Kaôh F***ing Rong Rewatch Ep 5

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[00:02:25] Learn more at AmericanExpress.com slash business dash platinum. Hey everybody, what's going on? Rob Cesternino back to talk about, it's the swap of co-effing wrong and we're here to talk about these new tribes here with Chappelle. Chappelle, how are you? Rob, it's the swap. Yeah.

[00:02:57] That's a slop, right? Oh yeah, the slop, slop, slop, slop. You know, I got my- The Jacob Jones callback. Yeah, yeah. Rob, I'm in a good mood. I'm in a good mood. Every time I'm talking about Kaoh Rong, I'm very happy talking about Kaoh Rong. So yeah. But this was a fun episode. We got the swap. There's a lot that I didn't remember from this episode, from this swap episode where one person is going to go to Exile Island, that is going to be Julia, and it's going

[00:03:25] to really shape the way that the vote ends up going. And some fun dynamics going on that I can't wait to talk to you about. How are you doing? I'm good, Rob. Yeah. The most surprising thing about this episode to me was that Peter Baggenstocks is still here. He's still here. I did not realize this. Did this man make the merge? Like, he's different. Close. Almost. He's right there. How did he keep getting away with this? I think they needed him because we saw him being Dr. Peter earlier on in the episode

[00:03:54] and there's injuries in the season I don't even remember. When I saw Joe's finger kind of doing the thing and he's like, yeah, I had to lance it and all this. I was like, this is why you get medevaced? And I was like, no, no, he had a stomach ache or something like that. I had to remind myself. This was a different injury. Yeah. What about Ty's like huge gash on his leg from when he was climbing the tree? He tries to show it to Jeff. Jeff's like, ah, sorry. He's like, no, I have a very bad infection. This is very serious.

[00:04:24] Like, ah, we don't need to see it. And Julia Sokolowski's on Exile like, I'm dehydrated. I'm dying. Just two episodes ago, Jeff's like, and remember, keep hydrated. Stay hydrated. Yeah. Tough season. Tough season. The production is not making it easy at all for them, despite so many red flags that say you should probably step in and maybe just make sure these people aren't dying. No, no, but it's a hard season. It is okay.

[00:04:53] It's the hardest season for no reason, actually. It's not like they made it hard because, oh, maybe the previous season was a little, you know, oh, it wasn't hard enough. Like, it wasn't like that was the gimmick of the season going in. Like, this will be the hardest season of Survivor. I hope y'all are ready. No, this is just a regular ass season of Survivor that happened to be ridiculously hard and production just let it cook. Let it cook. That's what they did to them. Yeah. They did. Yeah. They don't need no more heat, baby. Yeah, they cooked them.

[00:05:20] Anyway, also cooked in this episode, Anikate. Quiet exit for Anikate. Quiet exit for Anikate. Well, you know, that's the thing about Anikate. Famously a great sport, gracious loser. Things don't go her way. She's just like, okay, I'll get him next time. Yeah. Or something like that. Yeah. She, uh, she's swap screwed here, which is a tough break, right? Like I think when people think about going out on Survivor, they don't think about the

[00:05:47] situation where they're put in where it's just like, so the numbers don't work for you. Now, what are you going to do? And there's really no option except throw your ally under the bus and hope it ain't you. In hindsight, we watched these five episodes. She was actually halfway decent at Survivor. I mean, she really did not do much wrong. The brain strap, I mean, the beauty trap was pretty, uh, like cut and dry. It was three guys, three girls. And then she tried to bring over a guy to work out with, uh, to work out with the girls. She did that with Ty. It seems like he had a pretty decent relationship with her.

[00:06:17] At least he talks very highly of her. So, I mean, if you want to give her Julia, Michelle, like credit for being able to get, get Ty to kind of leave the, the mail jar and that side to come over with them. Yeah. And it probably doesn't, it doesn't hurt that Caleb gets, uh, medevaced as well because, you know, Ty did have, you know, uh, Caleb and Nick at one point, if it was divided by gender. But with Caleb going out, yeah, she, she did solid. I mean, what else could you ask for?

[00:06:44] You know, one of the things that I think that also hurts her in this season ends up being the super idol because we see where Ty reveals that he has the idol and he shows it to Scott Pollard. And Ty is willing to, that they, that somehow Peter Bagenstaz has pissed off Ty. Ty does not like him. He doesn't, he's not a nice guy like Scott. Okay. Where I don't want to be around Peter. He's mean.

[00:07:10] And so that Ty is willing to play the idol for Anna Kate, but Scott knows there's a super idol and Scott really talks Ty out of playing the super idol or the other idol for Anna Kate so that it can be used as a super idol later, which ultimately Ty does not use on Scott. Well, how do you feel about that? That Ty was willing to let Anna Kate go right here? Because I don't know how I feel about the decision.

[00:07:41] I mean, Ty gets to the end. Ty is going to make friends really wherever he goes. So I think it ends up being okay. I think it was kind of a waste to use the idol on Anna. So I thought about it, but if they use the idol on Anna at this point, right, Julia comes back and they have the numbers at that point to kind of just run the game to the merge. Ty gets to the end, but he has no chance of winning.

