean, I'm out there though. I mean, Bryce played with Tony and Bryce doesn't even have Tony's phone number. So, so there's, what were you like that first day on the beach? Oh, that first day I was locked in, bro. No, I wasn't Rizzo. Don't do that. No, I was locked. I was locked. And that,

[00:19:24] that is crazy. You were Rizzo on season 40. Here he goes. Here he goes. Hey Boston Rob. I was locked. I was locked. I had my, I had, my peep. I was locked. You know what? Fine. I was Rizzo. Okay. Is that, is that Jeremy Collins? Bro, chill.

[00:19:52] I was a big fan of yours. That's not how I did it. I was playing against Jeremy. So, I guess, before we dive into the, sort of the rest of the episode, Wendell, just catching up on, you know, your viewing of the rest of the season, where, like I said, I think with the last we talked was with the Devons coin flip. Did you feel like the rest of the season,

[00:20:22] like, exceeded your expectations, met your expectations, or maybe didn't quite hit the mark for you? I think it met my expectations. I think this was a really good season. I think we've got a really good winner. I think we've got some really good controversy. I think we've got some really good, like, like Tiffany, like our, our lost, our fallen goddesses, you know, like, I think it was a really great season. I remember, yeah, I, I'm happy with the way it went.

[00:20:53] I'm happy with the drama, even that's better for the show. And Aubrey got her win. She got two M's. Congratulations, queen. Like you played a lot. And for you to kind of, you know, I feel like her story has a nice button at the end. Now. What do you say to the people that were like, she won because of her relationships, because this was her fifth,

[00:21:20] fourth time playing as opposed to her actual game in this era. I'd say that that could have given her a little nudge. And that's who you're playing against. I played against Ethan and poverty and Rob and all these players who we knew we can't put them anywhere near the end. For that very reason, we didn't have a plan going into winners at war saying, we're going to take out all the rush more,

[00:21:47] but any good player knows there are players. You don't want to sit next, sit to next to at the end. And Rizzo, Jonathan, Joe, we're trying their best to get her out. They just kept her a little too long. Like, yeah, yeah. You're battling, you're battling history. And it's going to, it might sway some people. I don't even know if they feel like they kept her too long. Cause I feel like at that time,

[00:22:16] Jonathan felt like he could beat her. A little bit. I mean, we know they would have wanted her gone at four ideally, but when you get that hurt a four, then it's a little out of your control. Yeah. They, and they wanted, they wanted to get her out. I mean, they knew that they thought Tiffany first, and then they were like, all right, we got to get her out at fire. Um, and she wants emotion. And Jonathan played a strong game and he had a lot of allies over there. Not enough, but he did play a very strong game. He did take a lot of big swings and big shots.

[00:22:45] He had a case. And. She had a lot of allies and she sent them to the jury and, and talked it through best. Yeah. It's an interesting thing. Cause I appreciate you saying that. I think it could give a nudge. Cause I think that it does, but at the same time, especially when you know the cast before you even go out. I mean, these players all had the opportunity to be like, okay, here's some of these connections that Aubrey might have. Um, but it's, it is an interesting balance within the game.

[00:23:15] And I'm, this is not even, this is speaking more generally than whether like, like Aubrey versus Jonathan situation, but just. You're like, how do you, it's like, like if I was in an end game position with an Aubrey, you're sort of looking at like, how do I balance like her gameplay within the vacuum of the season? But then I'm factoring in, you know, her connections with like Sri and Aussie and a Rick Devins and a Christian. And, but you're sitting there kind of at the end game, all those people are on the jury.

[00:23:45] It's like, how, how are they going to view, how are they going to balance her game this season versus maybe their connection? And obviously if you know somebody, but you are going to be a little more inclined to vote for them. And that's a factor that you can weigh in, in, in whether you want to go far with Aubrey. But I think it's a, it's an extra level to the game that it's like, how do those things really balance out? Was one of Jonathan's arguments at the moment, I'm battling someone's history. Or was that something that came after the fact when people started like

[00:24:13] really thinking about this more after that, because one, I mean, and it would take the right player to sit there and be like, I am bad on this, this ghost of the past, you know? I don't see Jonathan arguing that, but a way to get ahead of that is for him to actually acknowledge that to all those jurors. But I also feel like the more we talk about it again, to me, it's almost more of an, uh,

[00:24:43] a old to Aubrey, because it's like, when we talk about her relationships with all these people, that's really a hindrance, right? When you're out there, it really like, it kind of weighs you down. That's a reason to get you out. Right. Well, yes and no. I think. So, right. I'm just saying like, I don't think it just tips one way where it's like, Oh, she got to the end and she has all these relationships. Like I look at it as like going out, like it's like a surreal act. Right. It's like a,

[00:25:12] how do you keep the, the scale even where it's not hurting you and it's not against you. And so like thinking of it in that way, it's like that puts a little more, a lot more respect on her game. It's true. I mean, there's a component of, look, I think going out there, you'd want to be in the position where you have a lot of, like a good amount of connections, I think is ideal. But I guess even to what Wendell said with winners at war, the most connected players had targets on their back.

