Eva Erickson Post-Season Interview | Survivor 48

[00:00:08] [SPEAKER_02] Hi everybody, Mike Bloom back with another Survivor 48 postseason interview. And today, Eva Erickson is no longer on ice. I mean like maybe she was literally very recently, probably considering how much she loves hockey. But today, I get the chance to sit down with the second place finisher of Survivor 48 to talk about how her incredibly eventful 26 days in the game transpired.

[00:00:36] [SPEAKER_02] Of course, Eva had so many highs and lows over the course of her time in Fiji, perhaps most prominently this very emotional episode she has after the challenge in Episode 5 where she gets very overwhelmed. And Joe publicly crosses tribal lines to comfort her. She then discloses her autism diagnosis to the entire cast. And Jeff Probst is in tears. And it's a moment that has reached beyond the game in so many ways.

[00:01:02] [SPEAKER_02] But there was so much more to Eva's game, even outside of just that moment. And something that she actually told me right after our conversation that you're about to listen to is that she actually felt that the jury largely saw her game the way that the edit kind of personified her to us, which was this idea that she was just this athlete here to do challenges and not strategize much and just kind of buddy up to Joe and go to the end of the show.

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_02] Love the game. Love it. We know Survivor dot com. Also in the Survivor podcast feed, we've got the Survivor 50 files where Brandon Donlan talks with a different alum every weekday about a player on Survivor 50, of which there are quite a few from Survivor 48. And we've got some names that will be bandied about today. I am counting down the 25 greatest moments in Survivor history as voted on by you, the fans.

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_02] We've got a you versus the world coming up at some point. Survivor 49 is happening in the fall. So you do not want to miss one iota of the coverage we have going on, either in podcast form or video form. So again, we know Survivor dot com. One last thing before we get into the proper interview here.

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_02] I talked about this during the Shaheen podcast, but in case you missed it, we are, of course, incredibly grateful that CBS offers us these exclusive postseason interviews. However, we are instructed to keep these interviews to an hour in length. That said, I think we were able to get to a lot with Eva over the course of our time together. But I just wanted to let you all know.

[00:03:11] [SPEAKER_02] So there may be certain relationships or events that we do not get into an incredible amount of detail about, like stars dynamic with Eva or the way that Eva saw the jury votes before Jeff ended up reading out the final outcome. But that's because we actually already talked about those subjects with Eva during her exit press the day after the finale.

[00:03:34] [SPEAKER_02] So if you're interested in finding out more about her thoughts on those particular subjects, really recommend that you check out in particular the ones that both Rob and I did, respectively, first turn outlets with Eva. We wanted to use this more so as an opportunity to explore some topics that we didn't necessarily get into during that interview. Regardless, it was quite the power hour for the master of the power play in the form of Eva Erickson.

[00:04:00] [SPEAKER_02] So without further ado, here's my conversation with Eva. All right, everybody, I am thrilled to be talking with somebody who put together a hell of a season to culminate in an impressive and epic second place finish. And I'm not talking about the Edmonton Oilers. I'm talking about Eva Erickson. You had to bring the Oilers up. Oh, it's like a day.

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_02] And it's wild, though, because a year ago I was watching the Stanley Cup finals on the layover on the way to talk to you about Survivor 48. And history ends up repeating itself in so many ways this year.

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_03] I know. And this time I got to watch it and it was just so sad. I was really wanting McDavid to get a cup, especially now that I know how big of a Survivor fan he is. I was at game five and met his wife, who is a lifelong Survivor fan. She told me she was wearing Survivor buffs to school growing up and she wants to get on the show. So I was giving her some pointers. So we might see a McDavid on the island. But yeah, I don't know what the second place thing is. I'm not a big fan.

[00:05:04] [SPEAKER_02] Well, let's get into the first period of your game here as we start from basically the moment your feet hit the sand. And, you know, you and I talked before you got the chance to play. But something that we actually didn't necessarily discuss is the idea of when you would disclose and to whom you would disclose your autism. And we see in the first couple of days, you know, you really find Joe and cement this this game long relationship that even extends outside of the game.

[00:05:32] [SPEAKER_02] I'm curious, though, did you come in with the intention of I'm going to tell one person or did circumstances just come about in these first couple of days that made you feel like I've got to tell somebody?

[00:05:43] [SPEAKER_03] I actually did make a plan before coming to the game that I needed to tell one person like this. I I practice these strategies that I've learned through years and years of going to therapy to work on the challenges I have with my autism. And I know that I need a support system. And that's something that's really important to me. And so I was like, you know, I need to find someone that I can trust. And I was really, really hoping that I would have that connection on my first tribe. And I was so lucky to meet Joe and really just know immediately that this was going to be my person.

[00:06:13] [SPEAKER_03] Like we on that first day on the beach, like we solidified an alliance that we were like, we're going to be each other's number ones to the end. No backstabbing like that was apart from me sharing my story. And then after a few more days, we go through that first challenge and stuff. And I was like, OK, yeah, I think this is really the person I want to entrust with my what's this really important part of my life. And so I confided in him. And it was really just the best decision for both my mental state and for the game.

[00:06:39] [SPEAKER_02] So as we're going through, you know, this first period on Loggi, we don't need to spend that much time considering that you don't end up voting really in any configuration of Loggi that you're in. But I do want to touch upon a couple of things because we see that you and Star start off in kind of these these disparate positions. And so this is something you've talked with me about in Exit Press that, you know, she was looking for idols while you were the bamboo queen of Fiji.

[00:07:05] [SPEAKER_02] But talk to me about how you sort of recognize the dynamics of Loggi. And in particular, I guess I should ask, did you see the California girls as this sort of like Trinity controlling the dynamics of Loggi as we were presented?

[00:07:19] [SPEAKER_03] No. So in my eyes, it was me and Joe were each other's number ones. And we are also the two most key people in challenges. So I knew that that we were the ones that people want to keep around to win challenges. We both had were very instrumental in that. And then Shaheen was our third. I had brought Shaheen and Joe together. Those were two people I'd separately become like friends with and was like, hey, like, I think you guys would like each other. Told them to talk to each other. So we have this three of us. And then it was kind of a do we want Bianca or Thomas thing? This is how it was from my point of view.

[00:07:50] [SPEAKER_03] Star wasn't really spending time hanging out with the rest of us. She was idol hunting from the get go, like right off the drop. She is gone off the grid. She'll say she's looking for bamboo and comes back with like two twigs. And I'm meanwhile in that time, I hauled like 10 pieces of bamboo. So as someone who's like a very hard worker, this just rubbed me the wrong way. So I was not looking to work with Star because she clearly wasn't looking to work with us.

[00:08:12] [SPEAKER_02] Something that I should note as well from this first bit of blog is that we do see this moment where, you know, Joe builds this bonfire. You offer, you know, this bracelet that you had made. And it leads to this larger question that a lot of us had while watching the season as to, you know, were you aware of how publicly tight the two of you were being perceived? Do you talk about locking in with him strategically and personally from that first day?

[00:08:37] [SPEAKER_02] But were you aware that gestures like that caused Shaheen and Thomas to literally give the side eye to each other in your proximity in the moment?

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_03] I had no idea. This is another one of those things where it's like, I'm not good at reading people's emotions, not good at social cues. So maybe like maybe somebody else would have picked up on that. They're like, oh, hey, that wasn't like a smart thing. You're giving away information. I was just like, oh, like Joe really wanted to make this beautiful fire for us. I want to do something nice for him. And everybody saw me like making this bracelet. I was like telling, hanging out with Thomas. I was like, oh, I'm going to make Joe a bracelet because like as a little thank you, like trying to show my appreciation. So it wasn't like just out of nowhere.