[00:08:03] And so, you know, maybe there is an alternate route where he keeps some of his allies along and he doesn't get in bed with Scott and Jason because that's going to be to me. That's part of the reason why he doesn't get any votes. You know, Ty is like, I want to hang out with the cool people, with the nice people. They're really friendly and I love them. And then he's like, hey, you're not nice. I don't love you anymore. Get out of here. And he jumps over to these guys. He's like, they're nice. It's like, oh, they're mean. Ty, now you're being mean. He's like, well, I got to get rid of them too.

[00:08:29] I think he's a little flip floppy after the merge. And maybe if he kept his numbers strong here, he could have been a part of like a dominant alliance and then maybe one out. Okay. So you say that he should use the idol. He should save Anna Kate. I don't know because, you know, again, using your idol on somebody is so it's so early in the game, right? It's so early, but they would have such a commanding lead over the other tribes if they brought in Julia right here. Like it would just be a no brainer. They could lose the next challenge. They'd be fine.

[00:08:58] Maybe he could have just saved Scott. Yeah. Could he just like save Scott? I mean, we could talk about that when we get there, but that is interesting. You know, Scott Pollard, I thought was really an interesting player in this episode. I don't know if he got the fishy, but I was listening to the know-it-alls and Stephen was also high on Scott Pollard. I think this is Scott Pollard's best episode of the season so far. He's an interesting person.

[00:09:28] You know, I couldn't help but think as he was in the challenge, he's partnered up with Aubrey and him and Aubrey kind of have a pretty good relationship that they end up on the same swap tribe. And I was thinking like, wow, I see this giant man running through the water. And I was like, wow, this is like proto Jonathan. Yeah, a little bit, a little bit. But Jonathan doesn't really have a partner in crime like Scott does.

[00:09:54] Scott linking up with Jason. I think the two of them become bigger than the sum of their parts or whatever the saying is. Yeah, more of that or maybe it's less than the sum of the parts because that when they're separated, we said we said this the other day about how either of them on their own like are fine. It's the two of them together. That's that's a problem. Yeah, movement by themselves forced when they're together and when they're together, it is bad. Right. And like they're able to kind of like feed off of each other.

[00:10:24] It probably didn't help that they were together in Ponderosa. Who knows how they would vote if they were separate? I even think after Scott gets voted out, I think that Jason kind of has a so I could be misremembering this, but I think that he kind of has like a social game after Scott gets voted out. He definitely gets a more sympathetic edit. So I know I remember this much that we start to hear more about his daughter and, you know, kind of him being the family man. And I think that is very much overshadowed by him and Scott being Beavis and Butthead.

[00:10:52] Yeah, but we have this funny bromance with Scott and Ty. That's Ty's superpower. OK, if I don't romance. Yeah, I can't trust you. Ty don't like you. I don't trust you. So, yeah, Scott comes in. He's just like, oh, my God, look at Ty. So I could just toss him up a tree. And Ty's like, he's got size 18 feet. This man is crazy big, man. And so, yeah, they linked up immediately. Yeah, he like picks Ty up and puts him in a tree so you can go get the mangoes.

[00:11:20] Yeah. See, this is what teamwork is. Where are you at, Alicia? See, this why couldn't you just let Scott just toss you up? Really? Just let him pick you up. That's all I wanted to do. She doesn't weigh that much more than Ty. Does she weigh more than Ty? They might be the same weight at best. But you're right. This is all he wanted, which is a little sidekick he can just like walk around with, like a little like mini me type figure. Yeah. Yeah. So it's very fun to see Ty and Scott Pollard together.

[00:11:48] Do you do you think Ty and Scott bond if it's Jason there with him as well? Right. Like is Ty just he needs like like Scott just needs a number two or if Jason is there, are they like still pulling in Ty as their third? I feel like he makes this bond because he doesn't have a Jason. Not necessarily. Right. So yeah, I think it probably becomes like third wheel type of energy when Jason ends up coming back. I want it to be like a two Christmases situation, right?

[00:12:15] Where so like Jason comes back and Ty's there and Ty's like, hey, Scott, best friend. He's like, you know, Jason's here. What are you doing? He's like, hey, man, who's your new guy? Oh, nobody. He's nobody. You don't have to worry about him. I would love to see a dynamic like that, but that's not what we get. It's not what we get, but we'll see them all get together in a couple of weeks. So let's talk about the two different tribes for people who did not just watch the episode where the two tribes end up being.

[00:12:41] The tribe that we spend the most time with is the new beauty tribe, the new yellow tribe, right? Where it's we have it's three, two and one. It's three brains where Aubrey, Joe and Peter go. Then we also have Anna and Ty. And then we have Scott Pollard.

[00:13:04] And the wrinkle here is, which is an interesting one, that Julia Sokolowski goes to Exile Island and that the person who gets voted out, then we will have they will be replaced by the person who went to Exile Island. Right, right. And so this makes no sense to keep a beauty around because by bringing in a beauty, then Ty and Anna will then have three. Peter would be gone at that point. And then it would be Aubrey and Joe and Scott with Ty and Anna right there, I'm assuming.