[00:25:40] Cause they had more history. So I think that's, I mean, that's a great tie in race. Although, but, and I also think it's like, Hey, if you know a lot of people and you're naturally gonna have to vote pretty much all of them out, that creates a juggling act of like, how do I send you all that? I have like a pass with out the door without, them feeling like bitter about it. But that brings a good question up though. Right. Because I feel like we're at season 50 and it's like this new era,

[00:26:10] right. Against the old school. What? Cause when I remember season 40, I felt like it was old school. I felt like we were watching an old school game. What era was that? Like, did we consider the thirties that still was. I mean, back then it's like, I don't think that eras, they weren't as well defined. It was a new school though. Right. It was cool, but not new era.

[00:26:40] I would say it is like, yeah, but still, still a new version of playing the game where I feel like in season 40, it felt like the old school way dominated where in season 50, I do. I would just. Well, maybe in the beginning, maybe in the beginning and my, maybe you're right. But I felt like in the beginning, it was.

[00:27:08] Maybe I'm not remembering winners. Therefore that. Well, at the beginning, all the old school players were eliminated. Yeah. But that in my mind is very old school. Wait a minute. Because the old school players were in the minority Alliance and you guys stuck to the majority and picked them off. Thank you, Jack. I think.

[00:27:38] Wait a minute. That play, Jack. Good job. Yeah. You made it work. Um, well, it's tough with winners at war. Cause I do think there was a lot of like old school values. I mean, you have so many winners from the old eras that were bringing that news for that old school flavor, but at the same time you got like fire tokens in the edge of extinction and all these like new school twists that people had to navigate. Um, I didn't feel like winners at war was particularly like, felt super old school, but I mean,

[00:28:06] obviously you had sort of the old school versus new school dynamic, which honestly we didn't see as much in 50 as I thought people may be expected. What did you, what do you think? How do you feel like 50 was played? Do you feel like 50 was more new? Yeah. Well, I think you had like the cloth sort of embodying the old school style, but within that you had new era players like Jonathan and like Joe. So it wasn't necessarily like a,

[00:28:36] like an old school versus new era, um, alliance. Like if you were new era, you stuck together. If you were old era, like, like I feel like it wasn't winners at war, but this, I did think maybe embody those, those old school values versus the new school values, maybe more than 40 did. Yeah. And I'm not talking about like the new era sticking together. I'm just talking about like the pace and how the game shakes out. Well, I definitely still thought this was like new,

[00:29:06] very new era in that sense, partly just because of all the twists that were getting thrown out. Right. Like when you have episodes where two people are going home and there's a twist every other episode, it's like, it's just by, even if everyone wants to play kind of old school by nature, it's going to end up feeling like faster paced and a little bit chaotic, which I think is kind of associated with the new era. Did we like that? Do we like that? Do we feel like that worked? Good segue.

[00:29:36] So yeah, I think this is, I like that. This is what we're starting with because, you know, like just to preface, like we wanted this episode, we wanted to talk about what worked and what didn't in season 50. And to me, I didn't think that that worked very well. And it's partly, it's a product of look, they wanted 24 players on this cast and they're still doing the 26 day, thing.

[00:30:06] And if those are concrete pieces in your puzzle, and then you have CBS saying, Hey, this has to be, you know, 13 episodes that does create limitations on how can you execute the season? Like there's going to have to be episodes where two, two people go home, three people go home. But I feel like when that happens and there's all these different twists involved, it's so hard to like, actually like you're constantly adjusting to these, these twists.

[00:30:35] So I guess what people say about it a lot is like, it leads almost to safer gameplay. Cause how do you go and facilitate like a move and start like rallying the troops for a blind side when, Oh, I've got my numbers. And now we're getting split into three groups and I don't have my people. And now everybody knows that I've been throwing out Wendell's name. And like, now I'm stuck on a job with Wendell and his friends. Like I'm screwed. Um, and I also think that like, because the game's just moving so fast, you don't have that,

[00:31:04] that breathing room in between votes where like things can really shake up. You know what I mean? And plans can be hatched because you're voting people out every single day. And I think the solution to that in part would be, I think at the top of the season, we were expecting a lot more of those like double boots where, Hey, two tribes are going to travel council. Wait. And I think like the first, I don't know, four episodes, you know, minus the Kyle medevac, it was like one boot.