[00:09:10] [SPEAKER_03] I like pulled this thing and I've been asked in other interviews like, oh, was that to try to like suck up to Joe? And I was like, no, I legitimately he is. He talks so much about his daughter and how he told me he wanted his daughter to grow up to be like me. And that's probably the biggest compliment I've ever gotten in my life. And so I was like, I want to do something for him and his daughter Jade that he loves so much. And so it was just hilarious watching that back and seeing that. Yeah, that like was a bad move, I guess. Like my bad. Sorry, I'm nice.

[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_02] Well, I'm curious about that because you talked about in confessionally, you talked about it with me. This idea that you you felt like you did not necessarily have the the capability to pick up on the social cues. How much did that expectation measure up to reality, though? When you play through the 26 days, did you pick up on more social cues and moments of deception than you initially thought you would?

[00:10:02] [SPEAKER_03] There's what I will get to it later surrounding the Shaheen vote about a little bit of deception. But for the most part, I played an extremely honest game and I only trusted information that came from my close allies. And so we saw early on when I kind of went to star and was asking her some questions because I already knew that she was going to lie to me. So I kind of use that as a way to try to learn what is it like when star lies? Because she's not telling me the truth here. I know she has an idol or has the lock to the idol.

[00:10:31] [SPEAKER_03] And so I was trying to like use strategies like that to work around the fact that like, yeah, I'm not good at noticing when someone's lying. But just the way that I am as a person, I'm very open and very like honest and loyal. And so when I picked my people, I was very true to them. And then that was reflected back at me, which I was very lucky to have that kind of two way street of trust and honesty.

[00:10:49] [SPEAKER_02] You mentioned your people. And again, I think what made, as you mentioned in your final tribal council, such this such an unprecedented season, especially in the new era, is that you mentioned this sort of team mentality, which I think makes sense given your background. But I think a lot of people would say like Survivor is not a team sport. So now that you have sort of played this individual game with that group mentality in mind, if you were to play again, would you have a similar approach?

[00:11:16] [SPEAKER_02] How much do you think that team mentality works in a game like Survivor at the end of the day?

[00:11:20] [SPEAKER_03] I think it's all about building that community. And if I were to play again, I definitely would do the same thing because I can't change who I am. I'm not going to change, modify myself, try to be backstabbing, whatever. That's not going to work for me because that's not who I am as a person. Who I am is someone who brings people together, creates this community. I am someone who when I pick my people, I'm loyal to them to a fault. I've seen that throughout my life and I saw it on Survivor. And so it is that's that's not something I would change if I were to go out there again.

[00:11:48] [SPEAKER_03] And I would just maybe not be so public about who my people are, because that was kind of the thing that set us apart was that everybody was like so knowledgeable on the fact that, yep, Eva and Joe, that's a duo. And so it was surprising that even though we were such a powerful duo, that we were not split up and we were able to maintain that trust in each other because so easily at any point one of us could have flipped on the other. But that's not who we are. And it really worked out in such an amazing way to get to the end with the person I started day one with.

[00:12:17] [SPEAKER_02] Well, you were split apart during one opportune moment, which was the tribe swap and you and star stay on logging. You welcome in a whole new host of faces. Now, something that has been talked about in David's exit press and Mary's exit press in your own is the fact that the three of you formed a really tight bond outside of just talking about stand up jet skis. Talk to me a bit more about that. How quickly did those bonds form on new loggy?

[00:12:44] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, I definitely hit it off like immediately with David. You saw it in those first few things we're talking about. I was like, oh, my God, you're a stunt actor. I was so excited because I pegged that like I knew that. And like the talking about the jet skis and just he was like such a fun, goofy person. And getting the kind of like just really good vibes from him and Kyle in pregame that I was like, oh, those are people I wanted to work with. And so now meeting him, having that confirmed, I was like, this is awesome. And he said great things about Kyle. And so we were like, oh, we want to bring all these people together.

[00:13:14] [SPEAKER_03] I was like, I have Joe and Shaheen. And he's like, I have Kyle. And I was like, perfect. This is amazing. And then I also met Mary. And Mary is so much fun. Now, Thomas had played a little game when he had gone on his journey and told me that Mary was gunning for me. What? Yeah. He comes back from his journey, which he lied all about to us. And he was like, Mary is Mary was like chomping at the bit to ask about you. And it's like, oh, evil looks really strong. He's like, Mary's gunning for you. And so I was like, oh, my God, this girl's like scary. Like, I don't want to talk to her.

[00:13:44] [SPEAKER_03] And then she was the first person to hug me when we like got our like opened our buffs. And she was like, oh, my gosh. And I was like, oh, like, she's actually really nice. And so I actually was honestly closer with Mary than David. And they didn't show that at all in the edit. And so when we we then eventually go into this strong six, in my opinion, I thought that it was Mary that was the bonus. Well, as the people from Vula thought that it was Camilla that was the bonus. But I was I was close with Mary.

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_03] And they just they totally edited that out of the show, which was kind of weird to see, considering she's one of my good friends.

[00:14:20] [SPEAKER_02] Well, I want to talk a bit about that, because something that you bring up a couple of times during this stage is the gender breakdown of your tribe is David and women. And you had mentioned that just due to your background, you know, you work most closely with men. You are most used to working with men. I think you mentioned at one point that you actually don't really have like many friends who are girls. And listen, you've talked about it a bit during the season.

[00:14:47] [SPEAKER_02] I know it has prompted a bit of backlash from the fans as well in response to some of those comments. So talk to me a bit more about what that meant to you and sort of, I guess, your response to those responses.

[00:14:57] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, actually, thank you for asking about this, because, yeah, it's very the what's funny is that that confessional where I'm saying like, oh, like, I don't really have any friends who are girls. That was me continuing on to say, but I hit it off with Mary really quickly. Oh, funny that they took that part out and instead used it to propel this this relationship of me. And David. And so Mary and I were like, what the heck? But no, like I one of the things with my autism is I am not I struggle with social cues. We know that.

[00:15:26] [SPEAKER_03] But I'm much worse at it with women because women have more complex emotions, more complex cues. And there's been many times in my life where I have been excluded from girl groups, been mistreated because I'm too direct. I'm too blunt. People see that as rude. And guys will usually take that a bit more in stride than women. And so while I am in male dominated fields of engineering, of playing hockey with boys, I'm an official as well, which is very, very male dominated field, too.

[00:15:54] [SPEAKER_03] And so all these areas I am interacting mostly with men and I feel very comfortable in that environment. And then I but I do definitely have friends who are girls, too. So that's yeah, it was very unfortunate that that was being like pushed out is that it's like, oh, Eva doesn't like girls. And I'm like, I had two women vote for me in the end. You think I didn't have relationships with them? Like it was. Yeah.

[00:16:16] [SPEAKER_02] Well, during that phase, I am curious. Let's say you do end up going to your first tribal council in the pre-merge, because from our perspective, we're sort of being presented with like two sides of the street bus throwing with you telling everyone else about what's going on with star. And you have David telling everyone about what's going on with charity. What was sort of your pulse at the moment? If you had gone to tribal council before the merge, who would have gone there?