[00:13:34] Because it does feel like Aubrey and Joe are like, do we really need Peter? You know, he's here, but is he really a brain? There's some interesting things going on there, though, where that we see for the first time that Joe and Aubrey kind of have a relationship. And they're going to be close allies through the rest of the game. And we didn't really see them interact too much on the original brains tribe, but they're here. And then also Peter is the third brain and they're barely tolerating him still. Because Peter thinks he's in charge.

[00:14:04] Peter's still dictating the rules. He's still talking about the plan in front of everything. This man has learned nothing from being blindsided at all and being on the bottom for two votes. Because I think there's even a moment where, I mean, the thing that he does that pisses off Ty is where he's like, yeah, so obviously we're voting out of beauty this time because it makes sense for the numbers. Ty's like, I don't want to hear that. Nobody wants to hear you telling us the pecking order. That's really what pissed off Ty. He just came out and flat-toed it. Like, I heard it's one of you two who's getting voted out tonight.

[00:14:32] Yeah, and Ty's like, who told you that? And who left you in charge? And so, you know, everybody's kind of going to Aubrey and Joey and like, can you believe this guy? Y'all like him? And Aubrey's like, no, we don't like him. So we're trying to figure out what to do with him. But it wouldn't make sense to vote out Peter here just so Julia can come in. And then Ty, Anna, and Julia can make all the decisions for the tribe at that point. At that point, Aubrey and Joe are at the bottom. And they're just going to take Scott and just eliminate both the brains. So there's no point in eating each other right now.

[00:15:02] It really seems like that Joe and Peter really don't get along. I think Aubrey tolerates Peter. Because we see some moments where Aubrey, Peter, and Scott are in the shelter together. I don't know if Aubrey tolerates Peter. Because I think she was the loudest detractor last, what was it, the last episode? Where she's like, can we just vote him out now? Because I think that's when he was telling her what was the plan. She said he had no EQ. Yeah, and Aubrey does not like to be told the plan. Okay? She needs to be in on it. She's a brain too, you know?

[00:15:30] And so yeah, Peter is just like, I think he thinks he's fine. He's like, it's just us, the three best brains. And they're like, yeah, I can't wait to vote you out. Yeah. But they know they need to get rid of one of the beauties. That's the only thing that's working in Peter's favor. Yeah, it's a no-brainer. And the problem is Peter is talking about it like it's a no-brainer. And nobody wants to hear his opinion about this. You just keep it to yourself. Vote on a beauty and just try to be likable. If you're voting out a beauty, you should be at least trying to make yourself the most likable brain amongst the brains, right?

[00:16:00] Because obviously the beauties are not going to take this kindly. They're going to try to strike back at one point. Why don't you make it Aubrey and Joe that they're after? No, he decides to put a big old bullseye on himself. Yeah, he doesn't even consider flipping on the brains. No. He's like, nope, everything's fine. Everything's fine. I was like, Peter, you're at the bottom. What's the worst that could happen here? Just go. What? You flip right now. Let's say he goes with Ty, Anna, and Sky. He's like, okay, who do you want? Aubrey or Joe? I'm sure they'd go with it. They'd be like, all right, fine. You know? But instead he's like, well, so it's one of y'all.

[00:16:29] I mean, because Ty and Scott are close. Maybe Scott Pollard is really anti having another beauty come in for some reason. But if it's like, hey, let's get rid of Aubrey. Let's get rid of Joe. I don't know why they wouldn't do that. I think it's Peter. I think he's a problem. I think once he starts talking about how, oh, okay. Because he starts off the episode basically saying, I don't have to do anything and I can make the merge.

[00:16:55] It's the brains to the end and we'll be fine because we're going to kick off the beauty and then we'll just kick out everybody else and everything will be fine. It's like, no, Peter, you're at the bottom. These brains, you don't need to be with them. You need to be looking at other, like greener pastures. But the problem is that he pisses off Ty and everybody so quickly just being so arrogant about his position in the game that I don't think it ever crosses his mind to be like, so what if we did a thing? You know, like go to Scott and be like, I'm kind of a brawn.

[00:17:24] You know, like, don't you think I'm kind of brawn? Go to Anna. It's like, I'm beautiful on the inside and outside too. You know, like, I don't know. We have nice smiles. We have nice smiles. He was just talking about how nice his smile was. I'm just saying, use what you got, sir. Do you think that Anna maybe screwed this up from the start by throwing Ty under the bus where if they were like, hey, we're a duo, we're a united front, then maybe you have to work with that as opposed to, okay, so which one of them do we want to get rid of?

[00:17:54] I don't know, Rob, because I read The Tribe and I have spoken and I'm pretty sure like there's some sage wisdom in there about throwing your ally under the bus and being swapped screwed. Isn't that a thing? You're swapped screwed. Yeah. Yeah. I was trying to think it through. I guess they don't know necessarily that there's a fracture among the brains. Right. Right. But I think if you just pay attention, then you could see it. Right. I find it hard to believe that Joe and Aubrey are really faking this friendship with Peter Well. I don't think Joe fakes it. Right. Exactly.