[00:31:32] So now all of a sudden we had like nine episodes left and we had like 20 people. And so all of like the culling of the numbers happens like at the merge basically. But I find the merge votes to typically be a lot more interesting than like, you know, the first couple of boots. Um, so I, I think it would have worked a lot better if the first few tribals, it was just two tribes going to travel council. So that later in the season, you could have just had of more of those like singular vote outs that could have had room to breathe and be a little bit more,

[00:32:02] more iconic than like, Oh, Hey, we're getting rid of three people or two people tonight. Just back to back. And it's the final, it's the final seven. And we're getting rid of two people back to back. Do you feel like, or do y'all feel like the 26 days were here? I think it could have been longer. I mean, I think, and I think that that's what Jack's saying because you have so many players in such a short amount of time, you know, it, unless the mechanic was like Jack said, you get rid of a couple people,

[00:32:32] a few episodes in a row, really. So now it's like, all right, now let's play some, now let's play some real game as opposed to a couple here, a couple there, a couple at the end. Yeah. So 26 days. I mean, that's the, that's what we have to deal with. They're not, they're not going back to 40 days. Yeah. And even if they were, I wouldn't want them to for 50 because of the new era was 26 days. It's like, I,

[00:32:59] a part of me wanted to see some of these Goliaths maneuver in this microwave. Now I agree with you, Jack. Like, I think they could have slowed it down in the beginning and then sped it up a little bit, but like, yes. But like for me, the 26 days, I, I like to see these Goliaths in this vacuum seal. Yeah. It's tough to talk too much about the difference between that. Cause it just seems like 26 days is the new normal.

[00:33:28] But I do think that for a couple of other reasons that I think are a little bit less obvious, I wish it was longer first being you just get, if it's 39 days, you get 50% more content. And so you're getting these down days at camp where interesting conversations and like just fun scenes are happening that literally never have the chance to even occur. Now that if they make the edit,

[00:33:54] you're working with 50% more material episodes that much better. And then the other component, and this was sort of detailed to me by like a friend of mine who worked kind of on the show is even with the challenges and stuff, you got these friends, you got to think about the production side of things where they're working on a 26 day timeline. They don't have as much time to like build out these challenges, for example.

[00:34:23] And so even in terms of the challenges we're seeing a lot of times, that's why we get kind of the same sort of challenges where it's a puzzle we've seen before, or maybe they're like standing on a balance beam because those are like the easiest things to build and to like set up. And because they can reuse them. And in the old seasons, they'd be building a lot of new challenges because they had like two days in between every immunity challenge. And now it's every day. They don't even have the chance to do that anymore. So I think there's,

[00:34:53] and I think there's a happy middle where it doesn't necessarily have to be 39 days. And I doubt they're going to switch off 26 days, but I wish it could be like 32, maybe, you know what I mean? But they don't just have two days before the challenges. They have a whole year and a half. What do you mean? Like in the old seasons? No, I'm saying right now, like you're. Oh, to build them out.

[00:35:23] Are you eating plastic again, Bryce? First of all, if you're eating plastic, get it out of your mouth. It's a cough drop. Your cough drop. Okay. Second of all, they don't have a year and a half to build these things out. They film back to back. And. One, two, three, four,

[00:35:53] five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10. They know it's coming. What does the 10 have to do with that? Like 10 months? Season 47, season 48. Hey, are we ever going to get this? Start building now for season 53, 54. Got it. I'm not. I don't hate that.

[00:36:23] But obviously, and now this could happen. Like they all, the building kind of has to happen on the Island and they're only in Fiji for so long, but look, maybe you hire a couple extra people that start building challenges for the next season while the season's going on. I'll build. Get, get Wendell and Wendell and Wendy. And then Bryce, you and I can pull up and that's all you need. Yeah. All right. That's real. That's real. Okay. I stand down. Dude.

[00:36:52] So we talked about sort of the 26 and the pace. And I also mentioned, I guess the nature of these like constant twists and that tied into, I think why the 26 didn't work. But I'm curious if you guys thought all of these twists, like the blood moon. And then some were good and some were bad. I think we could say like the blood moon. And then there was like the duos twist. And then you have like the Jonathan going back and forth between the beaches. Like, and that was almost every episode, you know, Mr. Beast coin episode.

[00:37:22] Like that's the, almost every episode. Is that something that you guys felt like worked or you would have just liked it to be a little bit more straightforward? I can go first. If you don't want to go first, I, I, I say green light to all of these weird little collabos, you know, like bring us into the new era, bring us into a collaborative era. Yes. I say, yes. Green light.