[00:16:41] [SPEAKER_03] It depends on when, because the thing is, if say if we had another tribal, like if there was a tribal that happened after I had my my reconciling with star with surrounding the idol. That was a beautiful thing that brought us together. And what they didn't show is that after that star and I actually were friends for several votes. And then that changes a bit, which we'll get into. But star star and I were good. She understood me much better. And so things that had been rubbing her the wrong way about me, she understood that, oh, I wasn't trying to be rude.

[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_03] I was just direct because of my autism. She's actually very knowledgeable on autism. She has experience with her family, which is really amazing. And so I then had a good relationship with star and I did not have a good relationship with charity. She is someone who's just very unaware of the things that she says and the impact they have on people. And so witnessing this and things that she said towards me, things she said towards Mary, going into the merge with Camilla and Kyle.

[00:17:38] [SPEAKER_03] And it was just kind of things that I was like, you know what, this there's something off. And we can see that I I said that in one of my confessionals that she felt very fake. And I was very proud of myself for clocking that one because I'm not great at picking up on those things. But, yeah, so I think if we had gone to a vote, I would have wanted charity gone more than star star and I were good.

[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_02] So before we get to the merge, of course, we have to talk about the episode, you know, episode five episode in a manner of speaking, because it is this massive moment, not only outside of the game. I think, you know, it's racked up millions of views on YouTube at this point, but for yourself inside the game as well. And I'm curious, you know, when you approach Joe, when you confide in him about episodes and how to, you know, be able to come in as an outside force and comfort you through this.

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_02] Were you sort of coming in with that mentality that you would have an episode in a challenge? And if so, how much did it surprise you that it came up in this particular instance?

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_03] I think I needed I knew I needed to be prepared in case this would happen, because the times when I'm most susceptible to having an episode are when I'm the most beaten down, you know. And so being on Survivor, that's the most depleted I'm going to be in my life. And so I've had episodes, for example, in cross country where it's a very overstimulating race and you're going and going and there's no break. There's no where to stop. It goes and then I would get to the end of the race.

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_03] I'd always finish, but then I would start screaming at the end, similar to what we see happen here, because I needed to release all of that buildup and that overwhelming overstimulating environment. And so in a lot of Survivor challenges, I had actually planned out this strategy with therapists about resetting throughout because they're often stages. So it's like, oh, you get you have to like move sandbags and then you have to climb a wall and then you do a puzzle. And so it's like, OK, each of these things is a separate obstacle.

[00:19:32] [SPEAKER_03] I could then mentally reset between. So I was doing that. I'm making like using these strategies. And this is still like I'm still developing and growing as a person, right? Like I'm not perfect at it. We see that. And it like but applying these things that I've learned was awesome. But in this situation, you can't stop and reset because it's just a table maze and I have to land a ball. It's just going and going until I get it. And so there was no break. There's nothing to like stop and kind of bring down this ungroundedness that I'm experiencing.

[00:20:02] [SPEAKER_03] And so that is the exact kind of thing that would trigger this. And and so it's no surprise that that is the event that I struggled the most with. And then I'm very, very proud that I was able to finish it. Like I pushed through. I was able to keep myself together to finish that maze. But then the second that I did, everything just explodes in my head. And you see, I like I think there's a difference between what Joe doesn't let my tribe does. Right. And so my tribe doesn't know they don't understand me.

[00:20:30] [SPEAKER_03] And they they come there, try to hug me. They're screaming. They're giving me a lot of support in like that. They think they're cheering for me. But that's also overstimulating and they're not my like trusted person. And so then having this opportunity to go to Joe, who is that person that knew exactly what to do, someone that I trusted entirely. That was what really, really helped in this moment. And I'm just I'm so glad that I had advocated for myself early on to set myself up for success here so that we could have this moment and I could continue on in the game.

[00:20:58] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, you spoke about it so beautifully on the mat, this idea that like people with autism should not be afraid to ask for help because you find those people that are standing alongside the sidelines just chomping at the bit, waiting to jump in. I imagine that there must have been so much going through your head at that time to the point where, you know, I'd be intrigued to find out how much you remember about everything that happened from both the episode and what happened afterwards.

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_02] I would imagine that for you, your headspace was like, well, listen, this is kind of out in the open. Let me officially, you know, talk about my diagnosis in front of everybody. But when it came to the actual sentiments you were expressing, was this something that you would thought about ahead of time? Or was this really just off the cuff in the moment? You know, let's let's let's let's, you know, reveal this major part of myself to everyone else in the game.

[00:21:50] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, that was that whole speech was just off the dome. Like, I truly feel that that that was God working through me to express my truth in the best way I possibly could. And I'm very, very proud of that because, yeah, like I this was such a quick up, quick down kind of moment where like I had been all over the place, just ungrounded.

[00:22:11] [SPEAKER_03] And then to come in and be able to speak exactly what needed to be said in that moment and impact so many people there on the island, as well as now that everyone's seen it, just the broader world is so amazing. So, yeah, I had planned that, like, OK, if people see me have an episode, I will tell them, like, I will explain what's going on. I said that when I told Joe in the beginning, but I didn't I didn't plan what I would say. It was just like, OK, I'm doing it now. And yeah, I'm very, very proud of how that worked out.

[00:22:39] [SPEAKER_02] Absolutely. Well, the down turns to an up turns into an even further up when you end up solving. Finally, stars lock. You get the idol. Give me your reaction to this as you're going into the merge, because you talk about playing a very open and honest game. Now you've got a little necklace to show how open and honest your game is, considering how much now everybody's going to find out about it.

[00:23:04] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, I mean, we had said we weren't going to tell people. And I think Star, David and Mary were all in on that. Charity was not. Charity is not someone I trust. Charity was the person that the second that we hit the merge, she was telling Mitch. And then that was spreading around. And that morning, actually, this was this was very unfortunate to hear and was part of why I was very much wanting Charity gone was that I'd open that idol.

[00:23:28] [SPEAKER_03] And then Charity goes to David and Mary and is like, who wins if you sit next to to Star at the end? And they're like, well, I'd probably beat Star. And then they're like, OK. And then she goes, OK, well, who wins if you sit next to Eva? And they're like, I guess Eva would. And she's like, exactly. And so now hearing Charity, she had taken what had happened the previous day and now sees that whole event as being something that would push me to a win, which was not what I intended. That was not a strategy move at all.

[00:23:57] [SPEAKER_03] This was just me experiencing my life. And so then we go into the merge. She tells everyone I have an idol. She's starting to try to get me out of this game. And so that's why you see all this switch from from being like, OK, like I want Star out. And now it's like, no, I'm good with Star. I want Charity gone. And I was very glad to get her the first boot there from the merge.

[00:24:18] [SPEAKER_02] It's interesting you bring that up, because at least the way the edit presents it to us is that you seem to be actually weighing back and forth between Charity and Say. And, you know, you do end up getting rid of Say at the next vote. But talk to me about how much you were weighing your options. Did it? It seems like from what you're expressing, it was more of a slam dunk than maybe we were led to believe of like, oh, you're saying my name. You got to go.

[00:25:06] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. Because I was like, everyone was seeing us as a duo. I was like, maybe this will help a little bit. I'm voting for the same person. But yeah, I voted for Say on that because I was one of the few people who wasn't afraid to write her name down knowing she wasn't going home because people were very afraid of her. She definitely created this aura of like villainry out there, which is exciting for watching TV, but not so exciting to play with.