[00:18:23] And honestly, I don't think Aubrey does either. She does not seem like the type. Aubrey, not the Aubrey I know. You know, you got to be able to catch an eye roll or something like a deep sigh. There's something there that should tell you maybe we got a little room to play. But you're right. Anna, if anything, she kind of says in her final words, maybe she played too hard, too fast. And I think that's the thing, too. She does come off threatening. You know, Peter is talking about how she's got brains, but she's beautiful, but she's also a gamer.

[00:18:53] Well, they shouldn't know you're a gamer. You just met them. You know? So maybe that's what it is. She's not able to manage her threat level. And so it's just so painfully obvious that it needs to be her. Yeah. And she was throwing Ty under the bus pretty hard. She was, which makes her like, obviously, it shows that she wants to survive, which also goes to say that, okay, then that means she's playing hard. I did like her laying down confessional. I love when Survivor does these weird ass confessional spots. She's laying down talking about how strategic she is. It's like, get up.

[00:19:21] You know, like what producer laid next to her with the camera? They're not doing that anymore. That's not, that is not in the new era. We're not, we're not trying. It's not a show about, hey, there are some attractive people on television. We're not, we're not really talking about that anymore. But I always liked the weird confessional spots. Even like, I think about you sitting next to that log all hungover, you know, or drunk, you know, like that. It's just like, why are you down there? And the producers just went with it. Yeah.

[00:19:51] I wonder if it's in the 26 day game. We got to get all these confessionals quick. We don't have time to frame them. I've never really been a person who cared about the game being longer, but it is annoying that you take off all little cool nuances just because we limit the days. And so now you're going to have to go. We got to go. We're losing daylight. We got to go. We got to go. Yeah. We got to move. Yeah. We got to move. Yeah. Ka-ching, ka-ching.

[00:20:18] Yeah, we had an all time Debbie quote in this episode where she said, ding, ka-ching, ka-ching. Oh yeah, here it is. Ding, ka-ching, ka-ching. She's really been on one the last couple of episodes. She's so good. From the very first minute of the show that we see Debbie, where she's talking about all her occupations, but also how puzzles lay down for her lovers. They did tonight. They did tonight. The fish lay right on down. Mm-hmm.

[00:20:48] Yeah. The puzzles lay down for me like lovers. The puzzles isn't even the most interesting part of that factoid we got from Debbie. Yeah. Debbie's got a lot of lovers out here, man. A lot of lovers. Yeah. She's a lover, not a fighter. Maybe a fighter. She told Sydney, I was ripped two weeks ago. You know? So Debbie's all things. She can be everything. I was talking to Steven about Debbie on the Know-It-Alls. And we were talking about like, what an all-time legend.

[00:21:16] And, you know, Debbie is going to play so many more times. She's going to, like, she was a juggernaut at this point in Survivor history. Do you think she loses any of that magic in Game Changers? Yes. Or is she still a juggernaut and we just never go back to returning players? You know what? That, I wonder if there was a world where maybe you could have seen a Debbie 3.0, that she goes back to back.

[00:21:44] And I think that the second time she is certainly not the same. There's not a, like, a joy outside, like when Cochran shows up. Maybe in the very beginning of Game Changers. But I don't know if that was a turnoff for production or if that there was just an overall that, you know, a fatigue of Debbie. But it does feel like that you could have maybe seen her again.

[00:22:13] Could you squint and see Debbie on Survivor 50? You're going to bring her back with Aubrey? They're going to play three times together? Yeah, why not? They're not friends. Yeah. Who's out? Chrissy? Jenna Lewis. I think that Jenna Lewis, at least you get some scope of going back to the, you know, I hate to lose Jenna Lewis. I only kicked her out because of the way the show went for her, right? With her being the first boot.

[00:22:41] I'm saying, like, had you swapped out Debbie into that spot instead, Debbie's probably not the first boot, which is really crazy to say considering how big of a personality she is. She does a really good job of corralling numbers. We see it in this episode. We saw it on the brains, you know, 1.0. And then she's, if I'm not mistaken, she's in the majority for Game Changers as well. So I don't know if Debbie comes in and gets booted out so easily. If anything, I should probably be concerned about Aubrey at that point. Mm-hmm.

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[00:28:53] Okay, should we talk about the Debbie Tribe? Because the Debbie Tribe is also interesting. It's 2v2v2, where just like the original Brains Tribe, which is, I think, also the Blue Tribe, this beach, they love having 2v2v2. And so, you have here, it's Debbie and Neil versus Nick and Michelle versus Jason and Sydney. Yeah,

[00:29:23] and this is fun, right? Because it's deadlocked. And so, you have to see basically who's going to fold first, where these alliances are going to go. But, even though it's deadlocked on this tribe, there's still other things to consider. The Brawn Tribe doesn't exist, right? They're in the intentional map seeing spot. So, everybody wants to pick them up to take the numbers away from the other group, right? So, this is really Brains versus Beauty and whoever can get the Brawns on their side. Debbie's working overtime. She goes to Sydney

[00:29:53] and it seems like she immediately gets Sydney together, which brings her in with Jason and Neil. So, that's a core four. But if I'm not mistaken, that four is questionable? Because I don't think that's where we land at the end of the episode. Did the mayo jar ever link up with Jason as well? I think he's in the swing spot, right? Yeah, I think ultimately Jason got pitched on an alliance with the beauties from the mayo jar and then we saw that Sydney got pitched on an alliance with the brains.

