Survivor Global: Survivor 50 Cast Reactions with Nick Iadanza and Eden Porter

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[00:00:38] Survivor. Survivors. 21 South African. 12 ordinary Australians. 4 miles. 1 million pounds. 1 million euros. 1 million euros. 1 million euros. Tribesburgers. Survivors. Survivors. The adventure of a life. The adventure of a life.

[00:01:07] Hello everyone and welcome to Survivor Global's coverage of Survivor 50. I'm your host Shannon Gus, skipping right past Survivor 49. Survivor 50 news this week as we found out the official cast. I think probably to get ahead of the spoilers that were already out there. Best laid. But we have it very, very early and we are going to talk about it here on Survivor Global. We have a couple of great guests to talk about it. First, this is a man who is fired up. He has a bee in his bonnet about a cast that dropped this week.

[00:01:36] It is a great Nick Iadanzo. Nick, thank you for being here. Thank you. And I'm here to vent all of my frustration that on House of Villains season 3, there are no real housewives. Like how did this happen? So I'm excited to talk today with you for the next hour about which housewives were snubbed. You know, how the franchise has basically been built off the back of real housewives labor. And now all of a sudden they've been, you know, misogyny writ large, basically. So I'm here to explain all of that.

[00:02:06] And I'm so glad that you guys are here to talk about it with me. Great. Did I do okay, by the way? Basically, out there now and now. This is the first part of this. Before the podcast, Nick's like, can you please introduce me saying I have a bee in my bonnet about a cast? And I'm like, firstly, you gave the podcast me six years ago. Let me introduce you how I did well, please. And you can take the true. But like at a point you've got to let like, you've got to let me fly.

[00:02:35] Like you're like a parent who's still like, and I believe me, I have two Jewish parents. So I understand that's the way that my parents pair. But like, I am 32 Nick. And I think I've got this. And then I was like, I would never say bee in my bonnet. And then I was like, can I change it? And then we went through that. And then I'm like, I'm just going to tell the audience. He was like, please don't ruin my joke. Anyway, now here. That was the first part of the podcast. Now you've ruined my joke. And that was my choice because it's my damn podcast. Anyway, second person to announce. He had some big news this week. And a cast, two casts have dropped, obviously.

[00:03:04] The 50 cast, House of Villains. And Eden had a child drop. Horrible way to do that. So Eden, thank you for being here. Eden, we are announcing on the podcast, had a baby last week. And yet he's still here. Look at the commitment. Eden, thank you for being here. And a big muzzle tov on behalf of everyone listening to the podcast. Thank you very much, Shannon. I'm on no sleep, no sleep at all. We're a kid and we're loving every minute of it, Shannon. So thank you very much for the well wishes. But yeah, it's very important.

[00:03:33] I had to jump in this. I told Rachel, I said, you look after the kids. Shannon and the Ahab community are calling. I'm there. I'm there. I am here to talk House of Villains season three. And are you divorced now? Is that because of me? She's currently standing outside just with her arms crossed, shaking her head at me right now. So you're in the bad books now, Shannon. But it's all right. We'll have a great chat now. Okay. It's not my fault. But look, two Australians of our greats with me. I did say we're going to ruin Nick's joke. We're going to announce Eden's baby.

[00:04:03] Then we're going to talk about Survivor 50. A lot of things getting ruined. Are they getting ruined as much as a Survivor 50 cast? And that is a question we will ask tonight. What is in a better state, the Survivor 50 cast or the state of Eden's marriage? And that is where that's what we're going to decide because we all had a lot of feelings. If anyone hasn't seen the cast, I will quickly run through it. That would be crazy not to have seen it, but I guess not everyone's just like, you know, trying to refresh social media all the time like me to see that the cast is again,

[00:04:32] the spoiler cast that we got several days ago. But I'll just run through it really quickly because I've got it here on the screen. Jenna Lewis from Borneo and All Stars. Colby Donaldson. Australian Outbook. Outbook. Listen to me. Okay, we're doing well. This is really hard. What Jeff did, by the way, just announcing all them. Colby, you know, all the seasons. Steph Lugrosa by herself in Palau. Sari needs no introduction. Ozzy needs no introduction. Coach needs no introduction. Aubrey, you know her.

[00:05:00] Chrissy came second to Ben. Maybe I will introduce her actually. Christian Hubecki needs no introduction. Angelina, Natalie, can I have your jacket? Mike freaking white. Rick Devins. Those are all the people pre new era. Post new era. Jonathan from 42. Then we go to 45. Emily D from 46. Tiffany Q and Charlie from 47. Genevieve from 48. Camilla, Joe and Kyle. You might remember them from last week on the show.

[00:05:30] And then two people from 49 were yet to be announced. And feelings were had about this. I know that Nick, you had a bee in your bonnet. You actually did about the season 50 cast. Talk to us. Talk to us about your macro feelings about this. Look, what I said on Twitter has been echoed by a million people. So it was not a hot take. It was the take that I think everyone has. That the promise of the premise of season 50 seemed to be that it was going to be a celebration.

[00:05:58] A fun celebration of the 50 years, for 50 seasons, 25 years of the show that we've all loved. And when you look at this on paper, that is absolutely not what we have here. There is going to be a bit, a lot of griping. And I'm definitely still griping about it. But we will eventually get to the other side and just kind of like enjoy what we've got. And there are some good, there is some really good stuff here.

[00:06:20] But I think it's ludicrous that 12, half the cast has come from the final 10 seasons of 50 seasons. That just is insane. And does that mean that there's going to be an old new era versus old era? If so, that is an insane theme when it's 40 seasons versus 10. So I think that's the main thing that people are griping about. And then you go a step deeper and the gripes are about what the hell is going on with three people from a season that has been universally panned.

[00:06:50] And then you go even that third level of who are the snubs. So I think it's like a three tiered frustration that people are having. And that's the frustration of my first gut reaction. And I think a lot of people have echoed that. Yeah, we just wanted to like jump on to give our takes on it because there are so many opinions out there. My opinion actually is like, I'm okay with a lot of modernity. We'll talk about how they maybe should have packaged that and maybe who the modern players should have been. But like, I'm okay with that on like what's been, for me, that's a hot take.

[00:07:20] But then I have my, that is a hot take. Yeah. And then it's going to maybe be like a bit of a really messed up compliment sandwich. Because like what I want to do is talk about kind of the uneven nature of the cast. Then I want to talk about possible snubs and missed opportunities, especially because so many people who were snubbed or were cut seem to have talked about it on social media. So it's all like very out in the open. And we really see like these returning seasons in like an era with like a lot of social media

[00:07:46] and when no one seems to care about like any possible NDA or possible future goodwill with the show. And then I want to be like, but wait, but beyond all those things, beyond the missed opportunity and how kind of weird the cast is, is it still a good cast? Like are the picks still good? We can go through some of the picks. So that's kind of how I'm seeing it. Eden, gut reaction. You had time somehow to think about this in the week that you've had a baby. And what have those thoughts been? I first of all, I like Nick's concept of the, it's like Dante's seven layers of frustration.

[00:08:14] Nick has his seven layers going all the way down deep into the middle. And I'm there with you, Nick. I do think the only way this particular season works is if it's an old survivor versus new survivor. I think it feels like to me it's some somewhere along the line, there was a pivot and they got the numbers and they go, you know what? We're just going to make this old versus new. Let's get a couple more of the new players in there to even it out because it does feel like something shifted about halfway through.

[00:08:40] Because if you remember back to when they first talked about it, there was a lot of new players originally. And then that sort of changed to there was only going to be three and then it's changed all the way back. And I'm not quite sure how we got here, but there was some big snubs in my, in my opinion, that I think is really going to hurt the season overall. Some great characters in here and some really interesting interactions between people that I'm sure we're going to talk about.

[00:09:05] But like the 48 and 49 to have five people from those two seasons, it's, and I agree 48. It's not a well-regarded season. And there is a huge recency bias with these people or everyone's talking about them right now. Oh yeah, this is really good. Let's get them in. There's a phone call. Hey, do you want to do this again? Yep. Let's do it locked in bang, bang, bang. And I just, I just feel like it's, yeah, it hurts.

[00:09:28] And when you look at some of the, the new era players that aren't there, like, man, how, how is, how is, I know we're all thinking about how is Caroline, like, how is she not there? How, how, how is she not there? It's just, it's, it, it really, it boggles the mind. And did you see she reposted that interview about Jeff saying about how he didn't like that they do all the casting and then other shows steal people and use them like the traitors.

[00:09:58] And it is a, it is a response to her being on the traitors at the end of the day. Oh, but okay. But what about Stephanie? Stephanie, what about Dee being on the fucking challenge? What, sorry. Yeah. I mean, so really, like, I think he said, so really gets a pass. But why does Steph LaGrosa get a pass? I didn't yet. Dee's on a lot of things. So it really shows that there is no rules and rhyme or reason to that. Um, yeah. I mean, I do think that Jeff badly misread 48. We know that to be true and the, how the fans would react to that.

[00:10:27] And he said, you know, recently last week or at the after show, we heard him say to Mitch, you're going to be a fan favorite. And I love Mitch, you know, no shade to Mitch, who seems like a lovely human, but is it a little concerning to them that they put two unknown 49ers on? Considering how they're not really reading the audience reaction to things particularly well. And I'm saying this about two people who are currently like blank slates, literally on the screen in front of me. But, you know, if it was going to be a new era versus an old era season, because it's clearly 12v12.

[00:10:56] And again, I'm more okay with that. My hot take is that it's not. My hot take is that this is not a 12v12 season. My hot take is this is an 8-8-8 season. Yeah. And I do not believe that we are going to see an old be new. Otherwise it would have been in the title. That's my, I'm planting my flag now. Okay. What about this then? I agree with you on that though. Because I think if it was going to be, if it was going to be 12v12, then you'll get all the newer people, like half of that tribe is from two different seasons.

[00:11:25] I mean, just on like delineating the tribes, that doesn't make sense to me. And I do think they'd want to go with three tribes. So I think if you stick with the three tribes, but what you could do, you could do 4-4-4. So every tribe has four new and four old, old era, like old school. And I, what, this is just a, this is just me head canoning here for a minute, but the way that they cast new era players, lots of big fans, lots of, I grew up watching the show. This is my dream to be on and stuff like that.

[00:11:54] Is there a world where all these, all these new era players get so caught up in, oh my God, I'm playing with Colby. Oh my God. This is, this is coach. This is Aussie. That it breaks down that whole concept and they all, uh, yeah, I'm going to be in alliance with, with Stephanie. Just Sari. Everyone wants to be with Sari and they all eat each other. All the new era players eat each other, get voted out. And we're left with this amazing boot order where ultimately everyone's wanting to, to help some of these old guys get. Did you watch game changes?

[00:12:24] Did you watch game changes? Is that what happened in game changes? But the thing is that you're thinking how they cast now to when they cast game changes, that, that period, all those news, all those new people, they, they weren't, they weren't huge fans. They weren't, they weren't talking about, oh my God, it's been my dream to get on the show since I was four years old and everything like that. I think people like your Charlies and your Chiffs and your Emily's and all these guys would get caught up in working with a Sari or a coach or something like that. I don't know. It's, this is me dreaming. This is me dreaming the dream, Nick.

[00:12:52] This is me trying to find the most of the line of you. I know, but that's what we did with game changes when we were faced with such a lost-hearted task. Yeah. The, the, the, the universe will make an equilibrium and all of our happiness will be, no, that's not what happened. So like, don't hold out hope Eden. I'm sorry. I don't mean to break the bubble, but Jesus. I mean, Nick, you were on that season, right? Like if that's the issue is that like most returnee cast, when you have like a depth of talent are going to have stars on it.

[00:13:22] The issue is if it's very, very disjointed or uneven, what's going to happen is they will gang up probably on the stars and the boot order will be terrible and will really be relying on the boot order because the season is so uneven. Now, two things to push back on if I'm going to be like Emily Flippen who is here in this class. I don't think there are enough of the new era type in the new era cast. Like maybe a Christian actually. Oh yeah. Like a Charlie, like Tiffany, Tiffany. I don't think so.