[00:25:30] [SPEAKER_03] And so I, yeah, it was a little spooky being someone to write her name down and then have her stick around and be trying to sniff out who. But yeah, I was ultimately very happy to have Charity leave.

[00:25:40] [SPEAKER_02] Well, to that point, you end up getting the split tribal council next. And again, we get you weighing your options between Say and Mitch. From what it sounds like you're saying, though, was it a pretty open and shut case to get rid of Say by comparison?

[00:25:54] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, so actually, I thought that the split tribal was edited to be extremely different from what was going on on that island. Because in my eyes, I was weighing, do I play my idol or not? Oh, yeah, because this is the only time I had solidified such a good, strong alliance, right? I have have Joe, Shaheen, David, Mary, Kyle. And then there's also Bono. There's Camilla, too, that it's like debated. Is Camilla or Mary the bonus in our strong six, whatever?

[00:26:21] [SPEAKER_03] I don't really care which one because I'm in the middle here. So I'm like, I'm supported either way. It was more of David's big issue with that. But I'm set when we're all as a big group. This is the only time in the game where I'm split from that big, big supportive alliance. I'm only with Joe. And then we have Mitch, Chrissy, Say, and Star who are on the island with me. And I know that Mitch has a block of vote.

[00:26:48] [SPEAKER_03] And I was like, if Mitch is smart at all, he will play that block of vote on Star because Star would be voting with me and Joe. And Star wouldn't be someone that I would play the idol on. Joe has a necklace. So if he played that block of vote on Star, Joe and I vote together. The rest of them vote on me.

[00:27:08] [SPEAKER_02] Right.

[00:27:08] [SPEAKER_03] If I don't play my idol, I'm going home. So I was extremely strongly considering playing my idol, like really weighing this. I was like, man, like this is deciding if I make the jury or not. Like, can I try? Like, I can't trust these people. Like, they're not my allies. It's in their best interest. Like, this is the big move. Like, Mitch's big move can be getting Eva out of this game. Like, man, like, and I know I'm a threat. Everybody knows I'm a threat. I have the idol. I have the strong alliance. So that was the only time in the entire game that I was like, I might be going home.

[00:27:36] [SPEAKER_03] Like, I was definitely nervous for that. But then I come, I come back after debating all these things in one of my confessionals. And then Mitch is like, oh, I played my block of vote on say Joe's like, I saw him do it. There was no mystery about it. There was. Yeah. If I was Mitch, I would have played the block of vote, but not told me to flush the idol too. Like, yeah, there was a lot going on there that I was like, this went way cleaner than it should have.

[00:28:05] [SPEAKER_03] Like, so everybody was, everyone in my alliance was very shocked that I made it through that split tribal maintaining my, my, uh, idol there. Cause yeah, that was a spooky one.

[00:28:14] [SPEAKER_02] That's so interesting because again, the way the narrative presented it as kind of like you and Joe, Joe more. So I think faced a lot more editorial line of fire of like, oh, they might be turning on Joe tonight, but it sounds like you arguably faced the biggest danger of going home at the split tribal council through the circumstances.

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_03] You mentioned, I mean, Joe had the necklace. Yeah.

[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah.

[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. So it was, yeah, I was definitely, that was like that, that could have changed the entire game right there. Cause say I don't make it through that split tribal. The strong six is breaking down immediately because I was that keystone keeping that arch together because I was bridging that gap of, of the people who are on new Lula to the people who are on new log. And so it's like, say that I was out of there, no idol. It's yeah, totally different game. Um, and it all comes down to how Mitch decided to play that, that block of vote.

[00:29:02] [SPEAKER_03] But, uh, ultimately I think that for the community that we built, that was an amazing choice because we kind of then had this really amazing group that made up the entire, like merge tribe and jury and stuff. Um, we'll getting out some of that negativity that we wanted to, to dispel from kind of flushing out all the Vula's. I know Cedric also went home then too. So it was just Mary, but, uh, it, yeah, that was a, that could have been edited to be some,

[00:29:27] [SPEAKER_03] a very, very crazy tribal or at least lead up to tribal, but yeah.

[00:29:33] [SPEAKER_02] Cedric knows a thing or two about flushing as well. Well, I want to get into this strong alliance because you had to step back a bit at murgatory. And it's kind of presented as like you helping put this together. Was that the case where you, the one that helped kind of pull these disparate threads to form the, the Avengers initiative of the season?

[00:29:54] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. I mean, I think it was kind of, everybody was thinking along the same lines that when, when that swap happened and I linked up with David and David and Kyle had actually been each other's number ones, um, back on Siva. Now I know the edit makes it look like Kyle and Camilla were together from, from day one, but that was not true. Kyle and David were each other's number ones. And, um, and then Shaheen, Joe and I were super tight. And so when I saw Thomas go home, I had assumed that that meant that Kyle had linked up with

[00:30:24] [SPEAKER_03] Joe and Shaheen and that he, that they, he had told them about Thomas's lies about his journey. And I was like, Oh, this is great. We're all good. Everyone's working together. This is perfect. I had no idea the hooligans that were being a run around.

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_02] Hooligans. Yeah.

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. Between Kyle and Camilla's acting spree. But, uh, no. So then when we, we do get to that merge, then I, and I was super excited to meet Kyle. We hit it off immediately. Like we just clicked and we still, he's one of the best friends that I've ever made. Probably like apart from my boyfriend is the person I'm closest with in the world. And so like it, yeah. And we got very close within a very short time. Um, and so that was easy. And then getting, um, Shaheen and Joe, like they're kind of shaken up. They just had the whole Thomas thing.

[00:31:07] [SPEAKER_03] Now they're like, okay, like we got to get some numbers together. Some people that were, were solid with. And so I was like, I really trust David. I got Mary and they had just kind of formed that thing that they're like, Oh, with Camilla, Kyle, Shaheen, Joe. So they're like, Oh, we have Camilla. And it wasn't really communicated very well for this strong alliance about if Mary or Camilla was that bonus extra girl. I knew I was good. I was like, I'm in the middle. And I had been very advocating that I was like, we need to have another woman in this alliance, which they didn't really show that either.

[00:31:36] [SPEAKER_03] But that was very important to me because I didn't want it to then have all the boys gang up and be like, well, we could just do a boys alliance and then cut me. So I was like, I need another girl here so that it can at least be like, Oh, there's two of us. So it's not just like, Oh, the boys and Eva. And so I was like, either Mary or Camilla, either one works. But then that's where things started becoming turmoil is because that was not communicated very well. David was not aware that Camilla was part of this alliance. And Kyle was not aware that Mary was part of this alliance.

[00:32:07] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, a little, a little shaky.

[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_02] Well, let's get into the turmoil, shall we? Let's continue to shake things up here as we get into really the David. David vote where things kind of fall apart. Again, the Chrissy vote is where things start to get to your point a little shaky. This is the whole Camilla versus Chrissy thing. But David is where, you know, you could argue in something that you weigh on the show is like, are we breaking our word by turning on this guy? And you've expressed in your exit press that you had said that, you know, David had been

[00:32:35] [SPEAKER_02] quote unquote attacking people or at least like, you know, had some very aggressive approaches to the way he was pitching things. So talk to me a bit more about that. What was the sequence of events that led you to make this decision that this guy who you locked in with, you know, on Loggie had to go?