[00:37:49] Maybe Zach Brown could have been a lot shorter, 10 minutes off of that, but I I'm here for the collaborations. I'm here for them figuring out ways to expand the brand because at the same time, we're watching survivor grow and reach the youth. We're watching another show that was great for the last two decades. It's the challenge fall off the planet. Cause all of their fan base is a bunch of boomers. So you got,

[00:38:15] you got one show that hits the reset button and actively finds ways to open up the market or open up the fan base. You have another show that seems like they're sticking to an equation and we're watching them shrink. So I, I'm a fan of growth. I'm a fan of figuring it out. I'm a fan of trying it. And if it works great, if it doesn't work, scrap things. And that to me, that's what survivors continue to do. Agreed. Good analogy with the challenge. My, I liked,

[00:38:46] I liked the cons. I liked it. However, I do feel like I did want for 50, a slower pace, like not so much all the time. Right. Because I almost wanted it. Like I wanted new era and I feel like the 26 days speeds it up, but I also wanted it like back to basics a little bit where it's like, allow the cloth to breathe. Right. A lot like,

[00:39:15] so, but I do like interwining in some of the new things. And so it's like, yeah, the episode was at Brown. I'm good. Right. But like, I feel like we could have split them up. You could have had the blood moon. We could have had the Mr. Beast point flip, like everything else, but Zach Brown, I loved. And so it's like, you don't got to throw it in our face. Give us time to, you know, just. Yeah. Well,

[00:39:45] I think with, so, I mean, we definitely want to get into the celebrity collaborations, but I think even just with the pace of the twist, my biggest issue with it is that. When you kind of know there's a new twist, if you're a player and you know, there's like a new twist coming every day. How do you really even start to like make a plan for the next. Tribal because you, it's like, all right, we might get split up into groups that I can't even anticipate. So I'm not going to be out here like throwing names out or making plans.

[00:40:14] Cause I might end up with a group of random people. You know what I mean? So. But I like that encourages, that just encourages safe gameplay. Exactly. You know what? If I, if I cannot predict anything and I know that I might be with these four, those four, this four, that four tomorrow, I'm only going to play it safe. I'm a play a neutral. I'm a stay right here. I'm going to act cool with everybody. I'm not going to make any waves. Like, I didn't feel like there was a, there probably was, but I'm not like when I'm looking back, nothing comes to mind of a,

[00:40:44] a vote out where a plan was like really hatching. And like a plan was in the works from the start of the episode or even before until the very end, it would sort of be like the episode starts. You have a little fun scene. Then we see them go and get this, what, you know, whatever the episodes twist is, the challenge happens. And then it's like, Oh, Christian's vulnerable. I guess it's Christian or like, Oh, well now that we split into two groups,

[00:41:14] like, I guess we got to go for Ozzy. And just, or, or like, Oh, we're doing do. And I actually liked the duo. So it was like, Oh, we're doing duos now. Like, well, I guess now that the way that this is shaped up, Chrissy and coach are the option, but there wasn't even anything like top of the episode where you could really be like, like the episode Christian goes home. There's not a lot up top where that plan is like starting to form. You know,

[00:41:42] it all kind of comes out as a response to the twist. And so the gameplay is like reactive. It's not proactive, but see, I almost, I'm almost a fan of this style given the cast and the relationships, right? Where it's like, you never really know who's going to go with who, because they're so intertwined. Now, if this was a regular season or half and half, I wouldn't like it so much, but I kind of feel like they almost the mechanics of it.

[00:42:12] Or on their toes, right? Where it's like, you never really know. And I feel like they wanted to test the relationships. I don't think it played out as well, but I think like that was the point of it. So it kind of kept me excited a little bit. Yeah. And what I will say, and Bryce, I feel like you said something about this, like a lot, like early in the new era is like, I mean, this is like what the game is now. So if you're a player out there, you can't be like, Oh, this isn't fair. Like I didn't expect this. Cause now you like have to expect,

[00:42:41] I guess the unexpected, which was like, yeah. That's part of the reason some people, some people like the old, by some people I'm saying myself, like when I'm like, I want the big tribe. Like, I love the fact that we actually got to have a big tribe, two big tribes. Like we missed that in the old era, but I liked the fact that like, they kind of brought us the old era, but they was like, we're going to shake it up.

[00:43:11] Like, and so it kind of forces the two to meet. Can I say something that I liked? Yeah. Yes. That I didn't think I initially liked. I thought the cast was great. Like, I think, again, when we was doing our stuff before, I'm like, who the hell? Who is this? Mike White. Like, no,

[00:43:40] again, I was. You're never getting on White Lotus, Bryce. I was. The White Lotus thing really had a chokehold on me, but listen. Oh my God. Because listen. Bryce literally put his mouth. I like the fact that that was a narrative, right? Like, like as much as I'm, when I rewatched our episodes, it had a chokehold on me, right? Like it had me being like,

[00:44:09] what's happening? Like, and I think it added a little, little flavor to the season. And so like, I think they did an excellent job with casting. Although I was like unsure at first, I think as the, the season shook out, like everybody did their part. I agree. And people, uh, that people were questioning delivered. And yeah, it was, I mean, this is a celebratory season and you got to,

[00:44:40] at the beginning, of course, there are people that you want to see on, but like, man, you put this great cast out there. You're going to get the coach moments. You know, you're going to get the joke making his alliance and trying to stick all the way. You're going to get Ozzy doing his thing. Sari, like she, I've, I've compared her game to like LeBron James's game right now. In that, in that the game comes so slow to her.