[00:13:50] Q no Genevieve's husband, Mark, who's wonderful. He's a big fan, but like Camilla, maybe a Camilla. Fair enough. But like not Emily, not Jonathan. Like, I don't know that there's enough there for them to have the reverence. And secondly, there's not enough people to have reverence for. I'm so sorry. Yeah. Every day of the week I will lose money for Sari. I've said it, but I don't see what else here. If you're going to lose the game for coach, actually you deserve to lose, you know, like that, like that one's on you.

[00:14:16] So I don't think that there's enough there, but if it was, if it's going to be new era versus old era in some permutation, and that's what they're trying to do by having it be an even cast. This was not the way to do it for me. If that was what it was going to be, then I would have had firstly better new era picks. And we can talk about the snubs. And then I would have gone back and made it all second chances. And I wouldn't have had winners. And then it would have been more even to the new era. Because what's so weird is it's new era. Not great. Some of the picks are questionable. We'll talk about it with two winners, maybe three.

[00:14:46] We don't know about 49. And then all the people from like the late thirties who are one-timers who kind of missed the opportunity because they haven't been returning seasons. And that kind of actually fits. And then six players who are all multi-multi-time players, at least, who are like the old schoolers. What I actually really loved is second chances, even though we voted on that and some of those picks aged badly, but the general timeline evenness, obviously it was like all one-time losers.

[00:15:15] And it was a lot of recent players, which you can talk about, but then it like actually really like naturally went back. We had like, we had like 27, 28, 29, 30. For sure. A lot of players. And then we had like 25, 19, 18, 15, 12, seven to the twos and the ones. That was actually really satisfyingly coherent from a timeline perspective. Yes. That is not what's happening. And even if it, even if it wasn't, at least the people at home got to choose that.

[00:15:40] Had the people at home been given this pool of 50 that Jeff had said, it was really hard to cut 26 people out of that brutal cuts. Given, given us that pool of 50, there is no way on earth that this is the, half these people would not be there. There is no way Tiffany would be there. Charlie would be there, you know, like, and unfortunately I don't think Chris would. Charlie, people love Charlie. I think Charlie would. People do love Charlie. Great.

[00:16:07] But like, face with the Jerry's and the, you know, anyway. Anyway, yeah. But does anyone have any insight? Like, Second Chance was beloved for that exact reason. Why have they never gone back to any sort of voting thing? Was it too complicated? Okay. Does anyone have any insight in that? Well, everyone's always said they can't do with the diversity initiative because then they might not meet the diversity initiative. However, this cast does not meet the diversity initiative.

[00:16:35] I want to talk about that for a quick moment because it, like, we don't know the 49ers. It might get close to meeting the diversity initiative, which is still a hell of a lot better than Australian Survivor, which is the lowest possible bar. Like the bar is in hell. However, the thing is that like the network promised this mandate and they should be sticking to it. And if they're going to walk it back, like let's have a conversation about it. I think like not actually reaching the map. It's not like we're going to get around 50%. They said 50%. And it's like the fact that they can break their promises, I think actually like opens up a can of worms that is uncomfortable.

[00:17:05] And then you also look at some of the snubs, like older players of color who have been snubbed and who the diversity initiative is somewhat in honor of. It's like those people didn't get those the opportunities they should have had because there were fewer opportunities. And now they've been denied it here to not even get to the level of the diversity initiative feels like a big miss for me. And then why can't we vote on it? We voted on, well, we did it, but you could have voted on a lot of other things and this wasn't it. And I want to talk about as well, the recency, because we mentioned that we need to talk about this.

[00:17:34] This was like almost worth doing the podcast alone on this for me, because I think the thing that everyone's saying is like, well, there's always a lot of recency bias. Look back at any returning season. It's hugely loaded onto the seasons right before it talking about 31. One of my favorite seasons had two from 30. Again, it was voted like two from 33 from 29, four from 28 and then two from 37, 11 plays in the prior four seasons. And then everyone's like, yes, but 50 is meant to be like a celebration. But that's not the point. The point is that 26 and 27 were both half all star seasons.

[00:18:03] 34, yes, had a lot from 32 and two from 33. 31 was an all star season. Before that, the last all star season was always three seasons ago. So of course it was always like a mass influx of like two or three seasons since the last returning season. Now we've had pretty much no returnees back from 35 other than winners of war, which is a very specific cast. We have so many great players who've just been missed the late 30s into the early 40s have just been completely glossed over.

[00:18:31] And, but we still have five from the last two seasons, one of which we haven't seen and one of which was not enjoyed. That's my issue, right? Like the recency bias used to be earned on like the timeline we were going. That is what's happening here. Thoughts? Yeah, no, you're 100% correct. You're 100% correct. I think that I've been trying to puzzle out like why it is that there are three people from a season that was so universally disliked.

[00:18:55] And I truly believe that it is like Jeff is an egomaniac, right? Like he, you see what he did when, when Australian survivor announced that we're going to do Australia versus the world. Nah, we're going to kill, kill that Australia versus us. We're going to kill that when Australian survivor goes on to Paramount Plus. We're going to kill that. Like it's us survivor. What I say goes and all this kind of stuff. That is his standpoint, right?

[00:19:23] And here we have people who are saying that they don't like this season and that they don't love the new era. So what is he going to do? He's not, if he was to have fewer of them on there, it's basically his tacit way of saying, you know what? You were right, but he's just going to barrel on through and prove, no, no, no. I will wear you all down and prove that we are doing the right thing. And we're going to have 12 of these people on this season. And we're going to have three. You didn't like the season? Great. I've been seeing the feedback. Bang. We're going to put three on them anywhere.

[00:19:52] He's like, it's like a conscious choice to refuse to listen while doing it under the kind of guise of saying it's in the hands of the fans. It's like when you work in a corporate environment and they say, yeah, this is all about like inclusion and everyone. We're going to kind of like talk about the initiatives that we're going to run. And it's all just smoke and mirrors because the decision has already been made underneath. So yeah, you can go and vote. We'll distract you by voting on the buff color. Go for it. We'll never release the answers.

[00:20:20] We'll never release the answers and we're going to choose whatever we want anyway. And then in the background, we're actually taking away your rights. Like it's this big smoke and mirror show. It's the magician. It's the magician. It's look over here. We're doing this over here. Yeah, exactly. I don't think as Australians, we should be saying that the Americans were voting in a rigged election. Like, I think that maybe we sit that one out, but it is to be fair though. Even if 48 was great, even if it was 40 great, it was 40. I don't think the three winners.

[00:20:49] Well, not three winners. Sorry. Three players, including the winner from last week should be on the season when to be fair, Jonathan is the only representation from 41 to 44. Jonathan is the fourth best casting decision on original Taku. He's the only representation from 41 to 44. RIP Kyle, who's one of two, maybe three winners with two of his closest allies to his two closest allies in a loyalty driven season. And he never had to betray either of them. And it was last week.

[00:21:19] Kyle is screwed. Eden. I don't know if you caught it because your baby was born on that day on a blessed finale day. But yeah, it's kind of a crazy week jump. What do you think about this? Yeah, I look at the end of the day, Jeff, he loves he's on record saying he loves 48. He absolutely loves it. He loves the winners. He loves people. So of course, he's going to push for a place from a season that he really loves.

[00:21:41] But ultimately, this just goes back to the point is you need more like returning seasons to create legacies to create like huge characters. You need that. You need that second go around for these people to elevate themselves to a level. And I think they just got to the point where 50 is meant to be this huge thing and they couldn't just do a normal all star season. It had to be this thing. And so the expectations got really high.

[00:22:09] But again, it comes back to make for 45 like everyone talks about 48 should have been the new era all stars. And honestly, it would have I cannot believe they didn't do it because it would have worked perfectly because you do a new era all stars. You have five or six people that really elevate themselves in that season that you go, wow, this is huge. You maybe get a big star that gets knocked off early and you give them a second chance or something like that.

[00:22:32] And then you roll into a 50 and it shows it shows you that you need those regular seasons to get people to give people that same aura that your your Colby's have that you're yeah. Yeah, some of these other guys have have have created over their years. And that's the only way you're going to do it. That's the only way you're going to do it with these these new era place. You can't just come out there and say, oh, yeah, did played a really dominant game. She's really good. It's like, OK, well, let's see her play again. And yeah, it's sort of it.

[00:23:00] It was a huge miss again. I don't know why they didn't they got so stuck on not having an another another return between them. We could have missed the eighth season in a row of them doing exactly the same thing. And that would have been a very big missed opportunity like in a world where yet in the late 40s. I like to think 48 just knowing how good 47 was like a 48 is either like it's been said to death because it's so obvious. Like the survivor community rarely agrees.

[00:23:26] I think everyone is like if you just did either a second chance season or a new era all stars, that's like new era slash modern, like really get in the late mid to late 30s or just new era. But like that whole time that have all been like robbed of this spot. And we've been robbed from a TV perspective. Then 50 would kind of, you know, it would sort itself out because you'd have those legends and you can have even winners that don't necessarily even need to come back for a second time. And then they would be up there with these like multi time players. Now it's so, so uneven.

[00:23:55] Then we start worrying about the boot order and everything like that, even though they even aren't playing yet. But these are things that we think about. And I think that there's a couple of things. Firstly, they, to be fair, did not need 50 to be the celebration. Like they could have heavily themed it as second chances too. And I don't think we would have complained. They could have made it pretty. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. One time is we've all wanted to see, give me a Natalie Bolton, give me a Sean Rector, you know, one time plays who haven't had their chance with a lot of the late 30 people who've been robbed of spots.

[00:24:23] We talk about like Adoma Bate, like people who aren't going to get their chances because there were not opportunities and some who are coming back on the season and a lot from the new era. And that would have been fine. And then maybe like 55 is like some big hero thing where everyone's kind of caught up to themselves. But that is not what happened. So, yeah, I feel like if you're going to do this, that's so modern. Well, I don't have a problem as much with the modernity because I think the casting is by far the best part of the new era. I would have maybe had different picks of this new era cast, but I still think it's great.

[00:24:53] I think it's the future of the show. I think it's like these are meant to be the icons of now, give them that chance. I think then don't package it as a celebration of the whole series and then don't cast it trying to inject that into it where you have some. But now it's so uneven because you're like, it's a celebration of the series. We have Colby and Camilla and Kyle. Like those two people, they don't exist on the planet.

[00:25:16] Like it's that's it's the issue was in clearly what seems like from the outside looking in an incredibly chaotic process where they were like, it's impossible to balance all these things. It's like it actually, yes, is impossible. You're trying too much. And they're like, we'll have 24 people. It's like, no, that's actually not even enough because you've stressed yourself so thin. And it's like, yeah, 100%. Okay. Expectation wise, if they straight up came out and said big plans for 50, we're doing new era versus old era.

[00:25:46] This is the theme. This is what it's going to be. Would the, would the, would there be this much backlash if they had come out straight away and said that? I think that would, I, I, yeah, that would have been way better. That would have been way better. But not, not this. The thing is like, if it's new era versus old era, then I don't think it should be like, and I love Sari. We'll talk about Sari every day for me, but in this theme, like Sari versus some of these, like one time new era players doesn't make sense to me.

[00:26:11] If it was new era versus old era second chance or to streamline it a little bit more, I would be okay with it. For me, it's the issue of, it's just all over the place from a casting perspective. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. One time players. Everyone's a one time player. No winners. Exactly. Well, I mean, just having like some specific theme, I think really narrows them in when the pool is so big and you can get a little lost in it.

[00:26:36] Then we get like a game changes cast rather than like a second chance or winners of war where it's like, here's our like specific criteria where everyone's on a similar footing. And yeah, it seems like the casting process was really hectic and it really looks like. And really unfair. Yeah. Like really. Yeah. And like, I've, I've asked some of the places cause I'm like, is it that casting just is hard and like players are just taking it hard or was this brutal? And kind of the answer I've been getting is like, it actually has been really brutal. It seems like they had to keep a lot of options open through themes that were changing.