[00:32:53] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, I think it does. It goes back to that Chrissy vote because there was a lot of switching back and forth on that one on whether it was going to be Chrissy or Camilla. I really wanted Chrissy gone because Chrissy was she was bringing up a lot very loudly and publicly about how can we have this public duo of Eva and Joe? So she's the biggest threat to me in this situation because I don't want her putting that idea in other people's head. And so I was very much like, OK, we want Chrissy gone on that taco reward.

[00:33:22] [SPEAKER_03] We see David and Mary be like, it needs to be Camilla because Shaheen is working secretly with Camilla. And like Kyle has a secret idol that he made when he was going to the bathroom. Like David starts spewing all this random stuff. And I'm just trying to eat my tacos. This is my first meal. And so it was it was I was kind of like, OK, like, sure. Yes, whatever. I don't care who goes home. I'm safe. I have the necklace.

[00:33:46] [SPEAKER_03] And then when it starts getting superheated later that day and they don't it wasn't shown, but it was back and forth. Is it Camilla? Is it Chrissy? Everyone comes to me because I have the necklace. And this is a very key thing. I was physically standing in the middle of Joe and Shaheen on one side of me and Mary and David on the other side. Kyle is on a walk. He's doing his confessional. So Kyle's not even there. And so when they have this whole thing that it's like, oh, Kyle really protected Camilla. He saved her in this vote.

[00:34:16] [SPEAKER_03] Kyle didn't save Camilla. I did because Camilla was not a threat to me here. And I was like, Camilla is not spewing out about me and Joe. She's not doing anything. She she's very good at just hanging out at camp, being mellow. We talk hockey sometimes. She's a Leafs fan. And while Chrissy was really spouting a lot of stuff. And so they all come to me. They're like, Eva, you have to make the decision because nobody else wanted to be that one to be like, this is what we're doing. And I was like, fine, I'll do it. We're doing Chrissy. Kyle comes back from his walk.

[00:34:44] [SPEAKER_03] I have two seconds before we're not allowed to talk anymore to go to tribal. And I say, it's Chrissy tonight. He until that point thought that it was Camilla. And so he was good. He was going to be ready to vote for Camilla. I'm like, nope, it's Chrissy. We're good. The entire tribal council, Camilla is making eyes at me because she knows she saw this this commotion happening. She's like mouthing to me. Do I need my shot in the dark? And I'm like, no, you're good. You're good. And that really earned a lot of respect with Camilla. There was because I was I protected her in that moment.

[00:35:12] [SPEAKER_03] And it was not I was not Kyle keeping her in the game as it was edited. Like that was I wanted Chrissy gone. And so we got rid of her.

[00:35:19] [SPEAKER_02] Wow. All right. So then so then let's get into this this David vote then, because I would imagine that you are this keystone of this arch and you're sort of doing away with a couple stones at this point in the arch. And you I mean, you say in the show, right, you are kind of breaking down the six and rebuilding as the four that would move ahead towards the end of the game.

[00:35:36] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, yeah, that there was a we had a rest day between that Chrissy vote and then having another challenge and tribal that rest day occurred because that night was when I was going to go on my secret journey.

[00:35:50] [SPEAKER_02] Right.

[00:35:51] [SPEAKER_03] Well, the edit put it a little out of order, but that entire rest day was occurring first. And we see that David approaches me and Kyle on the log. And you got to see part of that conversation where Kyle is he was expressing how hard it was to vote out Chrissy because he had spent all day with her. Well, we there was some of us on the talker awards, some people doing the like weird ball game. He was just at camp with Chrissy and talked to her a ton and then had to vote her out that night. And that's really hard. Like we're you're friends with these people.

[00:36:21] [SPEAKER_03] It's emotional. And I had yet to experience that in the game. I had not voted out a friend yet, but he had. And so he was kind of expressing that to me. And David comes up and starts being very aggressive towards Kyle, kind of being like, why, why would that be hard? What was it shouldn't have been hard. And so it was kind of getting up in Kyle's face and Kyle, like body language was very I was kind of looking at this and David's kind of like stanced up on him. And I had to physically get between this and be like, hey, like, David, let's maybe go walk over here. Like Kyle's just kind of going through some emotions.

[00:36:51] [SPEAKER_03] And he like David was was being like, we can't trust Kyle. Like he was saying we can't trust Kyle because Kyle was working with Chrissy, not because Kyle's working with Camilla. Yeah. Which the edit, it kind of the edit makes David look like he was very in the know about this alliance when in reality, he just was spewing a lot of random stuff. Broken clock is right twice a day. But like it, this happened with Kyle later. I saw this happen. The same thing happened with Shaheen where he was getting up in Shaheen space.

[00:37:18] [SPEAKER_03] And once again, like I, a four, like a five foot four girl and having to get between the biggest Superman Jack looking dude on the island and like other people. And it's big. And David trusted me. Like he had, he was not doing anything mean towards me. He was just very much disrespecting these people that I cared about. And so as I'm seeing this throughout the day, I'm starting to think, and I'm like, man, like I don't want to turn on David. I really like him as a person. He's really fun. But now all of a sudden he's, he's become so paranoid and just not himself.

[00:37:48] [SPEAKER_03] Like, I don't know if I want to work with him. And then that night I go on my secret journey and I didn't tell anyone I was going. I know Shaheen saw me go, which was hilarious to find out later. But when I came back with my now, um, um, safety without power, I, I laid in that hammock and I thought, and I was like, what do I want to do with this? How do I, I now have additional power in this game. How do I want to use that to further myself and the people I care about?

[00:38:16] [SPEAKER_03] And I decided that I wanted to use this to get David out. And I didn't actually end up having to use it to get David out. It was a very unanimous decision, but, um, I use it as a, a token to buy myself trust with the people I wanted to move forward in the game with. And so I brought Kyle, Joe and Shaheen to the log that morning. And I said, okay, guys, like I have something I want to tell you. It's something that I did last night.

[00:38:42] [SPEAKER_03] Now this I'm only telling you guys, because I've decided like, this is the group I want to go forward with. I don't want to be working with Mary and David anymore. I think that now is the time for us to solidify that this is our group. And so I, I showed them the thing, told them the whole story. I had wanted us to keep David for one more vote. I had this plan that I was like, we can keep David for one more vote. Then on the following one, I will tell Mary that she is at, that, that everyone's voting for her.

[00:39:10] [SPEAKER_03] I'll make her use the safety without power. So she leaves tribal. So she can't vote to protect David. And then we can all gang up on him. Ended up being that throughout that following day, David was so aggressive towards everyone. I said, scrap that. I know it would look cool. It'd be great for me to use this thing. It'd be super cool, but we can all just vote David out right now because he is not being the nice normal person that I know. And he's ruining people's experience out here. So that was, yeah, that was really tough to do.

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[00:40:11] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, so I mean, from that perspective, we see that, to your point, this is a major point for you, not only in breaking off an ally, but breaking off a friend. And you sit down with Mary and you have, from our perspective, a quite frank conversation about like, yeah, I'm so sorry this had to happen. By the way, I'm going to try to look out for you, no guarantees. You know, not going to use the idol on you. I know, again, Mary has expressed how close your relationship was. It seemed like she didn't take that much offense to it in the moment. But talk to me about your tactics in moving forward from that point.

[00:40:41] [SPEAKER_02] Like, you had formed that four. But as we're getting into the final eight, you know, there was this possibility, as we saw in the edit, of like, people could try to form this counter-reliance against you.