[00:30:23] We didn't really see, maybe this is where Michelle is really pissing off Neil. This is like the, where, where he's learning that she's just a puppy. On the teat. Suckling. Yeah. We never, because this group doesn't go to tribal council next week either. We don't know how it would have went. I do think though that the logic that was, hey, Julia is going to come in and replace a, a, one of the beauty tribe members,

[00:30:52] I think might have, like, we might have lost Michelle if we end up going to this tribal council. Like, talk about like butterfly effect. if, if this try, if this puzzle goes the other way, if Anna, Kate, and Peter are able to put together the puzzle over Debbie and Neil, I think it's probably Michelle who goes home. I think it's like, okay, well, let's take out, we lost one beauty woman instead of Anna. I think we lose Michelle

[00:31:22] because it's like, oh, we're not going to let there be Michelle and Julia and Nick beyond this tribe. That's true. I mean, it's tough. Michelle does have a crazy social game, so maybe somehow she's able to outflank Nick there, but I would say that, yeah, she's probably most likely to go in this spot if something does go wrong. But, you know, this was the first episode we've heard from Michelle in a couple episodes. She had nothing to do with anything going on in the game, but this, I think this is where the edgy people start to perk up a little bit

[00:31:52] because Michelle was telling us about how bad the swap was for her and she told us again about how the swap was for her, but we never see Michelle talk to anybody or do anything about it. We see like Sydney and Debbie, we see Nick and Jason, but we never see Michelle go to anybody and say, here's what I'm thinking. And so, I think this is where the edgy people were like, ha ha ha, there's our winner because we definitely got how Michelle sees it in this episode. Yeah, I missed it in the real time. I might have missed it tonight also. What,

[00:32:21] her two confessionals? Yes. Yeah, and they were two confessional about the exact same thing. It was, hey, I got swap screwed basically, this sucks. Then they go back to, they go to the tribe and then she goes, damn, this sucks, I got swap screwed. And then the next time we hear Michelle mention, it's Nick talking about how he can manipulate her. So we never see Michelle's like actual actions, but we do hear from her and I think it starts right here because these last two episodes, she has been silent. And so, if they didn't give her any content in this episode, yeah, it would have been very weird

[00:32:51] for her to be the winner of the season. I do think that she would have been in trouble from this tribe if they went to tribal council because we know by the next episode, Debbie has a crush on Nick. I think that Jason is going to have a lot of sway in terms of also that we saw him bonding with Nick. I'm not sure that Neil is going to really want to, you know, vouch for Michelle here over the mayo jar if it comes down to which beauty goes home. No, they're probably thinking let's keep the tribe strong and Nick's a big guy. Yeah, you know, it'd be really hard

[00:33:21] for Michelle to kind of pitch her case here. I'm not going to count her out because I've seen her do some amazing things across several reality shows at this point. But, it does look like if I had to bet against somebody in this spot, yeah, that puzzle goes the wrong way. I'm thinking Michelle might be gone. Yeah. But it's crazy because the brains tribe, they had their two brains here on Neil and Debbie kind of like on the puzzle. I thought, that's cool, bet. Then I look at the other tribe and they got Anna Kate on the puzzle. I was like, was Aubrey busy?

[00:33:51] You know, I just feel like if you're labeled a brain, use it. Yeah. Maybe Anna Kate was like, hey, I gotta save my life here in the game. Maybe. And then Aubrey's, Aubrey's a decently physical player when it comes to the challenges as well. So maybe they thought she would be better served at different parts of the challenge. But I just thought it was weird that I was like, okay, clearly you put your brains on the puzzle and they did not. I don't normally spend too much time talking about the challenges, but this is a challenge. I feel like we haven't seen this in a while. I'd have to look on the wiki

[00:34:20] to see if we've even had this challenge in the new era. But even the challenge felt very fresh compared to the types of challenges that we have in the pre-merge in the new era. Right? Even go out, get the fish, carry them back, do the fish puzzle felt different than the types of relay race obstacle course that we get in the new era. Yeah, the new era is very much run, duck under the cargo net, into the mud,

[00:34:50] over the wall, over the little A wall or whatever. Then you walk across a balance beam carrying something. Then you toss the sandbags at whatever you gotta knock down. Yeah. And then you go and then you do the puzzle at that point. I could design these challenges. No, respect to Matt Van Wagner. But I could just storyboard the challenges. I can't design them. But I definitely could kind of, you can kind of foresee where Survivor is going in the new era every time. Where these challenges of all, I think,