[00:27:06] They didn't know which way to go. Like, I actually like, it seems like they were in disarray from, from my minimal knowledge and the players paid, played the players paid the price. I say that 10 times fast players paid the price because they were keeping options open. They were like really stringing along a lot of people very deep into the process. And then people, you know, invested all their energy into this and their dreams and their hopes and then got cut, cut very late. And it's just, it's hard to see that personally. I mean, you know that.

[00:27:33] The Australian survivor returning, um, pro casting process, but I can tell it to you in one sentence. Do you want to play survivor? Yep. You're wrong. Really? See you in three months. Like literally. That shocking. Literally. I'm just getting a call guys. I'm just getting a call. One second. Yep. Yep. Sweet. Okay. Thank you. Your marriage is done.

[00:28:02] Like this is, this is it. Yeah. Like, you know, it was that, and I don't know whether it was because it was the first all stars and the pool was quite small. It had only been four seasons, but like, and maybe. Yeah. Maybe there were some people on the periphery where it was a little bit more. I do know there were some people like later on that it was a little bit more drawn out for, but having spoken to a few, well, I spoke to Steven, you know, and he kind of gave me the background of like how casting works.

[00:28:28] So it is like, it seems like an exercise in cruelty, like on purpose cruelty compared to the way that Australian Survivor does it. And it's just another reason I'm proud to be from the best franchise. Yeah. Well, that's shocking to me because I genuinely think Australian Survivor is by far the cruelest franchise. I mean, look at the fact that they're like, random twist. You got zero confessionals. Bye. Like, like, US Survivor I actually think does usually want to make things fairer on the cast.

[00:28:55] What I've always said is that what I usually think it is, is that Survivor South Africa wants you to have a good time. US Survivor is like, it's not there to make you have a good time, but it would be nice if you did. And Australian Survivor like wants you to have a bad time because it's good for TV. That's not been my experience at all with Australian Survivor, but both times. You got confessionals. No, no. I mean, just like my experience with being part of the show behind the scenes as well in various ways. And, and just, yeah, all of that, like it's, that is not my experience with the show that

[00:29:25] there are people who love the game, who love the show and who care for the people. And I know that's probably not everyone's experience, but I have been involved in some capacity in most seasons. And I think that they just, there is a lack of, there is an empathy and an understanding of it being like people working together as a team, not this, we're going to dangle and string you along and string you along and string you along.

[00:29:54] Like so many people, there's a reason why Jerry is out in the fricking desert, posting five minute videos of her staring into the distance, like a broken soul. Like that is someone who has been purposely strung along for nearly a year told, sold a bill of goods. And then at the last minute after rearranging her whole life and all this stuff and promising the world that it's been yanked out from underneath it. Like that is cruel.

[00:30:23] What they did to Carolyn and the reason that they gave that is cruel. You know, that it's just, it's unnecessary. I know we're ranting now. No, no, I do. I agree with you. But the thing is for me is that I actually think that it is against what US survivor is usually about. And like, I chuckled at the, you know, Jerry looking under the distance. I feel it like it's, it's very real. Like that a level of disappointment on a dream and how much of your mental energy you would have to invest in. Like, am I going on this thing soon? Can I like invest in a different life from that?

[00:30:52] I can't even imagine it. I just think when US survivor, like in Australia survivor, there's some level of like the TV show has to be bigger. Like if there's a twist, if you aren't interesting, like you're not getting confessionals just because you were there. It's not really about your experience as much. And there's definitely some element of that from the way that the people can be at least in the finished product, more caricatures. And like that obviously plays out in the way they're treated from at least like a post-production standpoint and like parts of, I think like some of like the old twists you have survivor,

[00:31:19] especially the new era is so focused on your journey and experience. And like people say it's almost too lovey-dovey, like where are the villains? And it's like so much about this casting process seems so like we want all our options open. It was like a player who's like on Tinder, like, well, I just need to know that I have like, you know, a date for tomorrow night. It's like- You gotta have a roster, Shannon. You gotta have a roster. It literally was not. It was like Barney Simpson level roster.

[00:31:47] But I know, I know from my process, my long arduous process of casting, the two times that I got all the way right through and I was like, I'm going to be on this is really, and then was told no at the last minute. I had those conversations and they were some of the most genuine, like heartbreaking conversations from their end as well. And the people talking to you with like, I am so sorry this, we tried so hard. We did all this stuff and it just, it just hasn't worked out.

[00:32:15] And you could, you just felt that empathy and you, you felt that. And I was like, yeah, look, it's, it is what it is. And at the end of the day, and it's, it's, it's, it really, it really, really sucks. But how you deliver that and how you, I just felt, I've always felt in my casting journey, very cared for and looked after in terms of the, the expectations and the, the understanding that like decisions are still being made and different people have different ideas and things like that, and they will come together.

[00:32:43] And it does seem very different in America that it does seem that there is a pyramid shaped hierarchy that a lot of things that have made, well, this person thinks this, well, that doesn't matter because this is happening now. And things there, it seems to be a lot of, a lot of pivots early on to, in terms of theming and things like that, depending on who they can get. And we've all heard like, oh, Amanda doesn't want to play now because Ozzy's there. And so then that then creates a gap that they have to fill and things like that.

[00:33:10] So it's a, it's a hell of a chess puzzle, but I've never seen, I've never seen a season where people have just been all over Instagram saying I got cut. It's devastating. It's fine. Everyone else have a good time. It's because people have had enough. It's like, they've had enough. Yeah. It's like, I've never seen that happen before. So openly. Well, like, it's also kind of like, it's like, you know, this relationship, which is so asymmetrical in power where it's like, you can't like, and you know, throughout the years you hear of

[00:33:37] like people who have been like dragged along, like Shane powers. And, you know, you know, all the other time that like other people who were kind of like kept in the loop and even Steven was, was kept in the loop for a bunch, you know, all this kind of stuff, like, but you never speak out because like, then they'll ruin your chance. And it's like, I think now people are just like, do you know what? I've had enough. And if not, I'll go on the traders or I can go on this or I can go on that. Or like, you know, I think that there are other people courting interest that it's like, do you know, I don't need to stand up for this anymore.

[00:34:05] And it's kind of like that someone in a relationship who's realized their worth and has realized that like, I don't have to, you know, allow this kind of like, I'm exaggerating here, but this like near psychological abuse of being kind of like teased for so long. And let that feeling, that feeling when, you know, when you play once and you want to play again, you're kind of like, you know, that gets that bubbling up feeling when it gets to that time of the year. And it's like, is this going to happen this year?

[00:34:34] You know, you do, you just inherently do. And if you say you don't, if you're enough of a fan and you say you don't, I think you're a liar. So like these people have been feeling this now. Think about Chrissy, you know what that she played the season when I played all stars. Like that was so, yeah. No season one. It would have been, well, no, it would have been after that. A little bit after. Yeah, it was all stars. It was all stars. Yeah. No, it was about 2017 that Chrissy played. Oh, then it was season one. Yeah. Season one then. Yeah. Season up. Yeah.

[00:35:03] And because that's the one I didn't watch. You know, that's a long time that that's a time that I've been in the survivor community. That's a long time where she's been waiting, you know, and every year you'd be like, oh, oh, oh, oh. I feel sorry for these people. Anyway. Yeah. I'm glad to see Chrissy. It is possible, obviously, that casting do have empathy as they're making these cuts. It's an unenviable task, especially because as we'll talk about, like we all have complaints, but a lot of the complaints are different. But we all agree on some things, which means we're definitely right.

[00:35:33] Because it's so rare that the fandom comes together on some things. But yeah, but like a lot of the complaints are different. Like they might've gone more new era. And I would have liked, you know, that if it made more sense cohesively, but a lot of people would have been angry at that. Like people have different gripes. It's hard to please everyone. And it feels like maybe from overhead networks, like they're probably trying to appease a lot of parties. I don't know, but probably where like things are getting messy and then things started changing. So they probably do feel really bad that they played with human beings like this. And it's very, very real that people put all their hopes in that.

[00:36:03] However, it just feels like, you know, maybe not everyone's going so deep in, or maybe there should just be a little bit more transparency. There's going to be any learning. It's like, this is where you're at. Not like you're, you're probably in, you know, I feel like people thought that they got that call or were really, really close, but we're actually one of many on the roster. And I feel like if, if maybe they don't need as many on the roster and it's like, if you can't get everyone you perfectly want, you're still going to have a great cast because you have so many options. Like maybe we reduce that and we'd be more transparent. I'm talking with no knowledge at all about the process.

[00:36:31] I'm just thinking maybe that's best. Let's talk about the snubs. I'm going to take this away so I can see the faces a little more. We'll talk about it when we get back in the pics. But here we're talking about snubs. So it's not those people. Okay. Um, Nick, you, you had some snubs, you had bees in your bonnet. You've had all of these things. Who are you most upset to not have? The number one snub for me, the absolute number one snub is Jonathan Penner. Yes. It might've been medical though.

[00:37:01] Uh, sure. Okay. We don't know. He hasn't said that. No. Where did I hear that? He had a really gracious tweet. Actually. I saw that. I saw that tweet. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and it's like, it's okay, Jonathan will be, will be enraged on your behalf. So I think that, you know, considering everything that has happened in his life in the last few years, like I want to see the penna that's come out the other end of that.

[00:37:26] Like I just have such a love for that guy and the way he thinks about life and the way he talks and assesses things. So to me, he's my number one snub. What about you guys? Yeah. What do you think Eden? He was, uh, me and Nick, we share the same brain. He was my number one. He was my number one. Well, I was in your intro video before Titans V Rebels. That was where I was like, Oh, Eden's the real deal. He's, he didn't just, you know, just start watching recently.

[00:37:52] He can be one day when we talk about survivor 50, he can be one of the super fans who talk about that on a podcast. Bonnet wearing. Yeah. And even if he's just had a baby, he will be there. That penna quote really got me realizing that. I, I love penna. I've always loved penna. He's the best. I, when I got voted off, um, Rachel got in contact with him and he sent me a video message. Um, about it was no, it's really long and it's amazing. Do the impression.

[00:38:19] Um, it's be penna and do it. We need Rob. We need Rob. See, we need Rob. See, but penna was right up there. Obviously I would have loved to have seen, um, Rob out there as well. Um, our boy, Rob see, and the fact that this stage in his life, he was like, you know what? I probably could do this. It's, it's, it's come around full circle. Um, that I, I really feel like they missed a trick there in terms of the epicness of the season. But I think someone, another person.

[00:38:49] When did he get cut? I know he said it on, on, I haven't kept up the podcast. He got pretty good. Well, yeah, he said on the patron podcast, it was kind of around when Carolyn and Jesse started like yelling into the ether and starting a bit of a social media trend on like taking production to public tasks. So what was that like a couple of months ago? Why? That was also when Natalie Tenerelli was like, I got cut. What was the, anyway, it's fine.

[00:39:17] What did he say was the reason they gave? They didn't give a reason. They went in a different direction. There's no, yeah. Mike, Mike White rang up and said, I want to be on. Yeah. Which should be fair. We'll talk about the Mike White pick is very fair. We'll talk about Mike White, but it's pretty amazing. But we're talking about snubs. The other one I have to put out there. I do obviously T-Bird. Um, I would have loved to have seen T-Bird, but, um, the final like Dom. Yeah.

[00:39:44] The fact that the, the, the person that I felt closest to ever winning without actually winning, I do think Dom should have had a go. And if you want to go back, I've got a couple more. I think, I think, um, how did, how did Sean Rector get in the mix and then not get through at the end of the day? It's painful. I heard that. He said that if the Sepia isn't doing it, I'm not doing it. But is that like some just fan fiction that I've seen someone tweet? Oh, I didn't. None of us know anything. I think that's. Um, the other one I really liked was, I think, I think, I think that's the other one

[00:40:13] it was obviously Shane, but I don't think Shane was. I don't think that was ever going to be in the mix. But so this is, this is my thing. If like a lot of people you just mentioned are one time losers. Like even if they just did what I wanted for the second chance season that has a lot of modern representation, but then goes back, they might, they would still have snubs. There's so many great picks. Um, like you mentioned Dom, somebody we've never seen back, but I know he's done a lot

[00:40:42] of the challenge like Jay from, from millennials versus Gen X. I feel like would be a multi multi time player. Had there been more, but then like, there wasn't as much space for millennials versus Gen X. A lot of those like mid thirties and Chrissy and the, and the David versus Goliath people are represent and Devon's are representing that here. But a lot of other people missed that Dom is a big one. They're never going back to 39, but I like Janet. But the thing is, these are all one-time losers. Imagine it could be anyone because they've opened up the scope.