[00:40:51] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. Oh, yeah. I, that conversation with Mary, it didn't make sense in the edit because people didn't see how close we were. But that was really, that was like me breaking up with Mary. And so it was super, she asked like, will you play the idol on me? That was a super valid question for her to ask because we were so close. But I was like, no, Mary, like I have decided a new path in the game and it doesn't involve you. Like, I'm sorry. And, and I did look out for her. I was like, I'll, I'll, I'll market star first instead of you to keep you a little

[00:41:20] [SPEAKER_03] longer because you also don't have a shot in the dark. So we just know we can get you whenever. And I'll, I'll tell them that. So I've told, I was looking out for her. It was like, Hey, just like lie low. Don't do anything crazy. Don't eat all the coconuts and then you'll be good. And so, but yeah, it was, that was really tough. And then what they didn't show is that this was very emotional for me. And so I actually, since I had seen Kyle have such a hard time voting Chrissy out right after talking to Mary, I went and pulled Kyle.

[00:41:47] [SPEAKER_03] And the two of us talked about how emotionally hard it is to vote out friends in this game. Cause we now had both had that experience of having to vote out someone that we really cared about. And that was another thing that really brought us very close together. And then that was demonstrated the next day by when he picked me for the waffle reward. He says, he was been an emotional support for me in this game. And I hope I've been that for her. So this was also a very key point. And that this was where I then until that point, Shaheen was in my final three over Kyle.

[00:42:15] [SPEAKER_03] And then this was a shift between our relationship that now Kyle is my right after Joe. Like it's, those are my three. And so that was the key thing also not shown.

[00:42:26] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. I want to talk a bit about that because you had talked with me obviously about the fact that the Shaheen vote, it wasn't necessarily the fake idol factor. It was the idea that you had been told by Kyle that Shaheen had floated your name out. This whole thing about a possible three, three tie and him flipping on the re-vote. So this was the, this was the point when you felt like he was not going to be in your final three plans. So was it strictly personal? Because you had also spoken about the fact that like, you didn't want to go to the final three with a speed and debate coach. Probably not the best person to sit next to on day 26.

[00:42:55] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. Yeah. No, it was like, I, I, I cannot claim to be entirely strategic on that. It's I picked my people and I'm loyal to them. And I picked Kyle as one of those people. And so I, I really, I, I set myself with Joe and Kyle that I was like, I want to go to the end with these people that I love and respect. And I knew in also that, that Joe wanted it to be me, Shaheen and him. And so I, this was one thing that was, was very different in Joe and I's plans forward in

[00:43:22] [SPEAKER_03] the game is that after that David vote, I knew I wanted to go with Kyle and I did not express this to Joe. I, I let him continue to believe that, that I was going forward with that. It would be the loggy three sitting at the end. So that is another thing that kind of was different in our plans. But yeah, I, I definitely had such a strong relationship with Kyle from that point that was very outside of the game as well. Like, I think that's kind of my, a, an unknown superpower. I didn't, I didn't really expect myself to have this disability to build such strong relationships out there.

[00:43:52] [SPEAKER_03] I really went into the game thinking I was just going to be for challenges. Like, so it was, it was very interesting to see that, that my relationships with Joe and with Kyle were the things that got me to the end.

[00:44:01] [SPEAKER_02] So to that point, from a strategic perspective, it seemed like, you know, these star votes, Mary votes were very straightforward, but we also sort of see Joe start to get a little paranoid. You know, Mary throws out his name saying I'm voting for you. That's when he kind of goes off on Shaheen, like I'll vote for somebody. I might vote for you. Even we didn't get a lot of your perspective on Joe's reactions to all this. How did you receive all the stuff that Joe was doing, doing this final eight, final seven,

[00:44:30] [SPEAKER_02] final six when he feels like he's on the chopping block?

[00:44:32] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, I think that's, they didn't really show, but, but that's where I was really like, they, you got to see how Joe really supported me in the game. Right. But you didn't really get to see how I supported Joe. And these were times where I was very key in supporting Joe because he could trust me. Like everyone else. It's like, we, you have to take things that people say with a grain of salt, because we know that they don't have your best interest in mind, but we knew, and we trusted each other so much that he always knew I would be straight up and direct with him. I'd tell him exactly what was going down.

[00:45:02] [SPEAKER_03] And so he would, he would come to me. He'd be frantic about stuff. He'd ask me to play the idol or the safety without power. And I'd walk through, okay, like, so if you use the safety without power here, that means there's one that less vote. Then even if they were going to vote with us, they might, those other people on the bottom might switch because they see now that it could tie and that could force a rock draw and this and that and explain kind of the way that this was going. This is where I was very much a strategic help for him.

[00:45:27] [SPEAKER_03] And he, before even knowing that I was an engineer, he saw this side of me that other people didn't see because I hid it from people. In whenever someone wasn't my ally and we were talking about strategy, I would just say, oh, I'm doing what Joe's doing. But in reality, it was very much that Joe was coming to me asking for things on the strategic side. And so it was, I felt very grateful that he did take my input so seriously because there are times, yeah, where he was panicking. And if he had not listened to me, then that could have blown things up a bit. But I helped rein him in there.

[00:45:56] [SPEAKER_03] And he was there to help rein me in when I was dealing with my own emotional ungroundedness. So it was a very good, good relationship that we had.

[00:46:04] [SPEAKER_02] I want to talk about an element of that ungroundedness because there was this really pivotal secret scene that happened towards the end where you are not doing terribly well. You know, you talk about the fact that from a physical perspective, you are breaking down. And since you are someone who inherently, as an athlete, links so much of their physical well-being with their mental well-being, you know, by proxy, that meant that your mental health was sort of breaking down as well. Talk to me more about this.

[00:46:32] [SPEAKER_02] Was this something that surprised you, given the fact that you had sort of, to your earlier point, kind of come in with these deprivational aspects already in mind?

[00:46:39] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, I think that secret scene was one of my favorite scenes from the series, because I think that really encapsulated what a lot of us were going through in different ways. And you're out there, you're the most depleted you've ever been. And I knew that that would happen, but I didn't expect it to take such an emotional toll on me. Because while I'm out there and I'm looking at my body, which has been failing me as I'm not succeeding in these challenges in the ways that I'd wanted to. I mean, that secret scene was right after I had just got disqualified on one challenge

[00:47:09] [SPEAKER_03] and then couldn't throw a ball straight up in the air on another challenge that was built for me. It was literally stick handling. I never dropped on that. Like, if I had gotten there sooner, I would have won that. And I just, these were building and building these failures. And then seeing my arms and legs get so skinny and knowing that the hockey season's coming up. Like, I'm going to go back, I'm going to have like a month. And then it's hockey season where I'm playing with these men who are twice my size. And I'm supposed to be captain this year. How is anyone going to respect me if I'm so small and weak that I can't do anything that

[00:47:38] [SPEAKER_03] I'm failing over and over? Like, that's what's going through my head. And I expressed this to Camilla and Mitch. And this scene really shows how deep the connections across alliances were in this community we built, which is so unique about our season. Because I was not working with Camilla or Mitch. I still had such strong ties with them that they understood me and I was willing to open up to them. And they gave me the best advice that really pushed me forward in the game.