[00:35:20] have been very different. You know, sometimes they're in the sand, dying from dehydration. Sometimes they're in the water. They keep switching it up. So this challenge was done exactly three times in Survivor history. Korong, Game Changers, and Winners at War. And then retired after season 40. Like so many other things did too, you know. But I will say this, Korong really does feel like seeds of the new era because we got, we got the answer

[00:35:50] to my question about that third, that third super idol. Yes. And it's feeling very amulet, you know, shared secret type of vibe, right? Whereas like in the new era we will see, okay, if one of you has a thing, it means this. If two of you have a thing, it means this. If three of you have a thing, it's even more powerful. You should vote each other out. This is kind of similar. I don't know why this isn't the idol rule for all seasons. That it played to great effect

[00:36:18] here in Survivor Korong. And ultimately that the rule is that there's these three hidden immunity idols and if you put any two together it becomes a super idol that can be played after the vote. To me, I feel like that this makes sense of that you could have this in every season. And we were trying to remember, we didn't remember Neil's idol until we remembered that he left with an idol. And then we got this moment. I always feel like that like the timing is always like, it's like classic Survivor

[00:36:48] of like before the tribe swap in episode five. The other idol gets found right before we go to the tribe swap. Sometimes you get it with the merge like with Hunter in season 46. Malcolm and Denise find an idol like this in Survivor Philippines. Like right before we're about to swap. Thank God we found the idol. Yeah. I think it's the idea that okay, look, there's no point in faking it. Y'all know we about to swap. We about to look for the idol. Just all hands on deck until we find it. It doesn't look like

[00:37:17] a scramble, but I feel like it's probably the energy behind it, right? If you gotta live there then you have to pretend to go get firewood and all this kind of stuff. We know we swapping. I'm not pretending no more. Let me just go find it. Sometimes also I think it's like okay, maybe Neil found the idol on day seven. Two days ago. And you're just seeing it now. We need to explain that Neil has an idol. I think a lot of that is probably true as well. But yeah, Neil found the idol here really did give me flashes of the new era because I thought about like you were saying, what if the idols,

[00:37:47] the idol mechanism, the rule just in general is if you have more than one of them, it's more powerful. That makes total sense as opposed to, you know, if you have one, it's this. But if you have two, it's this. And if you have three, it's like just make it, keep it simple, stupid. You know, let's just kind of like make it a blanket rule. And then you get to season 50 and it's almost impossible to have two idols because we say, okay, no, you got to get the idol and then give it to somebody else. And then they can't transfer. Yeah. And then they can't transfer to play it for nobody else. It's like, where's the fun in that? This was fun.

[00:38:17] Yeah. So there was a couple of wild things that got said in this episode. Neil said that Peter is a cancer on the tribe. Wild thing to say, especially about a surgeon. Yeah. Like his cancer is actually his arch nemesis, sir. How dare you? Yeah. Peter had a quote also. He was talking about tribal council. He was getting ready for tribal council. He said, tribal council is like the prom.

[00:38:48] And he said, what did he say? That, you know, everybody's going to get to feel something by the end of the night. Is that what he said? I thought that's what he said, but I wasn't quite sure where he was going with that. I didn't write down the last part of the quote. I thought I would remember it, but I did not. No, I have nothing to add to that. It sounds like he had a more eventful prom than I did. Yeah. I'm trying to see. Let me see if I can look at tribal council, prom, if I could find my notes

[00:39:17] from the, from, oh, you know, I didn't do, oh, here are my notes from March 16th, 2016. Archives. Yeah. I wrote a lot of, I wrote a lot of notes to myself in my Gmail drafts and then I sent them to me. So here are my notes from that night. Why am I taking notes when we're watching this? I just pull up my notes from the original night. So, yes. That's true. Yes. Tribal council is like the prom.

[00:39:46] I want to see how it plays out. Okay. That's what, that's what he says. I didn't include the part, the part about everybody feels something. We want to see how it plays out regardless. Yeah. Okay. So that's, I was trying to see if there's anything else interesting from my notes. Yeah. I would love to know any hot takes that you had back then that are like absurd now. I just write what happened. I don't really write my takes in my notes. Yeah. It's like stream of consciousness. Yeah. You just need to be, you just need to remind yourself

[00:40:16] of what was going on and then you can make your commentary from there. Yep. So Michelle also went onto the wrong mat. Yeah. Cause a muscle memory, right? Yeah. Yep. So that was a funny moment in the episode. What do you think about the tribal council where ultimately Ty is denying he had the immunity idol at tribal council? He is.