[00:41:10] It's like, if there are going to be two winners, they should probably have amped it up on having some more winners. Then you also look at some other people like a Malcolm who went out in game changes. They wanted to kind of represent all the eras and they skipped right over the twenties. I think someone like Malcolm would be really great, but I don't want to just skip over Rob. You know, here we are. And Rob has a podcast. Rob to me is the biggest snub because I want a pay rise. Rob to me is the biggest snub because Rob actually ties in all of how this is.

[00:41:39] Like he could make it somewhat cohesive. He's like old school. He knows his place. It's been spoken about to death, but like the fact that he's like such a modern part of the game, like he actually does represent 50 seasons and 25 years of the show. That's very, very difficult. So I think they really missed a trick. Obviously not having Rob. Let me talk about that. And then like, even on the, the, Wait, can I just say something on that? Can I just say something on that? I believe that he's a victim of his own success in the fact that like, he is more valuable to them, not on the show than on the show.

[00:42:10] Yeah. Like, you know what? That's Rob's cross to bear. Like then work it out with him and like, give it to the team. And then I will do know it all. It's fine. I'm safe for the show. The show is like, but like, you know, he does generate a lot of content for us. Let's, you know, let's keep him out there doing that. Let him pre advertising. Yeah. Like let him podcast. I'm sorry, but a lot of these legends are on Instagram lives every second week. Now, obviously Australian survivor doesn't care at all. I mean, they're allowing poverty. So like podcast with Shawnee and I'm like, I don't want to hear this.

[00:42:39] So that's not, that's not CBS, but like, if they just allow Rob to do some content and then he also has a team of people, I will do it. It's fine. No, then like you could have your cake and eat it too. So, and that wasn't that like fair. If that's the reason sure. But I don't think that's not the reason they gave it would have actually been a nice thing to say. So yeah, Sean Rector, we told all of these like old schoolers. I think Natalie Bolton is a big one that everyone wanted back. Um, also on the new era, there are a lot of people that are like, well, maybe there are

[00:43:09] production issues like a Venus or Shan, who I think had like some production issues. However, if it's people that legitimately could have played, so we're just cut and other people who will talk about, we're chosen over them. I'll bring my bias back. Marianne, no one talks enough about Marianne. If you're bringing winners back, Marianne is an all time character. She's a great player. She's the best person alive. Okay. Bias aside, it's just simply true. Omar. I'll take, I'll bring the bias back. Having none of the Tika three. Are you kidding me? Like they actually are one.

[00:43:38] I don't even really like 44. That's one of the biggest parts of the new era by far. Like you either have Jam Jam as a winner or you have Carolyn. I don't know that you can have both. I think that's going to like release, you know, take over the season, but you got to have someone from the Tika three, Jesse. Yeah. Like they had 12 picks for the new era and there were so many key snubs of people who clearly wanted to play and are mad. Like for why? Anyway, some new era snubs. Nick, who do you think? Yeah. Carolyn is a huge one for me.

[00:44:05] Um, I'm just, I'm unbelievable. Um, do you know that the Jesse discourse is interesting because that season I went back and watched what last year. Remember? I'd never seen it. I think I had spoken on the last time. I actually watched it last year and I went into it going, okay, so Jesse is this person that everyone talks about. And I know the kind of like the, the, the thread of the story because of your follow on social media. I got to say on a rewatch didn't really pop.

[00:44:32] And I don't know whether it's like that's an, I was looking for it and I was ready and like, yeah, he was part of it, but like, you know, so I wasn't as invested in that, but maybe that's because I didn't go along with the hype of the storyline. I don't think that's unfair, but I, from like a casting perspective, then there's a lot of good options in the new era. I think on like a storyline, if we're celebrating 50 seasons, the same way that like the Tika three is a big thing. I still think that Jesse backstabbing Cody is the best moment of the new era.

[00:45:00] I think that storyline alone is so recognizable and Jesse represents that. He doesn't have to be on, but over some other picks, I would put him on. Yeah. I get it. I get it. But I think that he's not like the two biggest people are Jesse and Carolyn. Like I think it's Carolyn, like by a country mile. And then there's people like Emily and Genevieve and that like, yeah. I would have loved to have seen Andy play again. Personally. I love Andy.

[00:45:28] I would have been down for Ricard. I really like Ricard. You know, I think there was plenty of people there, but the people that I wanted to see of the new era were Carolyn, Emily and Genevieve. Okay. So two out of three ain't bad. Yeah. What about you, Eden? Yeah. Look, you've basically called out all. A lot of names. Yeah. You have named every single person in the new era. Venus was the fourth one. Like a hundred.

[00:45:58] I love, love, love, love Venus. I just, I just, I didn't think they would get winners back. So I didn't even think Marianne would get a callback because I just assumed they wouldn't be calling back winners. Um, I, Caroline is just the most interesting, the, to me, the most interesting players from the new era are Caroline. I do think Q, I know Q's very divisive. I do think in terms of character wise, he, he popped, I think him, Caroline. Um, I also like, I really love Omar as well.

[00:46:27] And I think he, as a character really came a long way. Um, I'm probably in the minority. I actually really liked Jonathan. I think in terms of standing out my mind in that early seasons, he really sticks with me in terms of someone that this guy was carrying entire tribes on his back. I think he has his space, but Ricard, I don't know why you couldn't, I understand that if you can't have, um, Sean as well, but in terms of production stuff, whatever like that.

[00:46:55] But I thought Ricard, I think that's a huge miss as well. Just a really great, like early new era sort of like villainous, really interesting person. And Jesse was up there for me as well. But, um, yeah, look and, oh, and Jen, Jen, I do actually really like Jen. I think she deserves to be there as well. Um, I'm not a, not a huge, I don't know why, I'm not really sure why Tiff's there. Um, Emily's fine, but Tiff, Tiff, I don't know why she said, and I'm not a big fan of

[00:47:24] Tiff is a huge, Tiff is a huge confusion for me as, as lots of people. But like, do you know what I'd try, I keep trying to think, I keep trying to think that when the heroes villains cast was announced or when that leaked and everyone was like Candace and Danielle, Candace and Danielle, it was this huge discussion around like everyone was great. And then there was Candace and Danielle. And I love that season as most people do. But if you actually go back and watch it, they both are integral, I believe to the season

[00:47:53] like Candace's storyline of how she kind of like flips back and forth and how people didn't like it. That was, I think quite, I was very much invested in that. And I think that Double D is like one of the unsung heroes of heroes versus villains. Like she, without her, poverty and Russell could have done nothing. I love the dynamic between her and Russell. Like I say, like what that makes me think is I always, whenever there are these head

[00:48:19] scratches, I just go, you love what Danielle and Candace brought. So just trust the process and a new hero, a new interesting storyline will emerge. So I try and do that. But that's kind of saying like poverty and Russell needed like a pawn. It's like, you can't have any Kings and Queens without pawns. I'm not saying that's what Tiffany would be, but like maybe in the makeup of a cast. And I don't even think Tiffany is like that. Like my concern with Tiffany is that when they announced her, they were like, sometimes she got on with Q and sometimes she didn't get on with Q.

[00:48:49] And I'm like, well, you already seem to have cast Aubrey for Q and Q will be entertaining with any person. Like how many Q casting decisions are you making? And it's like, this is what I want to talk about when we talk through the players. Like Tiffany herself is not a bad pick. I think she was good casting. I think she was fun on 46. And I really, really liked 46 as a season, but it's knowing how many other people were like wanting to do it and seemingly very, very far in the process that now Tiffany is having to wear.

[00:49:16] It's not even fair to her that she's having to wear over her. And I will say like, we did the, um, the draft for who will be on 50. I haven't listened back to it last year. I think Rob's winning it. Um, yeah, I think Rob did very, very well, but like, I don't even know if we gave Tiffany an honorable mention and we had just watched her play and we were heavily skewed new era. And we'd only seen six seasons of the new era. Like almost everyone on the new era got a shot. Some people have, I don't think like any points, not me, but some people don't have any points.

[00:49:45] And I don't know that Tiffany was, she definitely wasn't taken and I don't know that she was mentioned. So I think that's kind of like where Tiffany comes in. Also, can I say with Shan, I don't, I keep starting rumors. I'm like, where are the issues? I don't know anything. I actually don't know if that's true, but I feel like Shan's kind of moved on and she has like a big social media following and she's like living her life in terms of like Carolyn. When we talk about who could have been in, in like new era, female slots, Carolyn very rarely is someone who was as big as these old school legends.

[00:50:13] It's very, very hard because no one's come back and they haven't had time. From her being a character on 44, let alone being a traitor on the traitors, from a pure reality TV standpoint, she has name recognition beyond the show, which is so rare in the new era. It's a slam dunk. For sure. What's going on? Yeah. Slam dunk. Something must have happened. It's just, you don't get characters like that, like in the new era. Yeah. She's bigger than life and she's so much fun.

[00:50:42] And it just kills me that they've gone down that route of punishing someone to make a, make a point to everyone else. Do you think that was it though? Because they said that and then they, then she was in the mix and then now she's gone. Oh yeah. You, you, they did that so they could have to mess with her. They could deny it. No. They, so they could deny it. No. They could go, Oh, you see, she was in the mix, but then, but then ultimately didn't work out. That's the only reason because they got the backlash that it got leaked that she was not being brought in because of the traitors thing.

[00:51:12] And then they said, Oh, we'll put her back in the mix. Full well know that they weren't going to do it. Yeah. Well, it's criminal. Like it's genuinely crazy. Like they should say like, thank you, traitors. Like you've like, are you, you elevated our star even further. How many people from the traitors would watch 50 to see her back? Like the amount of people she, she and some of the other players in these shows might've brought to survivor. Whatever it's been spoken about to death again, but like really looking at gift horse in the mouth.

[00:51:40] And then I will say for Jonathan, who I really don't think is a good pick. I don't, I'm sorry. I'm human beings, but like he represents the whole of 41 to 44. And I am a little bit worried a little bit, not to be too like the cast is on even that we might get a mate chippy bad food order because I can't, I don't really want to. Huge possibility. But like, yeah, like Nick's already been through it. And if I look at like Jonathan with Joe and it's in everyone's mind is going to just happen. Colby coach already did this with the religious undertones.

[00:52:10] Carl, we know could fall in. Steph LaGrosa for sure. I want to talk about Steph LaGrosa. Ozzy could like, there's still a lot of gamers, obviously an old school gamers. And we'll talk about that, but like a little bit worried about like what I see kind of amassing and I just watched it. So I definitely don't want to watch it again in eight months from now. It's huge. It's the potential for that is huge. Huge. Yeah. So who, okay. So who, who stands out against that then? So Chrissy. Let's look at the list.

[00:52:39] A lot of people, a lot of people. Rick Devins, Rick Devins. No, but who's going to break that apart? No, a lot. Auri. Aubrey, Jenna Lewis. Uri's going to. Yeah. Christian. Mike White. Mike White will. Emily. Angelina. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Genevieve. Hugh might be, might accidentally take it down from the inside. Like he might be part of it and then screw it up. I do think that's a possibility. Charlie could try and break it up. Genevieve for sure. Camilla.

[00:53:09] I'm not saying that there aren't. Okay. Do you know who's going to, I cannot wait. So, so when, so when the cast has shrunk in terms of like how many real people you're super keen on, you then start picking through the scraps and going, okay, who are the people I'm really going to focus my attention on? And do you know who is going to chew? I cannot wait to see this person. Chew someone like Q. Someone like Jonathan, like Jenna fricking Lewis.