[00:48:08] [SPEAKER_03] That Mitch, he brings up, he's like, do you think that you're captain because of the way that you look and how strong you are or because who you are as a person? And I was like, you know what? Yeah, you're right, Mitch. Like, it can't just be physical, right? Like, and he's like, you make everyone around you better. I remember him saying that, that he was like, you might not see it, but you make everyone around you better. And that really just stuck with me. And I felt like so, so heard and understood from those two then that it really like gave

[00:48:37] [SPEAKER_03] me this push that I was like, yeah, like I have been making everybody else better here. Like I've been doing that. Like I'm making my team go to the end. Like I can do this. I can bring my team no matter what state I go into this season coming up. Like I can do it. I can push through this. And yeah, that was a very, a big thing. And it's, I think that people were surprised to see that the support I needed to get to the end of the game, that final push came from people that were not in my alliance. And I'm so grateful for Mitch and Camilla.

[00:49:06] [SPEAKER_03] They are just amazing people themselves.

[00:49:08] [SPEAKER_02] As we start looking towards the end of the game, I'm curious, we have Shaheen during his big sit down with Kyle talk about like, yeah, Eva, anyone can beat her. In the end, which I think came as a bit of a surprise to us. And you talked multiple times about the fact that you knew it was a bit of an uphill battle going in based on the perception that you had talked about, which is sort of playing up this jock who can't do math is just there to your job is challenges. So at this point in the game, as we're approaching the end, what did you get a sense of what your jury chances were?

[00:49:39] [SPEAKER_02] Did you feel as Shaheen was claiming that you were this quote unquote goat? If anyone brought you to the end, I was not a goat.

[00:49:45] [SPEAKER_03] I knew that I wasn't a goat. I knew other people might think that they were bringing a goat. And I wanted people to underestimate me. That was the whole point. But now it was my time. I knew that if I could get to the end with people seeing me not strategically, that people understand. I loved what Star had said about that her perception of the Log E3 was that Shaheen was the brains, Joe is the body and Eva's the heart.

[00:50:11] [SPEAKER_02] Right.

[00:50:11] [SPEAKER_03] And I was like, I also have brains and body, but I loved being known as the heart because the heart often wins in the game of Survivor. We've seen that before. And I was like, if people already are seeing me as the heart of this season, they will be so excited to find out that I'm more than just heart and that I have these strategic things that I was doing as well. And so I knew that that would be a great thing to bring up, but it was, yeah, it's definitely

[00:50:37] [SPEAKER_03] knowing, especially that the jury is made up of Siva and that those are people that I didn't really know as well. That I was someone, I think my, one of the things, if I could change the way I played, I would have, I played a way where I only allowed myself to get close with the people that I was working with. That I would not talk strategy, would not open any doors to people that I wasn't working with. And I have talked to Camilla about this, that she's like, Camilla left doors open for everyone,

[00:51:07] [SPEAKER_03] which is why a lot of people would want to vote for Camilla. Where I was like, nope, if you're not in my alliance, you don't get anything from me. I'm putting up the wall. Like I have my team, I'm set. And I'd still be friends with people, but it was still that kind of like, people want to vote for someone that they think valued them in the game. And I understand that now. I didn't understand it then. So I also had to factor in as going into this final tribal that these are all people who were not my friends. I got the two people who I had worked with to vote for me. I had Star and Mary, who I had great relationships with.

[00:51:37] [SPEAKER_03] They voted for me, but I was not going to win over somebody like Chrissy, who I had never given a chance to work with me in the game.

[00:51:44] [SPEAKER_02] Well, one of the reasons why Star at least espouses that she votes for you is this final four fire making. And so let's get into this, because this is something that you have talked about was, you know, something that the I'd edit only lightly brushed. Given your experience, you revealed that you did have another episode in the process of practicing for final four fire making. So walk me through this. You know what?

[00:52:09] [SPEAKER_02] What prompted this to be in a much more emotional situation than even what we saw? Was it the elements? Was it just the pressure of them because this was not on the challenge set, right? This was not all eyes on you. This was you by yourself in the middle of the woods.

[00:52:25] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, this was a different. So there's two types of episodes that I experienced. We saw the quick up, quick down like I had coming from episode five's challenge. That one where it's the stimulus in the moment. That's all. It's so much. It's so much. I get out of control and then I can come down from it. But this was a different type where sometimes these are the ones that now as I'm an adult and I deal with different stressors in my life that they happen more regularly, like not very right. Like I manage my life very well.

[00:52:53] [SPEAKER_03] But like these are the things that kind of occur more for someone in everyday life who has autism that's similar to mine in that I will have something that gets stuck in my brain and it might be over like a span of days, weeks, hours, whatever, where something will start building. And this over a span of days on Survivor was that I'm a failure because in these challenges, as I just talked about, I kept failing and I was feeling weak. And I was like, why do I keep failing? What's wrong with me? This starts building and building.

[00:53:23] [SPEAKER_03] Some motion comes. This is my last chance. I was like, I need to win the necklace a second time. Like I've only won it once. I came out here wanting to be a challenge threat. Why am I not being a challenge threat? And so I was like, I need to win it again to prove to myself that I am like, I am the competitor that I think that I am. And I lose that too. And so it's just all this building. And now I'm left with the last challenge you can do in the game, which is one where your

[00:53:49] [SPEAKER_03] entire life in this game is dependent on your ability to do something. And I had no faith in myself. And so when Kyle tells me that I'm going to be in fire, I go and I start practicing and I know how to build a fire. Like I had built a fire every day before going out to survivor for months in my backyard. Like there is still a burn circle out there. I looked at it yesterday. And, and so I like, I have the skills and I think the editor didn't really do justice to

[00:54:17] [SPEAKER_03] that fact that it was like, this wasn't just me not knowing how to build a fire and needing Joe to teach me. It was, I needed Joe to remind me that I could do it because I didn't believe in myself at this moment. And you see me, I'm like, why can't I do this? What's wrong with me? This actually really spiraled to a much greater, um, like overwhelming experience than was shown on camera. Um, they show Joe and Kyle in the shelter and you can hear me screaming a little bit.

[00:54:43] [SPEAKER_03] And I was actually screaming for quite a while, just in the fetal position on the ground, scratching myself, like flapping my hands, doing all these stims that characterize when I'm overstimulated. And I was trying so hard and I just couldn't do this one thing that I needed to do to be able to stay in the game. And when Joe comes, the edit makes it look like I calmed down immediately, but I did not. It took quite a while. Joe is trying to help. He's squeezing my hands, but I'm not coming out of it.

[00:55:12] [SPEAKER_03] And I have to battle this in my own head to try to bring myself down. And when I finally was able to stop screaming, I'm still stimming. I'm still kind of scratching myself. Joe's like, okay, let's go stand over here. Like I told him about my resetting. So he's like, let's reset over here. And he starts begging me to let him do it. And this is what got me out of it. This is what got me out of my episode is Joe saying, let me do it. I'll do it for you. And I was like, not a shot in hell.

[00:55:37] [SPEAKER_03] I'm doing this like, and I, that's what made me believe in myself was because I cared about Joe and I wanted to prove to both myself and to him that I could do this for me. And so he then was like, well, at least let me help you practice. And we did. And I made about 30 fires, just one right after another, just boom, boom, boom. Soon I was doing it faster than Joe could do it. And Kyle had been, Kyle had been like giving us our space and Kyle, then he comes over.