[00:45:10] Now it's so easy. Like she can just sit back and just run the plays. Like LeBron has played now 20 plus seasons and it's the game. The game is in slow motion to him. And in her case, she's just so great at it, you know, and we've seen her so many seasons. And now it's just like fine wine watching her game. You know, you got the right players and I think they delivered.

[00:45:41] Yeah. I, there definitely was a lot of, I think pushback when the cast got announced. And look, I mean, I think there was a few kind of glaring misses, not necessarily of people that they did cast, but more so people that they did not cast. Like, yeah, I'm still like, how do we not get a Jesse Lopez? You know what I mean? Like stuff like that. Like Isaiah. Of course, of course. But I think, you know, the, the, like Jesse coming from the new era, one of the,

[00:46:11] like the new era standouts, um, among others, among a Bryce Isaiah, one of the, a Carolina standouts way back. Are the, one of the originators, one of the, we know second chances to was coming in. Bryce is going to be on that. So I'm not, I'm not too worried. Um, but look, the people that I was the most hesitant about, I thought for the most part, like, you know, I was a little worried, like Colby and Ozzie, like given their last seasons,

[00:46:41] were they a little bit past their prime? And I thought they both brought it this season. Even Jonathan for as crazy as his story was, he came to play. Like, you know, like he came to play, um, in the, even the fact that he is polarizing is like, that's television, you know, like, um, right. Most part, you know, there's one or two, I think we could all say like, kind of wish they weren't in there, but here's the thing. Here's the thing. Here's the thing.

[00:47:11] Choke my chicken. If you want, I'm okay. No, thank you. Is that, wait, no, no, that's not the phrase. Don't say that and be like, oh, wait, is that the phrase? No. My mistake. No. Choke my chicken if you want. I think he's, Jack,

[00:47:40] I think he's used this phrase before. Okay. Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. There's literally never the contact. No, it's like choke on the hill. This is a hill. I choke on the hill. You die on the hill. Oh, I mean, maybe you died. Maybe you died on the hill because you were choking on something. What? You've been in Fairmount Park two months. Bitch. Listen,

[00:48:10] choke my, choke the chicken if you want. But this is the hill I'll die on. But this is the hill I'm choking on. Oh, no. I want to see Joe back. I want to see Joe back. Joe 3.0? Joe, listen, when he's. 3. Joe? 3. Joe? You weren't there. His exit. Jack, tell window about Joe's exit. Wait, which one?

[00:48:40] I don't know if I watched. Joe was like. Well, I liked at final tribal. Oh, that's it. He said. Someone asked me. They were like. Shut up, Wendell. Let's hear it. It was basically like. Saying at final tribal, like, did you ever think about something along the lines of like, you know, calling their game out or whatever. And Joe was like, look, when we got there, I almost told the jury, just don't even ask me any questions. He's like, I knew I wasn't going to win. Listen, he.

[00:49:10] He's aware. I'm trying to tell you. I love Joe. Oh, I love him. I. The only way I'd want to see him back is if something in his mind flipped where he's like, oh, wait, I can just lie. Like. But if he just comes back on the same kick, like. Yeah, we know what we're getting. His mentality is this. It's they know my game. So, yes,

[00:49:39] I'm going to do the exact opposite. But here's my thing. Y'all keep saying that though, but this man got to the end. It got no votes either. But listen. No, there's something. I'm not disagreeing. And like saying Joe's like a terrible player, but like, just because you get to the end twice doesn't mean I want you to come back again and get to the end of the third time and lose. Like, but I will say like, you know,

[00:50:10] I feel like he got a joke. I'm digging a lot of unnecessary flack. Like we can all accept. He's not a devious survivor player, but he's like a good dude. And I feel like, you know, shout survivor fact checker on Instagram, but they run like weekly popularity polls for the players. And every week, Joe's is like, not a fan. What's he really doing wrong though? Like, you know, you can say you're neutral on Joe. He's just a good man. Exactly. Nice, loyal,

[00:50:39] honest man. Yeah. He saved a few people from a burning building today. Not a fan. Oh man. Wait, so I do want to circle back to, you know, we talked about the twists and all that. And Wendell, you brought up the celebrity cameos, which I think is a discussion that is worth having both in regards to the twist that they brought to the table, but also just like the celebrity cameos as of, as a function in this season.