[00:40:45] And this plays right into Scott's idea, right? Cause Scott knows that there's only a few witnesses out here that know that Ty has his idol. One of the people is the late Anna Kate and because she, she knows, so he has to get rid of her so that he can have Ty and his, and that idol all to himself and obviously to Jason as well, because they share the idol. Who, who's it in possession of? Is it Scott's idol or is it Jason's idol? Jason's idol, right? Yes. All right, cool. They'll Rochambeau about that later on as well. But yeah, I think in this moment,

[00:41:15] Ty's saying that, but it's mostly theater. This is Scott knowing that Ty has it and if he wanted him to use it, they probably would be using it tonight. But he talked him out of it. He's going to try to use it later on. It's going to give us a good TV moment. So I'm very excited that he didn't play it. Is there anything that Anna could have done to blow up Ty's spot or does she just assume that Ty is playing the idol for her at this tribal council? I think she's, I think she's got the fake plan, right? I think the fake plan is that he's playing the idol for her. He doesn't know, she doesn't know that Scott has gone behind her back

[00:41:44] and like kind of like undercut her to cut her out of this deal. Could she go to Aubrey, Joe, and Peter and be like, Scott, Ty has an idol and if we vote him out now, we can get rid of the idol. But I think that's what she tries, honestly. I think that's, I mean, I don't know if she ever explicitly says he has an idol but they definitely show her alluding to him potentially having one. Well, in the beginning of the episode, he's definitely telling them that she's definitely telling them that he has the idol but then he says he's going to play it on her and she's like,

[00:42:14] I love this guy. What are you talking about? She kind of like let it go. Right, but she probably shouldn't have. Maybe she should just lean in and just be like, yeah, I love this guy. Play your idol for me a thousand percent. Play your idol for me. He plays it for her. It's like, look y'all, we can get him, you know, or even, even, you know, slimier. Ty, let me hold your idol in case they try to vote you out, you know, and then go to Aubrey and Peter and them and be like, look, he's dead to rights. I have his idol and I'm going to play it,

[00:42:52] pick. It sounds about right. Yeah. I also kind of remember, did she come to Run It Up Reno? She did. She was, as a poker person, she came to Run It Up Reno in season, after season 32, it was before people were leaving for Survivor Game Changers and I did have the opportunity to spend, I spent some time with her then. she definitely,

[00:43:22] she had some wacky takes about things. Anna Kate did? She did. She did. Damn. I could not have seen that. She has some interesting takes about things, but she also, like, this is, so, this is, let me see, like, we're trying to have a mature conversation here. Sure. to say that you, just for the audience,

[00:43:52] okay, she was somebody who, I believe, did visit the Capitol on January 6th, but, that I believe at this time in Survivor, that Donald Trump was not even the president the first time, that it was not even, he was not even the Republican nominee for president at this particular time. is that you have to, like, hold these things in your hands, in,

[00:44:22] like, this is, this is the past, these other things that haven't happened yet, but she was there, and she was a quirky character. She had told Tyson and myself and Boston Rob about how she really thought we needed to buy gold. Gold is going to be the currency that they, you know, that you needed to do that. she really was very much saying we needed to not stay away from the tap water

[00:44:51] was something that she was talking about. Okay, yeah, I don't know. She was passionate. She had, she said, look, I have hot takes. You know what? Honestly, I believe that. I believe that this is a very passionate woman about the things that she believes in. I think she's all in on whatever she believes at the moment, you know, and so I'm not shocked to hear any of that stuff, especially that

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[00:47:21] fridge now. How about a creamy mocha frappuccino drink? Or a sweet vanilla? Smooth caramel maybe? Or a white chocolate mocha? Whichever you choose, delicious coffee awaits. Find Starbucks frappuccino drinks wherever you buy your groceries. So, another winner pick down. But I honestly feel like she played a good game. There wasn't anything she could do. She got swept screwed. Now, is the evolution of the game, let's say we take some vibes from season 50 and put it into Kaoh Rong.

[00:47:50] What if we had Julia Sokolowski as the power broker? And now she can go between both sides. Are both tribes voting somebody out? Sure, whatever. We're going to double tribal council. Yeah, whatever. Fine. So let's just play it out. Okay, so Julia Sokolowski is the power broker. She's going to go and now she will and she has immunity. Oh, so if that's the case then the beauties just win the day, right? Not necessarily because now it's tribes of seven.

[00:48:21] So now will Julia is immune but Nick and Michelle aren't. So could Jason and Sydney and Neil and Debbie vote out Michelle or Nick? It's actually pretty interesting. Yeah, and it also feels like Michelle's still screwed, right? Because yeah, Julia doesn't have the power to swing the numbers completely. You know, she actually makes them a bigger target. I mean, that's essentially why they want her out now because the idea of her coming back into

[00:48:51] the game is too threatening to have, you know, the beauties just have such a demanding lead on them. I mean, if it wasn't for Caleb getting medevaced, their entire tribe would still be intact. So this is kind of the first chance you have to shed some blood on that side. Yeah. Could you do a reverse power broker where that you put people to exile and then have their tribes go to tribal council? I guess that's kind of like what was going to happen to Sari where she wasn't going to be able to vote,

[00:49:21] but you'd be safe, but your tribe, like in the pre-merge, you're safe, but your tribe is going to lose a number. Yeah, I feel like there's something there for sure, right? Like almost like a safety without power type vibe where if you're on the exile, then, you know, you're safe, but they could have used you. Yeah, I guess that's kind of what's going on here. This time, she doesn't have a tribe. You know, she's just loyal to the numbers that she had. I don't know. I feel like there's something here, and I think, honestly, I do think Korong is probably the reason they start trying to work around