[00:56:05] [SPEAKER_03] He brought me a little, a little crab that he found. And he was like, he was like, I have a small offering. And he was like, can I do, can I do this for you? Like I'll do the fire. And I was like, no, like Kyle, look at what I just did. And I had all these fires, my graveyard of fires. And Kyle was like tearing up. He was so proud of me that we're like, yeah, I can do this. I am going to do this. And so it was just a very big emotional thing that was very edited down. And it wasn't shown the true struggles that I had to go through to be at my absolute lowest

[00:56:35] [SPEAKER_03] in the game and then get out of that and be able to succeed.

[00:56:38] [SPEAKER_02] And you did succeed admirably. So you make it to day 26. And we've talked in our interviews about your final tribal council performance. A couple quick things. Did you always have the intention of dropping the bomb that you were a PhD student on day 26? And what was your sense of the reaction in the moment when you made that reveal?

[00:56:58] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, I knew I wasn't going to tell anybody until the end. I did tell. So I actually me revealing to Joe and Kyle that happened right after I had the graveyard of fires there because I wanted to make sure that if I was voted out, I wanted them to still know, like I wanted them to know who I was. And I was like, either I'm gone and now you guys know my secret or you guys just get the heads up before final tribal because I was that had always been my plan. I want to drop the bomb.

[00:57:26] [SPEAKER_03] I want everyone to be like shocked that I'm actually smart. And so that was a really, really fun one to do. I was so proud to finally say that. I think seeing Chrissy's face was just the biggest reward there.

[00:57:37] [SPEAKER_02] So then what was your answer? Because this is like a veritable, you know, bomb field of all these truths being dropped left and right. And you talked about how you started the shocking answer and it sort of gets interrupted by the Kyle and Camilla stuff. But you have expressed that, like you were genuinely surprised by Kyle revealing this information about him and Camilla working together. Did that change the way you perceive the way final tribal council was going at that moment based on Kyle kind of coming in with this information from the top rope?

[00:58:03] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, I think so. So I brought up the Shaheen vote because they were asking, like, what was the strategic move you made? And for me, I was bringing up that the my component of the Shaheen vote. I wanted to to express that me convincing Joe was my biggest strategic move to convince Joe that his best friend in this game needed to be voted out. That that was the biggest move I made because that was very, very important to how this played out without Joe. It couldn't happen.

[00:58:33] [SPEAKER_03] And Joe wanted to go to the end with Shaheen. And so that was what I was trying to say. Camilla did a great job of cutting me off to then deliver this over to Kyle. And when Kyle dropped that bomb about that, he and Camilla were the secret alliance. It everything flew out of my brain. I forgot to circle back to my point because, yeah, I was devastated. Kyle was literally the person that I, apart from Joe, was closest with. And like in different ways, like Joe and I have a father-daughter type relationship. Kyle and I have a brother-sister.

[00:59:02] [SPEAKER_03] And so finding out that this person I was so close with that he had somebody else, like he had a side chick. Like I was like, what? And so that was really, really tough to find out in the moment. And like my emotions are always on my face. So you could see that I just looked devastated. But I still held on to, I didn't think at that moment that it was like, oh, Kyle's won this. I still held on to the fact that the only thing I prepared going into final tribal was my closing remarks. And I was like, I had, I had rehearsed that in my brain.

[00:59:33] [SPEAKER_03] And I was like, you know what? Like whatever happens, whatever is said, the last word is what's remembered most. And so I was like, he can say this stuff, whatever. I know I have some good points to make here too. Some of those weren't shown. They had to cut out a lot of final tribal. It was amazing final tribal. I got to say, but I know I was like, as long as I can get to do my final remarks last, then I think that I can leave the most lasting impression on the jury.

[00:59:57] [SPEAKER_02] Well, let's finish with some closing remarks of our own, Eva, because look, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I would say that while you are the first openly autistic person to play survivor, you do not represent the entirety of the autism experience. It is a spectrum for a reason. But that said, I think that obviously through a lot of the moments that you had in your time out on the island, you have been able to serve as this representation for autistic people. And it's something that you've done several speaking engagements about. I know you've posted a lot about it on social media.

[01:00:26] [SPEAKER_02] And while I'm sure you expected this to a certain extent when you went onto the show, certainly not to the extent that it ended up becoming. What has this year, the past six months been like for you to become this representation, this symbol almost of something larger than yourself and larger than the game?

[01:00:46] [SPEAKER_03] I think it is very, very timely that I was on survivor right now because there has been a lot of misinformation about what autism is, what it means for a person's life. And so me going on TV and showing what one version of autism is like, autism is a spectrum. So everybody's experience is different. But no matter where someone falls on that spectrum, they can live a full and happy life if they get the support that they need from the people around them.

[01:01:12] [SPEAKER_03] And so I think that me going out there and being vulnerable and showing what my life is like has inspired so many people to accept their autism diagnosis, to speak about their autism diagnosis to those in their lives, to look at their children and not see them as being as having something wrong with them just because they have autism. I've had so many people reach out and tell me that they have had these experiences because of me. And that's so amazing to hear.

[01:01:40] [SPEAKER_03] Like the biggest message I just wanted to get out there was that autism is not something wrong with you. It is something that gives you different challenges than others may experience, but it also gives you great strengths. And I think it's important that now people are focusing on those strengths because they saw the strength in me. So I'm very proud of that. I'm going to keep speaking about autism because it is something that is so important, especially now.

[01:02:01] [SPEAKER_02] Absolutely. Well, listen, you took every step through Fiji with openness and honesty, and you brought that to this conversation as well. So Eva, you know how much I always relish the time that we get the chance to talk in between Oilers losses. It seems to be. Maybe next week it'll be under happier circumstances. This was such an absolute delight. Thank you so much for offering so much context for stuff that we didn't necessarily see, for offering, you know, your own perspectives as to a lot of the decisions that you had to

[01:02:30] [SPEAKER_02] make and ultimately talking about such an incredible journey that you got to take out there on the island. It was an absolute pleasure. If people want to check out anything else that you're doing, anything else that you'd like to plug, how can people do so?

[01:02:43] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. I mean, follow me on Instagram at Eva.erikson. I am still doing my Fiji Hockey Club merch sales. I'm raising money for Minnesota Special Hockey through that, and I'll be closing that up at the end of June here. So make sure you do that before it ends. I'm giving $5 per item sold to Minnesota Special Hockey, which is an amazing organization that gives kids with autism and other special needs the chance to play hockey in an environment built for them. So something I'm very passionate about. And so, yeah, that's the main thing that I'm pushing for right now.

[01:03:13] [SPEAKER_02] One more quick thing I'd be remiss not to ask. Two of your closest allies and one of your other, you know, very good friends in Camilla are out right now playing Survivor 50. I'm sure we'll get your lengthened reaction later on, but what's your immediate thoughts right now as they're off in a very familiar setting playing a very familiar game?

[01:03:31] [SPEAKER_03] I have so much faith in all of them. I know that each of them has a very different and unique game, and I love all of them. I helped all of them prepare for their moments out there. So if Camilla...

[01:03:43] [SPEAKER_02] Only didn't compare notes then, if that's the case.

[01:03:45] [SPEAKER_03] If Camilla looks really strong, it's because I gave her leg workouts. So yeah, no, they're going to do amazing. I hope to see my final four mates all in the final three out there for season 50.

[01:03:57] [SPEAKER_02] There we go. Let's manifest it. Well, we're manifesting more of these post-season interviews from more members of your cast, Eva. But for now, thank you so, so much again. This was an absolute pleasure. Yeah, this was fantastic. Thank you. Of course, of course. Have a good one. Take care. You too.