[00:53:34] Like I'm planting my flag that Jenna Lewis is going to be way more integral to this whole mix than we actually think. And I just believe that Jenna Lewis, the same Jenna Lewis who just like knew how to chew those people up in all stars. She's going to do it. She's going to do it. So I am like, so banking on her at this point. I'm banking on her, Mike White and Angelina and Genevieve as being like the people who

[00:54:01] are going to like, make sure this season is not a repeat of what apparently has just happened in 48, which I haven't actually watched. Well, you're, you're missing out on a lot of the season. No, I'm not. You're missing out on 50. You are because there's three people compared to again, just Jonathan from four seasons. You've got three of the final four. I mean, let's talk about the picks thing. Cause that's my big question is like, okay, we know there are a ton of missed opportunities, but then again, like Tiffany's not a bad pick.

[00:54:30] We just like, if you were to tell me that everyone else, you know, turned down the call, I'd be like, sure. I'll see Tiffany. Like I just fell. She seems fine, but like perfect second chance. Yeah, exactly. Um, yeah, but okay. So that's why I want to look at them and be like beyond all of that and how destroying to the cast is because we've spoken about it. How, um, yeah, how are these picks good? And I want to do it cause the compliment sandwich has kind of fallen off. It's been a lot of, a lot of sandwich. I feel like a lot of negatives.

[00:54:57] Um, should we start with what we think are actively bad picks or should we go into good picks? Cause how should we end it? I don't know. Let's talk up some good things. Let's talk. Then we're going to end on bad, but then we don't have to. We've gone through a lot of them. No, I have more to say. I don't know what to do. Oh God. Shit. Wait, do you have? Okay. Okay. Well, we'll do bad. We'll get it over with. And then we're going to end on a lot of good. Nick, who are bad picks for you? Like you are actively bad.

[00:55:25] It's not because it's not because we could have had that person, but they'll be fine. It's like, I really don't want you on my television. It's just true. I'm sorry. And we, what if we're wrong? We might be wrong, but just. Yeah. So I'm not going to weigh in on the season 48 because like I've only seen one episode and yeah. So I'll just put that aside. The people I'm least interested to see are Tiffany, Jonathan. I could do without Ozzy, but I get it. I get it.

[00:55:54] And I could do without Stephanie. They are the people that I am least interested in seeing other than the final five people on that row who are big question marks me. So yeah, and Charlie as well. Like Charlie seems like a kind of guy that I would, I would get along with. And that Charlie is Charlie. I appreciated what he brought to that season, but there is no way that like he brought the level of things that are commensurate with what 50 should be. So again, love Charlie.

[00:56:21] And I'm super happy for all of these people, but Jonathan, Tiffany, Charlie, Stephanie, and Ozzy. Okay. We'll disagree on some. Eden, who do you hate? I don't need to see Ozzy again. I've seen him enough. He's, he's storyline for me. Like it felt complete in, in South Pacific where he had the opportunity. Yeah, it felt complete one whole season ago. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I don't think, I don't need Dee and Kyle. I don't need winners.

[00:56:51] I don't need Tiff. Yeah. Charlie. I don't, I don't really need Charlie. I, who else did I have on my list? Oh yeah. Joe. Didn't feel I, Camilla can be fine, but Joe, I don't need Joe. Aubrey. I don't really need Aubrey. I, I, I sort of get what she came in sort of last minute and things like that, but they're, they're, they're my sort of big ones. Aubrey. Ozzy. Yeah. The winners, Joe. Yeah. Tiff. Charles.

[00:57:19] From what I'm hearing, this is actually then like not a good cast because if we have enough question, I know there's a lot of people, but if we have that many question marks, cause for me, okay. So here, here, I'm going to give it, I'll go in order. I actually like, at first I was like kind of upset with Jenna Lewis, but more because I think it was the Jerry thing was getting to me. Like they filled some of the slots and then I'm like, now I'm actually like, no way. Jenna Lewis was one of like the only people we would say would really game hard from the early game. I'm actually interested to see. Yeah. You had to have Robert's season one. Yeah. Robert's season one. Yeah. She's a good, she's a good pick for that.

[00:57:48] So I will, I've, I've come around on it in the two days. Please don't hate me. Jenna Lewis updates who already threaded me. Like you better. I'm like, I don't, I've never mentioned Jenna Lewis before, but I'm not just because of that. I've come around. Colby. Not a good pick. Not a good pick. Sorry. Colby in the new era sounds like an SNL skit. Like it literally sounds like a skit that he's like, it's comedic. He was. Yes. But that it's gone so far. It's gone so far to being comedic that I'm actually in on it.

[00:58:18] No, I'm in on it. No, no, no. Okay. Colby. Colby knowledge is power. Colby fucking on a, on a, on a losing his vote. Trying to show it. Show it. Show it. Show figuring out who's got shot in the dark guys. This is going to be so good. And like, yes, I take your point that it like we're done with him. And like, I know I said Aussie and Stephanie as well, but like it is slim pickings for people who represent our childhood. It's not. We can, it is. It is.

[00:58:46] No, you can understand, but you understand, you understand Colby and Stephanie are two of the people. I understand that. Totally. Show was the biggest it's ever been. Season two. Everyone. Totally. More kids got named Colby that year than any other year. Yeah. Everyone loves that stat. One person named their dog Colby is what happened. Okay. No, I'm not trying to diminish it. I'm not diminishing it. You ragging on my new, new child's name. That would be perfect.

[00:59:15] That would be no, but yeah. Beautiful name though. Colby is a great name. Can I just say on the Colby names that maybe people didn't care about Colby the person and they just, Colby is a great name. It's not like his name was like Balthazar and everyone named the kid Balthazar in honor of him because no one could like the name on its own merits. Like Colby, maybe they would just, it's a cheese. Colby is just a great name. I might name my kid Colby one day just cause it's like, just cause it's a cheese. Anyway, sorry. You were saying.

[00:59:43] But those two, but those two, you get why they're on the show. You get why. I don't get it actually. I want to fight about it. They people, more people know those two players and perhaps anyone else in the history of the show that have watched it. They're going to pull back people that haven't watched it for 10 years. We just made the argument Shannon, like we just made the argument that Carolyn brings in all these players and all these people. Carolyn's great TV. I know, but like you can't make the exact same opposite, the opposite argument for Colby. Like, no, he's more well known than Carolyn.

[01:00:13] Yes, I can make the same argument because Carolyn's great TV. And additionally, if you want people from the new era, she actually like, which is rare in the new era. A lot of people from the olden days and the olden days from 2000 ish think like can be iconic. And also the most important thing is entertainment. I'm not saying that Colby wasn't great TV. I'm just saying that like, who could watch yours versus villains and be like 15 years later, we're going to bring him back. Now I will say when I was talking to my dad last week about the Australia V world cast,

[01:00:39] which by the way, this really puts in perspective how well the AUV world cast slaps. Just saying, but when I was, when I was talking to my dad about that, he said, where is Boston Rob and the guy who was on Curb Your Enthusiasm. So today I told him, yeah, Colby will be back. And so, okay. So, and Colby has a big name recognition. I still think it's crazy. I still think there are other names, but fine on Colby. I want to like, Steph LaGrosa, I think underratedly bad pick. And I'll tell you why. Yes.

[01:01:05] She has massive, if not name recognition, story recognition, because the Palau, Oolong stuff. It's like, if I were to go to my parents and say, do you remember this person? I don't think they'd say yes. But if I remember, do you remember she was by herself? Like if I were to say that, I think they'd be like, yes. She's been riding on that for 20 years. She was on the traders. She's getting poverty level opportunities. Is she bringing poverty level entertainment? Like there's a renaissance of TV heroes and it's like, Sari, Boston Rob, poverty, and Steph LaGrosa.

[01:01:35] I know. I don't think it's urban to the same degree. I 100% agree with you. I actually 1000% agree with you. And we saw the loop get closed with Guatemala, which was basically a season all about her. Like what more possible story could we get from her? So that's why like, I get it and I'm okay with it, especially when we have like this absolute vacuum of like previous like icons. So I'm okay with it, but I don't love it.

[01:02:05] And I don't love that Stephanie and Sari have been on so many shows together. And like, I can tell you, I know that they are still good friends. Like they are. Yeah. So like that's like, it's like Stephanie and Colby were like close allies. And like, yeah, that's just that's that's yeah, she's give me Bobby John. No, I don't know. Well, every name's been mentioned. That might be a number one. Okay.

[01:02:31] So that's, um, and maybe honestly, maybe, I don't know what Bobby John's doing, but I'm just saying, okay, that's Stephanie. No, no, no, no. Give me Karen Grotel. Give me Karen Grotel. If we're going to really go to Palau. No, no, no. We're going, we're going Judd. We're going Judd. I thought you were going to say Judd in there. Getting Judd in there. Have you seen Judd recently was at an event. Someone took a photo with Judd at an event. I'm like, he's back in the, he's back in the fan base Judd. Get him out there. That actually would be epic for my second chance. One time lose the season. Yeah. It's like fun stuff. Okay. I don't need Ozzy.

[01:03:01] It's been spoken to. I don't need coach. It's been spoken to. I think it's going to suck a lot of the air out. We have Q. Like Q is new era coach. We were going to get it. Um, Aubrey, I could come around on. I have been low on Aubrey and I know the whole thing is like, there's a big Aubrey stand from Korong. The diminishing returns. Like you can almost put a picture of Aubrey next to like survivor diminishing returns in the dictionary. It's just unfortunate. And I'm being so harsh and I'm hearing it, but like I'm an Aubrey stand. I could come around because I think having the time off, I think she's had a child and named him, I assume Colby.

[01:03:31] I'm like, I think she's had two kids. Oh, she's had two Colby's. A Colby and a mozzarella. Colby and Stephanie. Yeah. Colby and Stephanie. Um, I think I, and Aubrey might, I think with Aubrey, like what she, so she played 32, 34, 38. Like no wonder they were diminishing returns. She was probably fricking exhausted. Now that she's had a lot more time, it actually could be interesting. And we know that she can bring it from a TV perspective when it goes. Well, I'm actually coming around and Aubrey, I'm convincing myself. Okay. Sorry. I am a huge, no, no,

[01:04:01] you go, you go, you go. I'm a huge Aubrey fan. I've met her. We've hung out. She is magnetic. She is so my people. I love Aubrey. I will always love Aubrey. I am like, when people will say like, we don't need another Aubrey. Like, do you know what? I actually think we do need Aubrey. Like I, I love what she, like her self-awareness and like what, who she speaks to in the, the fan base is like, she was the first of her kind. And she will always people,

[01:04:31] just like there's the people who always compare to poverty. There'll be people who always compare to Aubrey. And like that is, she had, she carved out a niche for herself in the show that had been on for 30 seasons. I love her. And you, I will never speak poorly of her. And if you had to, if I had to put this, this, this cast on the stove and boil them down to my top five favorites, Aubrey's in like the top three. And I will never, no, I will never speak poorly of Aubrey. Wow. We came in really high on Aubrey. Eden, what were you going to ask? No,

[01:05:01] I was, I was going to say, I've never met Aubrey. I, I think she's lovely lady. I don't think she's a full time player of survivor. Like it just doesn't. When I think about the people that have played four times, five times, and I just in my head, and maybe it is the diminishing returns. And what my last memory of her is her time on edge of extinction and how that sort of all fell apart in such a dramatic way. But yeah, I've just, to me,

[01:05:31] I think her, her story had been told enough in Co-Wrong. I think that was such a beautiful arc for her in Co-Wrong. And I think that was, that, that was her season. That was her season. I think it's never quite re-reached that. And I'm, I'm, I was surprised to see her back on here. I'm sorry, Nick. Well, that's why I want her back because like, she deserves better than the last time. And like, I thought this when she was on edge of extinction. So like, I, I'm so desperate for the story to be rewritten. And I'm hoping that like,

[01:05:58] she is enough of a non entity in people's minds because of this time lapse. I just, I just always want better for her than what she got. And I, I do remember hearing, you know, conversations with, you know, exit interviews, game changes that people just like shut her out completely and refuse to work with her. And she just was like completely iced out because of her, her background. So I'm hoping that that won't be an issue for her this time. She did define an era.