[00:49:50] this, because you get the vibe that they didn't want to send her to exile. You know, if it wasn't for the Caleb Medivac, there is no exile in this season. Jeff really explains it. He's like, hey, we were going to do this, but now we have to do this because this. We were always doing this. Yeah. This was always the plan. We didn't change anything. No, no. Do they? But they definitely don't. They definitely don't change anything. I've heard Jeff on record saying like, hey, there's nothing you can say to

[00:50:20] make us change anything, damn it. And that's fine. But I do think here, this is probably where they're like, I don't like this. I don't think they love this. I don't think they love Anna Kate being swap screwed, really, you know, because I think it does kind of take the fun out of the game a little bit as a viewer, but I would hate to go out there. This would probably be my big, like, vote me out first. Don't ever put me in a situation where I feel like there's nothing I can do. Like, I don't like that. But get me out the game. Listen, she was doing the puzzle. She could have

[00:50:49] done the puzzle. Her fate was in her hands. Yeah. I mean, yeah, I guess. Kind of. Yeah. Not like me, who I was sitting out of the challenge when they voted me out on Survivor All-Stars. And then you didn't even fight with Sue Hawk. Didn't even fight with Sue Hawk. Yeah. So Sue Hawk is kind of like a proto-Debbie. Oh, yeah. There's no Debbie without Sue Hawk. There's no Survivor without Sue Hawk. Make no mistake. Without her, this show lasts one season. We've got a big

[00:51:19] episode coming up next time, Chappelle. Do you remember what? Oh, I can tell you what I think is the most famous thing from this next episode. From this next episode? Is this? I don't need to be carried, bro? Is it that moment? Because that's, I feel like it's a merge. Perhaps. I think it's early for I don't need to be carried, bro. Okay. Or maybe she does. Maybe Michelle, maybe bro I know is later. Bro, I know. Yeah. I feel like that's kind of emerged

[00:51:49] territory. What's going to happen in the next episode? What you got? Big Aubrey vote. Big Aubrey vote. Big Aubrey swing vote. Oh, no, I don't remember this at all. I'm very excited to see. Yeah. All right. Well, we'll be on the lookout for that. One of the seminal moments in the early days of Aubrey's career. Uh-huh. Let's find out when they decide they're going to bring her back. Because I think that right now she's just a character, but we'll see when she starts to kill. Not even a main character, really. Nope. She's just chilling.

[00:52:19] Her and Michelle have just been chilling so far this season. Not a lot to do. More for Aubrey to do so far than Michelle. But for the most part, for them to go out to be the two biggest stars from this season, you wouldn't know it at this point. You kind of understand where Survivor, like, they were not thrilled with this season. They put it on the back burner. They said, okay, let's put another season in front of it because we don't know about this season. In their minds, I

[00:52:49] think they might have thought, like, hey, we're building up these characters. They're getting taken out. We end up at the end of the game with three, you know, Ty is there, but he's there with three women that we're not really spending a lot of time with in Sydney and Michelle and Aubrey. And they ultimately end up being the stars of the season. We get a little bit more Sydney than the other two for sure, but Sydney doesn't even make it to that final travel council, to your point. So yeah, I think they invest a lot of time into some characters that get

[00:53:19] medevaced. You know, even with Joe, you know, we've been spending a decent amount of time with Joe since episode one. He's going to go out medevaced. Caleb was the star of the beauty tribe alongside Ty. He gets medevaced. Yeah, it's not great. Yeah. Okay. So we'll talk about that. Episode six is coming up next. This episode, we talked about the titles the whole way through. The title of this episode is The Devils You Know. Yes. Okay. I don't know. I don't know who

[00:53:49] said that. Did somebody say that? Yeah. They must have said that. Okay. Yeah. We glossed over Sydney. She's a brain. She went to Ivy League school. Yes. That was cool. You Penn, I believe. Yeah. I was like, oh, okay. She's like, yeah, these people don't know how smart I am. I was like, I think this is more evidence of they just needed to put these people somewhere, right? Like, Caleb, you're a beauty, but you could have been a brawn. You know, Sydney's a brawn. She could have been a brain. You know, I think they were just shuffling the numbers and this is where we vibing. Yeah.

[00:54:19] Yeah. Okay. All right. So that's what's coming up next time. Episode six. Chappelle, what's coming up for you? More of this, hopefully, you know, I'm very much enjoying the co-wrong rewatch over on my podcast. We started talking about interview with the vampire season three, aka the vampire list at and so that the first two episodes should be out by the time you're hearing this. So make sure you go subscribe to recap kickback kickback.com for that. YouTube.com slash at recap kickback to see that. And then House of the Dragon is

[00:54:48] coming soon as well. We'll be covering that too. So check that out over there. All right. We are coming up on episode number six on co-effing wrong. We will see you on Friday for that one. Take care. We have a good one. Bye. A lot of folks listen to Rob as a podcast because they want to get smarter about Survivor.

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