[00:51:09] And what we thought about those, because it sounds like you kind of like them. And like, I get what you're saying about like getting the promo, bringing new viewers in this season, like did seem like it performed well in terms of viewership. But I do, I personally do think that like all in all, I thought the celebrity cameos were like the worst part of the season. And I agree. I hear you. I hear you. And a lot of, a lot of people hang that on, on Zach Brown's time.

[00:51:39] Mr. Beast didn't have as much time as Zach did. And it made for that great Rick Devens moment. Right. And Aubrey's probably happy about it. But if you told me going into the season, that Mr. Beast was going to be the highlight of the celebrities, I'd be like, Oh boy. Cause well, so here's, there's the, Billy Eilish didn't do much. That's the thing. I thought Mr. Beast was the best of it. And I thought that the energy that he brought to the show,

[00:52:10] partly due to the fact that he didn't feel like he had to like overdo it. And he was down and just chill. I thought that was nice. And listening to him talk, he did a podcast with Rob C. And I thought his thoughts on like survivor and reality TV and like being a producer of television were like really interesting and like respectable. You know, like I, he has a passion and a respect for the show and the twist. Well, I think the twist could have worked out real bad.

[00:52:39] Fortunately worked out good. But then you look at, I mean, we had Zach Brown and I don't even put that much on Zach Brown himself, but more on the show choosing to just like highlight him so much unnecessary. And he didn't really do a whole, I don't even remember. Like, was there a twist involved with that? Like you got a free concert and he killed like, again, for me, I felt like that was more political, I should say,

[00:53:09] or like, you know, they wanted a certain type of audience. My only thing is, like you said, with Mr. Beats, get somebody that like that watch, like that actually enjoys the show. I don't care who they are. Right. Like it, it could be Angelina Jolie. It could be Randy Savage. Like, I'm just like somebody that. And you're, but you're saying you're agreeing. Mr. Beats is a guy that does enjoy the show. Yes. Like it has an understanding of,

[00:53:39] yeah, as opposed to Billy Eilish. Exactly. Yes. I don't know if you saw an interview she did. I think it was like Amy Poehler. I don't know if this was before you were on spring break or after. Do you see this? Oh, so she did a podcast with like Amy Poehler from like Parks and Rec. And she, Amy Poehler, you got to go watch this later. She was like, so you got like a idol on Survivor. Billy was like, like, yeah, I don't really know like what it is.

[00:54:09] Like, she's like, it's this like Billy Eilish, like idol, I guess. I don't, she's like, I don't, yeah, she's like, I like Survivor. And then Amy was like, how do you think you do on Survivor? And Billy was like, ah, I don't know if I'd be good with like all the math. And everyone was like, like, it was literally giving like, like the popular, like the popular girl in school was like asking you about like a hobby you have. And because it's not, because you think it's like not cool. You're like, oh,

[00:54:39] I don't know what that show is. Like, and so I, and that's, that was kind of the worst of it to me is like exactly what Bryce said, like have someone who's actually going to support and not just doing it for PR. And it does, that's the thing. It sounds like Billy is actually a fit. Like she references Survivor, like in her music sometimes, things like that. Um, but then when it comes to the show, she just like, doesn't talk about it at all. Um, and it's, it's just sort of,

[00:55:06] I think it hurts the prestige of Survivor to be like making these grabs for promo and then have the people that are doing it, like not even give a shit. It's like, it makes it look almost worse. And then not to mention my issue too. And this also with the Jimmy Fallon situation, less about Jimmy himself and more about that. Twist is just like the Mr. Beast twist worked out really well.

[00:55:33] I don't think structurally it could have had a lot of issues, right? Like if they have to draw a rock and Ceri's the one who flips the coin and Ceri goes home, that was a possibility that would have been awful. And then the Billie Eilish boomerang idol, maybe it's just because we didn't really see it like actually work out. But it's just like, even the fact that you couldn't play it for somebody else is like, it's just like, why are I, this is like, these idols are so much worse than they used to be.

[00:56:02] And then with the Jimmy Fallon twist with like Christian having to tell everybody that he like had to vote for himself. And like, that was a disaster. So even outside of the celebrity involvement, it's like, you're then attaching them to these twists that are just like also bad. So now the twist is bad. We're all like F you, Jimmy Fallon. Like, even though obviously wasn't really like Jimmy's fault, I don't think, you know, so.