[01:06:28] And I think we're going to find out. Audrey, if it's one of the two things you're saying, like either she played exceptionally long, her wrong had a really beautifully devastating arc. And that was the best it was going to get. And we should have like put the book down there. Or, and then that's why it kept like, that's why the diminishing returns kept happening. Or that was one good part of the story. And then she just played way too much, way, way too quickly. And she could do more, but not off the back of that in quick succession.

[01:06:57] And now getting her many, many years later, I think we will see that. Um, so it is interesting. Some of these people being brought back. Um, when the last real opportunity, they had to be brought back. I mean, for many, it's game changes for Aubrey. She's been in like every returnee opportunity that was available to her. Since she played literally every single one. Yeah. It's true. Yeah. Which is, and I was thinking about it cause we'll talk about Sari. I love that neither of you said Sari was a bad pick because you'd be ejected from the podcast. Cause I have the, you know, technology to do that.

[01:07:28] Sari, as I said, does not fit into this cast. However, it's interesting with Sari because she's played so much. Like firstly, I'll see Sari, you know, on TV every day and I'll be lucky to do it. The, the, the interesting thing is she's played so much other reality TV, but the last time you as survivors saw her was advantage get it. And this is the next real opportunity to bring her back. And they're like, yes, it's kind of like, you know, if she's been like severed out of, out of like a returning fees and into the next opportunity. Like I do get that. And also cause it's Sari,

[01:07:56] but I don't think that she really fits this cast just because she's like, she should be with other Mount Rushmore level players. But she didn't fit game changes either. That was part of the discussion. She was so out of, out of place there. Yeah. It's just, it's so interesting to me that I just thought of it anyway. Sorry. Yeah. She's been everything. No, no, no, no. I think the story thing is interesting because when you think about legendary female players from the past and survivor,

[01:08:24] most of them have gone on to win a season at some point. And she's probably one of the, she's probably one of the few that probably is that same tier. She's like, she's with the, she's with the Sandra. She's with the poverty. She's with these sort of really the Kims Bradlins and everything like that, but she never ended up winning. And so that's why giving her another shot in this situation. I'm, I'm fine with, I'm fine with seeing if there's that, that, that fire still in her tank to see if she can get across the line. And that's why I think she sort of,

[01:08:53] it is weird that there is no other winner from the old, old school that there's, and then there's multiple winners from new school. I think that is really weird, but I would have really liked no winners at all, but I think that's why she could still work in this because she hasn't ended up winning. And that's why she still works for me. Yeah. I mean, I I'm okay with it. We'll talk about like Carl and D like, I'm okay having a new era winners with a Ceri. Like, I think that's a, you know, if anything, Ceri is more legendary than that. I think maybe if it was going to be like one time losers, that's its own thing. But like, if anything, yeah,

[01:09:23] having new era winners, maybe should have been amped up even a little bit more for the level of like first tier, like iconic legendary, and then like ramp it up through the whole thing. Like pick a lane. It's either like winners and Ceres, which is a theme maybe. Um, or kind of like one time second chances. And it's got a bit of both. I just would have, I would have, I don't know. I would have gone in one direction would have been probably what I would have done. Um, you know, She's got a lot of, sorry. She's got a lot of connections there. She's played with Colby. Oh yeah. And Stephanie. Well,

[01:09:56] the Stephanie, the, the, the, sorry, Colby. We went well with Stephanie. It went poorly with Colby. Yeah. And then she's played with Aussie multiple times. Many times. Yeah. Coach was on, uh, Heroes Villains. Yeah. Yeah. So she's got a lot of connections there. And I could see considering the total, the total number of new era people. I could see a lot of those connections just being like, all right, let's just do it. Let's just stick together. Let's,

[01:10:25] let's try and let's try and run this. Um, I think she's got a stuff. I think she's got a soft place to land. Great. But now let's talk about the only thing that matters. Will CBS deny her from doing Australian survivor exit press, because then I'm going to go scream into a pillow. Cause I've been waiting to talk to Sari for a very long time. And I'm a little concerned, but I'm, but my hope for two people who do exit press here for Australian survivor,

[01:10:54] my hope is that she's like, no, I'm Sari. F off. Like I do what I want. I can go on the traders and win it and still come back. That's interesting. I didn't even think of that. You didn't think about it. It wasn't the first thing you thought, Eden. You haven't been wondering. No, no, I don't go. I don't go. I don't go. I don't go to sleep. Cause I've got a baby. You don't have to lie away. Yeah. Nick, you were judging me. I just said, I have so much. I want to say, we'll just pick this conversation up in a couple of months.

[01:11:24] What? Why? Oh, whatever. Anyway, you'd all have the opportunity to interview Sari. I just, all I asked what two years ago was you help me meet Sari. And I asked Australian survivor, you help me meet Sari. And they said, yes. And then she went on this stupid show. And now it might be in question and I'm just not. Anyway, that's Sari. Who else don't I like?

[01:11:54] Um, I think that whole second row is like, I think, I know we've spoken about Aubrey, but like the Chrissy to Rick, like, I think if anyone complains about that, then like, yeah, like on the tier of complaints, like that has to be so low. That is like a good stretch of people. Like Chrissy, Angelina, Mike, you know, Christian, Rick. We haven't even talked about Christian. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Let's talk about this row of people. We'll get into the new era.

[01:12:24] The, the 37 picks knocked it out of the park. I have to say that Mike white again, like an actual pleasant surprise, even though he said, like you said, he would come back. It just didn't feel real. Kind of like Janine on a, you was like, Oh, it's crazy. We got you once. And the fact that his career has evolved even further in the time. So yeah, too much power. He's too close to Jeff. I don't care. Mike white is playing survivor. I saw it in the New York times today. It's wonderful.

[01:12:54] Actually incredible. Like this is Mike, like the, the white Lotus bubble has just exploded since, since he's been on. There isn't anyone that doesn't know about him to get him on the show is such a huge get for this season. And we'll bring in so many more people watching it. And there is a lot of people talking about, Hey, I don't want to, Mike's got a lot of power. I don't want to vote him out. Like it's going to be a really strange dynamic. If people are actually considering, Hey,

[01:13:24] this guy could help my career. This guy could actually do some things for me. Maybe I don't want to vote him out. I don't know. It's just a really weird, like little wrench. So weird. Yeah. We don't, we can't really remember a time like that where people are going to be thinking about someone in that way in this show. It's just, and I'm assuming. Yeah. Yeah. I'm assuming he just made a call and said, yeah, no, I want to be in this season. And they said, yep, cool. That's fine. Yes. We're very lucky to have Mike white. Like this is,

[01:13:53] and I've tweeted about this before. Like when people talk about the white Lotus and I'm like, Mike white was on survivor. Like, I'm like, I'm friends with the show runner. He was on survivor. It's very much attached to my world. And they're like, okay. Like you don't know him. And I'm like, but I do more than you do. Anyway, Mike white also great player, very fun TV presence. He will mind this cast for interesting things. Like you will see a Q type character on the next season of the white Lotus. Like it's just, there's a lot of comedy gold there. It's brilliant.

[01:14:23] Angelina was always going to be a pick. She's a no brainer. She's, she's had two kids since playing. I think what Sari and Jerry are her two daughters. Um, so I think that she, she'll be great. And Christian, like I'm almost most excited for Christian probably. Um, and I think like, it becomes a little bit blase for us because maybe because Christian's like part of the community and on the podcast. And it's like, we forget, no, wait, this is like an all time TV character himself who we all just kind of know now. Um, and we're lucky to, so yeah.

[01:14:52] I think that's like being there. I feel like Mike was not in supposed to be there. And then maybe like last minute joined or something. I don't know. But like, it seems like he wasn't like in the rumors and the, to the very end, I think him being there is bad for Angelina. I think like she, if like, they're going to do the old one, two punch, get rid of her to keep him and get all get rid of Christian, you know, keep him around. Like, as a cameo, I just think in general, I just think in general, she's in trouble because of this for sure.

[01:15:22] I think I can't, I can't see it. I can't, I can't see it. And I'm just going to round out that line with Rick Devins. Now, Rick Devins is someone that was always going to come back. Yeah. As soon as Edge of Extinction happened, everyone was like, when's, when's Rick coming back? And there's a bit of a through line with a lot of these people like Chrissy, Christian, Rick, like these people had their seasons. It didn't work out for them, but they were so huge, such big characters that you just knew that they were in the, they were in the little journal, little asterisk next to the name. These people definitely going to get the call up. Um,

[01:15:53] the fact that I, I think I'm really interested to see how, and I'm pretty high on Rick. I think he's ability to get on with the new, new era plays is going to be really strong. I think he's going to have the ability to basically get on with, with some of these new players and still mine some relationships with some of the old guys. I think he's in a really good position. I don't think people are going to come after him straight away. Um, I'm really liking Rick Devins in this. I think he's fun and he's a big character and he's going to,

[01:16:22] I know he doesn't have the same connections. Like we talk about pre-gaming and stuff like that, but, um, I, yeah, I, I just really, I really liked Rick Devins. Yeah. I did. See, I disagree. I think he's in a lot of trouble. I think he doesn't have those connections. I think that he is seen as Jeff's favorite. And I think that he is in the awkward period where he's not one of the new era people and he's not one of the old school people.

[01:16:47] And he's not that kind of collection of the Mike White little crew of people. I think he's in, I think he's in trouble. And I think he has huge first boot upside. Now I think he's going to get pulled in as a number. I think he's going to be one of these big, bigger groups is going to look at him and be like, yep, let's pull him in. He's going to be on our side and they're going to turn on the other side. Yeah. Well, we'll see how it goes, Nick. I am. I'm down for that. Yeah. Well, we're all high on Devins and that's great because I, Devins gets so much hate.

[01:17:15] The worst part about Devins being on the season is the discourse, which is like absurdly mean to Devins. It's crazy. Like all he did was get a ton of screen time. Like, have you watched Australian survive? I wasn't, you know, comparably like it was fine. Um, he's a lovely guy. I've podcast with him several times. He's yeah. I mean, he's just, he's a really nice guy and people just hate him. And I think he was entertaining in a season that was not good. He had a very interesting story, like coming back from the edge and then also losing to the edge, obviously.

[01:17:45] Um, so he was, he was my first draft pick when we did the draft for who will be on 50. And I feel so good about that. Obviously it panned out and it was inevitable. He was meant to have a little fire token, little shack once upon a time. Like he was definitely going to be on. I think he is a good pick. Um, and I will say we, we, we didn't, we kind of glossed over Chrissy who I think is a good pick as well. If anything, the type of player that Chrissy is, is what I wanted to see more of. I'm like, no, but we've also missed like the Doms and stuff who are like the 31 time players who would have got, if there had been, you know, more all-star opportunities at the time.

[01:18:15] And Chrissy has that. I know she's had breast cancer, I think since playing. Um, so, um, yeah. So like her experience since then, I think will be good. So yes, that row is very good. Um, wait, can I say something about Chrissy? Yes. I thought her season was terrible that I, I binged that because I didn't watch it at the time because I was playing just post playing. And then I binged it and I remember thinking she is so good. She's such good TV and she is going to be lost to the sands of survivor time.

[01:18:45] And I was like, I would have bet if you had showed me this list of people and said, one of these people is fake because the show did not put them on there. I would have actually chosen her because I thought that she was going to get just done. Like, like her archetype always gets done at the final travel council. I thought she was going to get done and lost. And the fact that she's here, I am so, so happy for her. Like I will never like, like, I will never forget watching that spaghetti reward where then

[01:19:15] she then wrestled underneath the flag. Like that does not get enough attention for being an all time moment on the show. Like that is like a, an absolute moment that just got completely swept away with like being a crap season. And like, you know, and a strange cast and a strange theme at a strange time. So, uh, she I'm so happy for her.

[01:19:39] Yeah. I, um, I met Chrissy in Boston and she was lovely at an event where I also met future player, Andy and future player, Charlie at that same event. So we'll see. I mean, there's a lot bigger connections than that in this cast. And I'm sure they've met multiple times since Charlie actually played, but thought that was interesting. So that row is great. Jonathan, we've spoken about were all kind of thumbs down. Well, Eden was actually quite thumbs up. I think, I think Jonathan's a good, I think he's a good. It's fine. We'll save you from yourself. We all didn't like it. He's not going to win.