[00:56:30] I don't mind when the twists are bad though. Right. Cause I feel like that's a part of survivor. Like, yeah, we hate it, but I feel like it's a part of like the survivor legacy that like some of the twists just suck. And it's like your favorite movie or yeah, a twist might hurt somebody that you're rooting for. But like, that's just how much, you know, you're invested in it. Like, I don't want it to be readable play by play. I guess that's a good attitude, but I,

[00:57:00] I don't agree, but like, I, I respect that. You're like, Hey, sometimes the twist is not going to twist in the way you want it to. And like, yeah, rollercoaster. Well, the original twist, I guess, or the biggest game changing twist was the introduction of the idol. Right. Correct. And they've been trying to, I guess, since then, because that changed the game and made for some really awesome gameplay and people finding it without clues and all that stuff.

[00:57:28] They've been searching for what will be this next idol. And they've been introducing all kinds of things. And a lot of it doesn't work. And some things work and something stick. I think it's, I think that's the nature of the game. And I think kudos to y'all for continuing to try to figure this thing out and could get like, yeah, like there were freaking fire tokens on my season. That didn't work. One season in grand opening, grand closing, you know? So, I like,

[00:57:57] I like that they're throwing things at the wall. And regarding the celebrities, you know, Bryce, you're right. Pick celebs that love the show. Angelina Jolie. Jimmy Fallon loves the show, or he's continued to talk about the show. Right. Maybe because of Scott. I mean, I had a friend that was at the live finale. I was sitting next to Adam Scott from severance. And Oh, like, yeah. But what about like, what about the survivor celebrities themselves?

[00:58:25] We got Taj from SWV. We have. Jimmy Johnson. Jimmy Johnson. I'm just saying like Mike white could have come back as himself. As for a twist. Um, I had something else. Oh, Oh, I just, the way I look at survivor and especially in America now,

[00:58:50] the way I look at survivors as a business and their moves are strictly to their, their business moves, who they cast, um, the length of the season and how they're adding and inputting. These celebrities or whatever. It's a business decision to make this show continue to go on. Absolutely. I mean, I'm trying to think, I mean, totally, but I think sometimes,

[00:59:21] look, I'm not, I'm not in charge of business at CBS for a reason, but I think there's certain things that they do. And I think a lot of times they miss it. Tribute. Certain. Like responses to things that they do. Like, for example, I think we talked about this during a certain episode with the new era. This came right after COVID when during COVID, they put old seasons, including one of the greatest seasons,

[00:59:51] Kageon on, on Netflix during COVID. And a lot of people and sort of created a survivor Renaissance, which trickled down to the new era, 41, 42, getting more viewership. And I think that the T I feel like the producers are like, the new era is working. More people are watching. It's like, no, they're watching because you put the best seasons on Netflix during COVID. And now people are just like,

[01:00:21] are watching because of that. And so, but then I think they take that and they, I feel like they like to really just pat themselves on the back to be like, what we're doing must be working. We're getting more views. So let's keep doing it. And not factoring in this other information of like, could it be better? You know what I mean? And like, I can respect them getting some celebrity cameos for the business reason of like getting more eyes. But at the same time, if your finished product suffers because of doing that,

[01:00:49] that could also hurt the business in the long run. So, I mean, I'm sure these are all conversations that they're having like, you know, at CBS, but it feels like it's a lot of stuff that's being spearheaded, spearheaded by Jeff and these other older execs that maybe are not fully in touch with like what the 20 something demographic or the 30 something

[01:01:17] demographic or different diverse demographics are necessarily like looking for from the show. And that's not, I'm not even trying to like critique too hard. I just think that there's maybe like looking through it, like looking at the show through a different lens than what others might be able to look at it. And that's why they're hanging their hat on Rizzo. He's, he's the, he is the key to the youth for them. And he's a great character for it.

[01:01:45] I'd hang my head on him too. But I also think that survivor fans, this is the best way that I could put it. Survivor fans, Wendell are like Philadelphia Eagles fans. And I think that sometimes the higher ups don't know how to handle that. And when I mean by that, you know, when Philly, when the Eagles is up,

[01:02:14] the city is up, but when the Eagles are down, we are, we are the most, like, we are the absolute worst, but our butts are in the stadium every year. And I think sometimes Jeff and the people, they receive the criticism, like how Eagles fans are like, what are you doing? And they take it like, Oh,

[01:02:43] not realizing like, it's like, listen, whatever it is, we're going to be here. But like, we are, we're Eagles fans. We're this passionate about it. And so I think that there's also like a disconnect there, similar to what you're saying, Jack, where it's like, I don't think they, they know the audience that well. Yeah. And you look back at like some of the most iconic seasons, like, you know, Kageon, David versus Goliath was even like a new school season.

[01:03:14] Heroes versus villains, Micronesia. Like these are all seasons where there's not anything like overly complicated going on. You know, there's not this bevy of twists. What? Um, I don't know. It's just, everything's become so twist heavy. It's like, you look at the best seasons. That's not like what makes them great, you know? And I think really a return to some level of simplicity where you have

[01:03:43] like a good theme and a good cast and just like one or two twists and let it rock. I feel like we all know that would work. Like it would be great. And for some reason they just like, don't want to do that. Um, and I know, I feel like we're talking about like what works and what doesn't. I feel like, but I also want to just say real quick though, Jack, I hate to cut you off. I've been real respectful this whole time. I also think the survivor fans,

[01:04:15] they need to have a black mother. Okay. Sometimes you'd be driving home. You see McDonald's and you'd be like, Ooh, can I have some McDonald's? And what does your mom say? We got McDonald's at home. We got McDonald's at home. And so I think Jack, so I also do think as much as like criticism as we have, I also think I want to put some criticism on the fan sometimes where it's like,

[01:04:42] sometimes we just need to shut up and watch and enjoy and be blessed that we have this for 50 seasons. I just also want to say that too. Right. And that's also me sometimes like, just shut up. Thanks. And I've sort of been doing that. I mean, we've been talking about like what works and what hasn't. For the most part, I've been saying. You've been talking. You've been doing what?

[01:05:14] We've been talking about what's worked and what hasn't. And for the most, for the most part, I've been saying a lot of the stuff on 50 didn't work. And like, I, which I feel bad, like I don't want to be overly critical, but, but I feel like I can relate to the fans who not, not that you should be like all over Twitter, like complaining about stuff, but you know, here I am on our survivor podcast, complaining about stuff. So I just think it comes from a place of like loving the show and like wanting it to,

[01:05:40] wanting it to continue to thrive and like seeing it, you know, 50 was solid, but I thought it could have been a lot better. And like, I, I just want the show to get back on track to what it used to be. And now, you know, times have changed and like things, things are changing. Like, I definitely agree with you, Bryce, that we should all appreciate, like still the product that they're putting out, but. Survivor be, be who you are. Yes. But I don't know. I just,

[01:06:10] I do think ultimately with 50, there was a lot of things that didn't quite hit the mark. And I'm hoping they can, you know, in the open era can do some things that we can be like, that's that, whatever that is, that's really working. Like keep that going. And then it can kind of refine. I think the, the old school, the older, I guess the new school, but not the new era. Magic.

[01:06:41] We think we're going to see some, I think it'll be a mix of new and returning seasons. That's what I think. Did you see the teaser for 51 one though? I don't, I don't think, I think I saw it and I didn't see it. I think I was like, okay. The main thing they highlight is that this next set of seasons is going to be the open era where anything that's like anything that's existed in survivor history is potentially like on the table.

[01:07:11] And I thought the trailer looked good, but I was a little confused about the open era thing. It's one of those things where I'm like, Hey, if they bring back some old twists and like sprinkle those in here and there, Allah, a ghost Island. I was like, we can, I could dig that. But if every episode was like, all right, fire tokens, hourglass that I'm like, I think I'd be okay. Mr. Beast is back. Like, I think I'd be okay on that. Okay. All right. I'm excited for the poly,

[01:07:40] the poly era, the polycule era. I'm excited to see what 50 holds. Guys. Thanks for welcoming me back. Sorry that I did not fulfill your expectations, but I plan on making a better run for 51. You're good. So much. You got other things cooking on spring break. So I don't have anything else cooking.

[01:08:10] I'm just ready to go. Take some time off and hit, hit the, hit the ground running for 51. Good thing. You got your vest on now. Okay. Wait, what are you doing? I'm out of here. I don't know about y'all. Oh, this might be a small vest. I can't put it on. I'll get y'all. I'll get you. You're ready to stuff.

[01:08:40] That's all. I got my vest on. I'm ready to go. I don't get the reference. Oh, I'll see y'all for 51. I'll catch y'all on the flip side. That vest didn't fit too well. Is that Jeremy calling? Sorry. Okay. That's the, that's, that's, that's, that's the energy. Well, listen, Wendy's that you are missed. Jack, you held it down. Glad to have the baby boys back. And we'll see y'all all soon.

[01:09:10] Peace. No, no more chicken choking jokes ever again. We're still rolling. Who comes to hell?

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[01:10:17] They also instantly alert you if your information shows up in a breach or on the dark web. But Aura goes beyond data protection. With one app, you get a VPN, antivirus, password manager, spam call protection, dark web monitoring, and even up to $5 million in identity theft insurance. All backed by 24 seven US based fraud support. Other companies might sell just credit monitoring or just a VPN. Aura gives you all of it, together, at the same price competitors charge for just one service.

[01:10:45] Start your free trial today at aura.com slash remove. Protect yourself now at aura.com slash remove.