[01:20:10] He's not going to win. He's simply not going to win. It's true. Emily. I mean, a lot of these picks, like I'm really high on Emily. Um, he's like, she's like a new era Mount Rushmore or thereabouts. Um, so very high on Emily D I know we don't want winners, but we have to famously, we have to talk about the moment where I wanted to break the chizzy by giving her, wait, didn't I try? Yes. Remember? You were a day one Emily stand. Yes, exactly. That was the premiere. What season was she on? 45.

[01:20:39] They all run together for me, but 45. Yes. I did the premiere and I, she had like that absolutely terrible episode. And what did I do? Like wanted to give her three points. And you were so mad at me. You were so mad. You were like, no, Nick, don't do it. You can't do it. Yes. Perfect. Perfect impression that you did. Don't do it. Don't do it. No, Nick, I'll have a bee in my bonnet. That's how I sound when I say things like that. Um, it's true. You won the end. You were much meaner. Yeah. No, I, yes. Hello. Of course. Yeah.

[01:21:08] Obviously when you're doing the impression, you have to add the 20% of meanness that I bring to it on the top. But you hit on Emily from the beginning. You tried to revoke my cheesy awarding privileges moving forward. And I just, yeah. And yeah. So yay for Emily. Well, you're still to this day telling me how to introduce you. So I don't think I get to decide who has cheesy points and who doesn't. I saw a tweet that was like being the, the Genevieve updates account must have been like buying stocks and Apple like way back because that was like when, from when Genevieve was purple,

[01:21:38] which is hilarious considering. The first three episodes. Yeah. But that was Nick with Emily. Like she wasn't purple, but people were hating on her. And Nick was like, nah, like Nick was Nick as a day one, Emily stand on like, look where we've gotten to. Maybe your points were justified. I'm joking. They were dumb. No, no. But didn't she, didn't she, wasn't she, didn't she rag on Bruce? Like. Yeah. She was meant to go home and then Hannah quit. And then he wanted to give her three cheesy points. Yes. Yes. It's not a great start. No, it's not a great start. Thank you.

[01:22:08] Nick saw something. Nick saw something we didn't see. And he saw heavy, heavy plot armor that meant that Emily probably would stick around. Yeah. Anyway, Emily, great pick. D like you guys aren't high on the winners. Like to me, that's like almost the least egregious part of having, I mean, having two winners is weird. I haven't said anything about the winners. I genuinely, like that is the least important part to me. Like, D is great. I think D is the best we've had. And like, we need some high caliber stuff because so put D in here upside.

[01:22:38] She reminds me of Brooke. I would always back her as being good at the game. So yeah, she's, she's great. Eden, you're on your own. What's this? Oh no, I just don't think they should have had any winners. That's all. I think she's great player and she's awesome. She did. She brought it on her season. It's fine. I'm not going to pick her out. They shouldn't have had two winners. They should have had no winners or more winners than two, but two was weird. Especially with the person who won last week. And we'll talk about it. Tiffany, we've picked her up. You know who I loved from her season who should have been given a go if it was a second

[01:23:07] chance season? Keturah. I love it. We've argued about this. Yeah. We have. We've had, I remember we had. We've argued about it on the finale. Wow. We've really argued a lot over the years. Yeah. You guys have a great relationship. One time. People say it's sibling-like, I think. I think. And the thing, but I don't ever fight with my brother. He agrees with all my takes. His takes are good. I'm joking. But he would never give those chizzy points to Emily. I think, yeah, Keturah, we book ended that season by just arguing, I think. We did actually, yeah.

[01:23:37] It's a wonder you want to come back ever. It's a wonder you're here right now. I came for Eden. I came for Eden. That is absolutely true. Like, before we recorded, he specifically said that was true. So he's not lying. Tiffany, we've discussed. Q to me is like, I think I'm almost most excited for Q. Like to me, he's Mount Rushmore, new era. Charlie, I'm high on Charlie. And, oh, Eden's gone.

[01:24:07] He's low on Charlie. Yeah. Eden really hates Charlie. Well, give us a moment to deal with this issue. Okay. We have resolved the issue and we are back with Eden and Nick. I'm high on Charlie. Higher than most. I'm willing to give all the Devon's Charlie hot takes. Let everyone come for me. Um, I thought I loved, you know, the TV that Charlie brought.

[01:24:37] And I definitely think that he is out there right now comparing this to the era's tour and how they basically just like skipped over 1989 in survivor terms pretty much. But I was a big fan of Charlie. I think the story is very much there. I think the casuals, like the whole Maria thing is to me, one of the biggest moments of the new era. It has a lot. It's very memorable. They love Charlie. They put him on on fire. Like they did Devon's. Um, I think it was a inevitable and be actually pretty good. I think he's good TV. I think he's a great player.

[01:25:04] I think the story is like the second chance story. So, so there. Um, and I will say as well for at least jewel Chisley winners in a row, D Charlie, Genevieve and Kyle will be playing, but what do you guys think about Charlie? Cause Charlie is definitely like a hot button topic. I personally didn't. I personally didn't need Charlie, but I think he would be great in a regular returning season, just not 50, but I guess that doesn't matter anymore. So we need to let go of that.

[01:25:33] So I, like I said earlier, I think that I would get along with him in real life and I'm glad I'm super happy for him to think it means a lot to him that he's playing and he gets to play again. So, um, good on him. Uh, yeah, like, yeah, it's time for us to let go of what we thought the season would be and just focus on who we've got. So good on Charlie. He, he, he could do really well at this game. I think he could do really well. Like I, cause I personally don't think he is like, we don't look at him and go like, we don't remember any of the huge sneaky.

[01:26:01] Like we look at like, you know, people who've taken out their best friends and all this kind of stuff, but like, I don't remember that about him. So I would align with him. Well, he, he's the youngest on the cast, I think. So I, that's like my one kind of reservation in a cast that skews a bit older, but I actually think Charlie, like on it being season 50, I mean, he makes more sense than a lot of people here. I think Charlie is one of the biggest names of the new era, whether you like it or not.

[01:26:26] I mean, he's the one chosen for a big, then the, the 46 is a really big season. Q's a very, very big part of that. I think Charlie is from a storytelling perspective as well. I think that moment with Maria not voting for him is massive. And I think Charlie is memorable. It might be memorable as a guy who kept talking about Taylor Swift, but like, it's more memorable than most things. Eden break the tie. No, I don't think I don't think he's not on my Mount Rushmore of new era players. I think not Rushmore. I'm just saying he, he's not.

[01:26:55] Look, he wasn't even my list of, of top new era players when I put it together. So I think the thing with thing that interesting about Charlie's though, he is super connected with all the new era players. He's sort of been, he's in, he goes to all the watch parties. He's very familiar with all the other players from the season. So he could be someone that a lot of them gravitate towards and could be the glue. So in terms of how he's, he's placed, I think that that could actually be work out really well for him.

[01:27:23] Um, again, a little bit surprising that he's, that he's here, but ultimately if you're looking at new era players, if you're looking at 12 of them, then yeah, look, it's, it's fine. I would like to see more from him. I would have loved to have seen him do something else, be a bit more, more memorable. I don't know. He doesn't really, so the Marie thing, can you really target something else that he did in the game? I mean, he was like the major, he won the Chizzy. He was like the major strategist of that season. Like he got the group together to go to the end.

[01:27:52] We're talking about public consciousness. Yeah. That's a really big part of the public consciousness. Not everyone, not everyone follows the Chizzy. Yeah. But like 90, 90 of 95%, I think are. So I think for that subsection of the audience and they're all like, Nick, what are you doing? Believe me. Um, yeah. He just did not, he did not cut through in that season for me at all. At all. I was so in on Kenzie and Q and like, yeah, I, he was, he was a nice guy. That's a tough one for me.

[01:28:22] Well, I think for top 12 for me, he's fine. I don't think we drafted him, but I kind of feel like in hindsight, that was an oversight, not just cause we were clearly wrong, but like in thinking about it, I don't think we drafted. I think that was wrong. Um, Genevieve, I think is a great pick. No. Love it. Yeah. All ticks are also blood. And then Camilla, Joe and Kyle, like it's almost impossible to look at them individually because it's just so insane that they're all here. Um, I would have liked Joe to have a little bit more time, um, to kind of reckon with what happened. And then I would be more interested further down the line.

[01:28:52] Kyle is in the worst possible position. As I've said, Camilla, that's quite fun, but also Camilla, like a week ago was talking about how she lies to everyone and loves lying. Couldn't have, couldn't have been a worse PR stint for the rest of the cast. So that is not great for any of them. I don't think especially all together. And it's really, even though I liked them all individually as people and even as players and maybe even as immediate returners each maybe, and even that's a maybe it's just impossible to have this conversation.

[01:29:20] I think when they're all together, but Eden, what do you think about this? Just Camilla, just have her. That's fine. You're like, I've got to go to bed. I have a newborn Camilla. Just choose Camilla. I don't need the other two. I honestly don't. Back to back will pretty much be back to back seasons for them. Yeah. I don't need Joe. It's going to be the same. I feel like he's going to approach the game the exact same way. I think he's going to have evolved as a player in that time.

[01:29:47] And Kyle, I think, I think he's going to be a really big target as one of the few winners. The more recent winners that people can be like, yeah, cool. Let's get rid of Kyle. I just, yeah. Yeah. And then we don't know the 49 people. And it's frustrating that those names will be out there and that it will color our perception of the season. But we're all just going to have to get past that. Okay, guys, we're just going to all move on. Even if it's really annoying and we're all thinking about it all the time, we're all just going to move on with that.

[01:30:15] So, look, we largely agreed on things, but I think even the discussion points between us, let alone the whole fan base, does show that like favorite picks or good and bad picks is the most subjective part of this. And it's very, very difficult for a casting department because everyone has different perspectives. I think the disjointed aspect of it is quite objective as an issue. And some of the missed opportunities and the snubs speak for themselves at a point where people actually do seem to agree, which is again, rare.

[01:30:40] So I feel like those two things are more set in stone and like pros and cons on the players is more subjective. Although I think we are saying that while all all star casts are definitely going to have like gold there. I mean, again, there's a lot to work with this. This isn't up to the level we would necessarily want given how high the bar is on that. Is that a fair summation of everything? I agree. Yeah. All right. Something we wanted to do was winner picks just straight off the bat.

[01:31:10] Lock it in now. Never change. Yeah. And it's my podcast, Nick. That's what I wanted to do. And that's why we're doing that. I'm going with it. I'm going with it. I have my winner pick and I want to give it first so that I don't look like I'm copying if one of you take it. But still feel free to take it if it is your winner pick. Okay. I'm bouncing. I'm bouncing between a few people. So. No, but don't, but don't let me deter you though. You seek with your gun. Great. Genevieve is my winner pick.

[01:31:35] Um, it's not just because her lovely husband is on Twitter telling me about how he's drinking out of a chizzy mug, which he shouldn't even be allowed to do because he didn't win the chizzy. However, I'm allowing it while she's gone. I just think Genevieve. Like I knew she was a sparkly person from the preseason of 47 and I saw the skills and I think we can see them again. I don't know how much of a threat she'll be compared to like all the 48s next to her as an example. She's by herself there in that cast.

[01:32:05] I'm not sure necessarily what her connections are like, but I just think that she's got the necessary skills and doesn't stand out too much from a threat level perspective compared to like some of the other players. And it's, you know, nine months before the season, but I'm just going to lock it in and I feel good about it. Wow. What do you think? I disagree. I think her threat level is extremely high. It is high. It is high. That's my what, but compared to some other people. Yeah. Extremely high. Yeah. I think it's extremely high.

[01:32:33] Like, I don't think like people are looking like, Oh my God, Jenna Lewis. What a threat. Colby. What a threat. They're not threats. What a threat. Christina. Like there actually, there's like so many people who are not threats. Jonathan. Oh my God. What a threat. Like, Oh, those people aren't going to win. Jonathan can't win. Like Colby. Like I think, and this is, and I just heard, I've just got like 20 minutes left of Rob and Mike breaking it all down and Rob thinks she's going to be a bit like a Kim Spradlin in Winners at War, where it's hard to get her foot in. And then even when she does. Hold on.

[01:33:02] Do you remember, do you remember when we podcasted about the episode? I think it was the episode she got voted out. No, it was earlier on. It was earlier on. And I said that on a second. Oh my God. I said this. Someone roll back the tape. I literally said to you that if she plays again, it is going to be like Kim Spradlin in Winners at War. I literally said that to you. I was sitting in this exact same spot. And I remember. Did you? You heard it here. A hundred percent. A hundred percent. And I was like, and she will struggle to find her feet.

[01:33:32] And like, you know, she'll be so good, but like no one will want to play with her. And she's got all the things to win. But if no one wants to play with you, it doesn't matter how good you are. You will not have a chance to win. And I said that. And well, there you go. I won't be deterred though, because you know what? It just feels right. It felt right before 47. It was also great. It was also great. But I just think like the 47 women have it on lock and Genevieve is great. And I feel good. It makes me feel good as well.

[01:34:01] Like I like rooting for Genevieve. I just, I wanted to be my winner pig. Now don't give me doubt it. Nick, give your pick if it's so much better than mine. No, no, no. I hope. I hope. She's in, she's in, like I said about Aubrey, it's like Aubrey, Genevieve, Angelina. Like they are like the three people I'm like rooting for. And yeah, Emily. They're like the people that I really want to do well. I feel like Christian Mike White Q up there for me. But yeah, if any of those people win, I'd be very happy.

[01:34:30] So, okay. So here's my theory on being, who I think is going to win. But first it's a question to both of you, because I don't know if I've got the stats right. Has someone who has lost at the final tribal council ever come back and won? Eden, we should know this. Um, I've got the opposite. Come back and won. Yeah. So Boston Rob. Boston Rob. Oh yeah.

[01:35:00] Boston Rob. Okay. Good one. So my theory is that the insane number of fun losing finalists in this group. Yeah. We are going to get, we're going to get one of them being the winner. Okay. So I'm bouncing between Charlie, Chrissy. I don't know Joe, so I can't put him in there, but like he's speaking to me as well. So I'm thinking between Charlie and Chrissy.

[01:35:29] Um, I usually would not go for Chrissy because of the archetype who always gets screwed. But in this, in this collection of people with like the age, I'm going to go with Chrissy. Eden, why are you laughing? That's my, that was my winner's pick as well. Oh, but don't let him deter you. That's fine. That's good. No, no, no, no. Eden, you're allowed your own winner's pick. It's very important that you have your own winner's pick. I have different reasons.

[01:35:57] I've different, I've slightly different reasons, but no, continue Nick. That's so funny. I started laughing. That's funny. Okay. Yeah. That was it. No, that was like, I was thinking Charlie because like, he doesn't stand out enough to me. I know that you disagree. So like, I think he has the right amount of savviness for the kind of game, but hasn't stood out as being a kind of person who was, immediately needs to be targeted. Um, I could see him working with all of the people in the bottom two rows and I can

[01:36:26] see him having the reverence that I think Eden, you spoke about before that would make him want to work with the top people. So, uh, yeah, but I think his age and his, oh, it's going to sound so bad. Charlie just sounds so mean, but his forget ability means that I don't think he will take it. And if Chrissy is at the end, I think that this is a group of people who are older or more established, who would recognize what it's like to lose at the final tribal council, maybe

[01:36:56] want to right some of those wrongs, um, and vote for someone who has previously lost. So I'm locking in Chrissy. Charlie, I think is a good pick. I was worried about his age as well. I didn't think about Chrissy from a demographic standpoint, but you are right in that it is a different demographic. I think of all the people who lost at the end, like Charlie very nearly didn't to be fair. Like that's, you know, it's a big decision, but it's like one big decision. Chrissy.

[01:37:22] And again, maybe that speaks to the probably largely to the demographic and maybe things are different now and new era cast were more open to things and actually did respond to how like we viewed men winning in the thirties. But I feel like Chrissy was not close to winning with that cast. Like even if Ben isn't there. And I don't know that we talk about it that often. I don't remember enough about the season personally. I just remember that. I just thought she was insanely good with the right amount of bulldog in her to kind of like, not be a wallflower.

[01:37:52] And, and yeah, I just feel like she has a lot of, like, if you look at this cast, there are a lot of parents. Like that whole first row, bar Aussie, I think are parents. So many tiny Colby's just running around. And then Aubrey's got kids. Angelina's got kids. Rick's got kids. I think Q has kids. Joe has kids. Since he played actually, Q had a kid. Does Genevieve have kids? No, I don't think so. No? Okay. So there's quite a lot of, yeah.

[01:38:19] Quite a lot of parents there, you know, married people. I feel like that's not going to be like the thing that like the young jury might kind of like resent. That's true. Yes. Okay. Sorry, Eden. But Eden, you shouldn't lose your Olympic just because Nick happened to go first. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. It's totally fine. But my thought process was, so Chrissy, obviously I, my recollection of her season was she had that

[01:38:44] season sewn up if it wasn't for a few certain interesting twists that happened along the way in that system that sort of made everything blob. I think her understanding of the game for someone in that, in that demo, I think if she can get through the first couple of tribal councils this season, I think she's really well placed to get really, really deep in the game.

[01:39:09] I think the, I was thinking the parent thing as well, just recently have played a season where I, you just naturally, you gravitate towards other parents, like being a, being a new parent and stuff like that. It was just something that came up naturally. And it was like me and Charles had lots of fun conversations, me and Caroline connected over that. I think that is, and looking at this tribe, I see how that sort of can break down as well. I think she, she's got a good understanding of the new era as well. I think she's one of the older era people that can transition well into this new style.

[01:39:39] I don't think she's stuck in how she originally approached the game. I think she's, she's got enough connection in the community as well. I think it stands, she's in good stead. I'm looking at like a Chrissy, Jenna, both going pretty deep in the game. And, and I think she's got enough reverence for these old people that she wants to keep them around. She loves the Jenners and these, the historical figures.

[01:40:01] Um, but at the same time, she's going to be able to get on with a Charlie or an Emily or a D like I see her getting on with all of those. Like Genevieve, I see you getting on with Tiffany D Emily. I see her connecting with all of those players. So I actually, and, and she's not a big enough threat that people are going to look at her and go, okay. And finally, I think she's not afraid to make moves. I don't think she falls into that loyal loyalty aspect of the game. I think she is totally fine cutting people out.

[01:40:30] Um, and, and, and, and getting the job done to, to get there at the end of the day. So she was right up there for me. I feel weird. Me, Nick having the same pick, but that's, that's who in the, in, when we were talking about, I've got, I feel if she's got to get through those first couple of, um, of tribals though. Hi. I mean, I haven't watched HHH since it aired and I don't plan on watching it again. My memory is like, she wasn't going to win, but it's been like Mandela affected because she was the one that twists like happened to.

[01:40:59] She found the information, like much like Laura and BBB. Well, she got the information because she'd won the challenge. I kind of felt like the thing was that Devon was going to win, but. You think Devon Pinto was going to beat her? I think maybe like, I don't think that the dream was viding it. Um, I don't know, but, but don't cancel me on it because I don't remember that much, but I kind of think that that's how it was happening in my mind. We don't know. It never happened. That's a final three that never happened. Devon's one of those people that got lost along the way. Yeah, he got lost. A hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:41:28] It's Chrissy could have got lost. It's great that she's here. It would be crazy if she wins from it. But I do think from a demographic standpoint, I see how this is like a good cast for that. And I also think if maybe, maybe 35 weren't going to vote for her. And I still do believe that to be true. However, the new era cast, if it's a jury of new era people, like I think they could vote. But I think like Genevieve, Camilla, Emily, they will all get what Chrissy was putting down in a way that maybe the HHH cast were not.

[01:41:54] But so that is that. Yeah, this is that's where we're at. I've given away all my draft thoughts. We have a draft coming up in the next few days for the patrons and it will be released in February. So that's it. This was so fun. Thank you both for your time and missed busyness for the two of you. So thank you for the opportunity, Shannon. And Nick, thank you for us getting to connect like this. So good. So lovely, mate. So lovely. Love it. Love it. Loved every minute of it.

[01:42:23] And that hour and 41 minutes just flew by. Nick, where can people find what you're doing? Still posting this podcast, just like from the shadow. Yeah, just on Instagram at Nick Iodanza. If you want to see me posting about Survivor, the writing life, trying to get this book going. Nearly finished my first draft with this. Yeah. And just general, general life update.

[01:42:53] I'm on Twitter as well. Blue Sky, which I haven't checked in a while. But yeah, Instagram is mainly the one. So yeah, come check me out. Eden, what about you? You've been doing a lot of podcasts. You are the busiest man alive. I don't know how you struggle it all. Just to do in some pods. We just finished recording the new season of Cancelled Movie Report as well. So we've got some great new movies coming out next. That should be out in the next couple of months. Next month maybe.

[01:43:22] So keep an eye out for that. Some of the best movies never made. We do full audio dramas of them and talk through the script. It's very, very fun if you haven't checked it out. That's awesome. Also, yeah, Eden Porter One on Insta or Eden Porter Twitter. And hopefully some of our debrief will be kicking things off again. Obviously, it's had a little bit of a hiatus these last couple of weeks because a child entered the chat.

[01:43:50] So that's the bet. We should be getting back on track by the next big event, Australia versus the world. So that'll be fun. So keep an eye out for that as well. I have a debrief. I got so... No more from Nick. AUV World, yeah, the cast really slaps. Like, really like no notes. Really just crazy because we had an hour 40 of notes today on a cast, to be fair. We haven't even talked about how we don't know how many days it is. And if it's 24 people in 26 days,

[01:44:19] it's going to be a lot of frenetic survivor coming up very, very soon. So that's what's happening. From me, we know global survivor.com. You can still check out my finale recap with Ja. Now you know people are going out too soon when I can still plug the finale recap of three of them from last week. But that was a really good discussion that I really enjoyed just breaking down Kyle's win. It's very relevant. It was a lot of Kyle V. Joe, okay? So if you haven't checked it out, there's a lot in that. And Camilla. So it's all incredibly relevant.

[01:44:49] The draft... Well, we actually just dropped a draft we did July last year, which was who was going to be on 50, aforementioned. That's now like... That was done for patrons and now is for everyone. So you can check that out. And then we're going to do for patrons on Monday, Sydney time, Sunday night, ET. We're going to draft these players. And then that'll come out for everyone else in February before this season. And that's it, I think. So this was great. Thank you guys so much.

[01:45:18] No more beating up on it. We were harsh, but we needed to lay down some hard truths. I think everyone's had a lot of feelings about the cast. We just wanted to like express ours and we did. And it feels good. Yeah. So... Onward to AUV world. Woo! Yeah. And also, you know, we hope that it's a great season and we're here for all of the positive parts in this compliment sandwich. You might need to like try fish out some of the bread, but it was there. So a lot of positive stuff.

[01:45:46] I wanted to say as well, like, is Christian too much of a threat to be a winner? Yeah. Yeah, I think so. Is he? I don't want that to be true. I like that he has Mike White with him. Like hopefully that'll help him. Like rooting on Christian. Mike White just straight up tells everyone, if you vote me or Christian on a gel off, you're not getting on white Lotus. Yeah, exactly. I feel like he should be using that. It's a great threat to have. He's in so much trouble. Yeah. If he makes it far off, he's very surprised.

[01:46:15] Well, he doesn't have to say it like, you don't have to say like the choir part loud, but he can definitely be like, you know, what rhymes with flotus or potus? You're not getting on the white Lotus. Okay. I'm very excited to have some of these players back as much as it might not sound like it. We are getting Mike freaking white back on the show. So a lot of good stuff. Thank you all so much for listening. Thank you to Eden and Nick. Thanks to our team behind the scenes. And I will see you next time. Bye. Bye.

[01:46:44] Bye.